Brexit and the Consequences

Boris the Menace... Will do anything to obtain more power.

How can this bumbling arrogant self entitled sod can lead this great country leaves me speechless.

Then there is Moggy POS. Another self entitled stuffy knobhead who thinks and believes him self to be soooo smart and wiser than others.

Freaking toss pots, once again bringing parliament and the Tory party to shame.

Just remember these people promised you the world and now bringing you less greatness and more irrellevance.

We live in interesting and challenging sad times. Our leaders leave much to be desired. :(
 
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Interesting read.

In the great tradition of populist leaders, Boris Johnson can no longer tell truth from falsehood​

Patrick Cockburn 11 hrs ago
http://a.msn.com/01/en-gb/AARWgz4?ocid=sf
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When Donald Trump won the US presidential election while lying about almost everything, Boris Johnson expressed deep interest in his success. “He was fascinated by it,” an official in constant contact with Johnson at the time told me. “He kept asking how on earth Trump had got away with it.”

Johnson required no tuition in mendacity since he had practiced it continually throughout his career, but he was nevertheless impressed by Trump’s expertise in selling falsehoods.

Johnson’s own record of duplicity in word and deed is, in my view, unrivalled in British politics: “He has mastered the use of error, omission, exaggeration, diminution, equivocation and flat denial,” wrote Rory Stewart, who was a minister at the Foreign Office when Johnson was foreign secretary, last year. “He has perfected casuistry, circumlocution, false equivalence and false analogy. He is equally adept at the ironic jest, the fib and the grand lie; the weasel word and the half-truth; the hyperbolic lie, the obvious lie, and the bullshit lie – which may inadvertently be true.”

Johnson’s critics are rejoicing at the disastrous Conservative defeat in the North Shropshire by-election. The end of Johnson’s premiership in the coming months looks more and more likely. His possible departure makes it all the more important to ask how far Johnson was the symptom or the cause of a distinct period in British history when false slogans swamped the truth more than previously.

Many put the blame on Johnson’s personal turpitude, rooted in his rule-breaking sense of entitlement bred into him at Eton and in the Bullingdon Club. This argument is briefly convincing until one remembers that British politics has seldom been squeaky clean when it comes to telling the truth. It was three centuries ago that Dr John Arbuthnot wrote his satirical Treatise on the Art of Political Lying which is full of sage and cynical advice that remains fully applicable to the present day.

The failings attributed to Johnson are replicated in leaders all over the world, who never went to Eton and have never heard of the Bullingdon Club. In country after country, from Turkey to Brazil and the US to India, populist nationalist leaders notorious for their systematic aversion to the truth, and the persecution of those who tell it, have been winning elections over the past 10 or more years. Evidently, something has changed in the political landscape of the world that means that lies have become a more important ingredient in political success than they used to be. The Washington Post counted 30,573 false or misleading statements made by Trump during his four years in the White House, but their blatancy and easy refutation appeared to carry no penalty in a politically polarised country where few change their mind, whatever the evidence.

Many are baffled and disgusted by this decline in moral standards, but there are at least four good reasons why this virus-like outbreak of political untruthfulness should have swept through the world. It is rightly associated with the rise of populist nationalist leaders like Johnson, Trump, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, Jair Bolsonaro and Narendra Modi – to name only the better known.

First, the gap between the promises and performance of the new wave of populist nationalists can only be bridged by lies. In the UK, Brexit was sold as a means of making the country stronger and more independent, but it has demonstrably done the opposite. British policy was traditionally to keep the UK united and continental Europe divided, but now the reverse has happened. Such a diminution in British power can only be explained away by denying it and pretending that a new global Britain is in the making. Not that there is anything thing particularly British in these self-glorifying fantasies. Movements seeking national self-determination invariably promise more than they can deliver.

Second, Johnson leads a coalition at the core of which is a party reshaped by the Brexit campaign which created an alliance of prosperous shires and suburbs with deprived, de-industrialised voters. Such combinations, which have sprung up in many countries, have been called “pluto-populist”, combining as they do plutocrats seeking neo-Thatcherite policies, such as lower taxes and a smaller state, with “left behind” voters seeking greater state intervention. This unstable grouping can only be kept together by a stream of contradictory promises from Johnson which means that somebody will end up being betrayed – the winners usually being the plutocrats. Great infrastructural projects – such as HS2 – billed as the cutting edge of “levelling-up” are squeezed by born-again Thatcherites, and genuine plutocrats, like the Chancellor of the Exchequer, Rishi Sunak. “Red Wall” Tory voters have to be satisfied with vague boosterism and post-dated promises

Third, the identity of the populists is defined more than it is in most political movements by demonising opponents and blaming them for all that is wrong. Brussels was scapegoated as the source of Britain’s ills five years ago and remains a favourite target to this day. Trump identified enemies everywhere from Central American immigrants to Hillary Clinton (remember the chants of “lock her up”). Remainers in Britain tended to underestimate the degree to which the Brexit vote had become baked into the sense of identity of voters who had supported it and this was not going to change.

Finally, the internet and 24/7 television news coverage transformed the nature of political campaigning. Johnson and Trump were experts in exploiting this in ways that their opponents had not even considered. With vast oceans of information now available all the time on screens small and large, it is not surprising that lies, fake confrontations, fake facts are deployed to attract attention. The primal sin is to be boring, which Trump and Johnson very seldom are. Trump is obsessed with TV ratings and views accusations of lying by Democrats as giving him more publicity. Dominic Cummings would likewise smirk with self-satisfaction over Remainer criticism of the notoriously untrue claims on the side of a bus about £350m haemorrhaging to the EU.

Compare Johnson’s bumbling but spontaneous delivery to the fluent but robotic tedium of a speech by or an interview with Sir Keir Starmer. Many voters may interpret this as a sign of honesty and a welcome change after Johnson’s buffoonery, but he will struggle to combat a new post-Johnson Tory leader.

With the onset of pandemic, Trump and Johnson took different approaches. Trump doubled down on polarisation while Johnson presented himself as a unifying leader, but in both cases the great weakness of habitual liars came into play. They no longer seem to be able to distinguish truth from falsehood and are incapable of dealing with a real crisis rather than the imaginary threats they invented and exploited. Both leaders showed disastrously poor and indecisive judgement, leading many to die who would have survived under a more competent leader. In Britain, at least, the lies no longer mask the reality.


 
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thank youfor that excellent piece. Rory Stewart is smartandwell seasoned. Like it or not, we are stuck with Bojo's bumbling boobies,and there is no credible opposition in sight. We deserve better from Labour. I could not vote in 2016 as we had no information of any merit about Brexit -and we were not the kick in the pants to the EU that Bojo thought we'd be. We need to unite as a nation, be kind to each other and stop pretending we have anything in common with America.
 
More Wishy Washy Libby Lefty Remoaner Tosh.

The fact is, EU is going backwards without UK as a member.

Triggered Remoaners make me happy.
 
More Wishy Washy Libby Lefty Remoaner Tosh.

The fact is, EU is going backwards without UK as a member.

Triggered Remoaners make me happy.
EU is doing fine without Plague island, don't you know that? WE are the ones who are now a pariah. A laughing stock with one pathetic trade deal with Australia which will bankrupt our farmers. I'm no remoaner, but seriously, Bojo is a dead t*** walking
 
More Wishy Washy Libby Lefty Remoaner Tosh.

The fact is, EU is going backwards without UK as a member.

Triggered Remoaners make me happy.

EU is moving along just fine. As before whether EU flounders or not is immaterial to UK.

I feel some Brexiteers, more interested in European failure irrespective of what happens in the UK.

The actual reality, being neighbours is that who ever does well UK or EU the other party will benefit. This is effectively the remain sentiment and objective.

Brexiteer mindset is I don't care what happens in the UK as long as EU fails.

Finally, much like Trump and Boris, saying all this tosh, doesn't make it so. EU going backwards is NOT FACT. Only wishful fiction. :sneaky:
 
OMG Fancy putting a remainer to replace Lord Frostyarse.


Let's hope sound of reason prevails.

Brexiteers dropping like flies. So where are the promises? 5 years and counting.

All that energy and resources wasted. WASTED on what exactly?

What has changed?

What have Brexiteers achieved?

Be interesting to see what is achieved in another 5 years time.
 
I only trade FTSE Index options but clearly the billions of QE are still rattling around the banks-and all that talk of low interest rates damaging the banks? Hilarious and wrong. Their mark ups are fantastic, their product is gifted to them and even delivered to them for free. FTSE doesn't care about the plague, banks don't care about us-that money could have saved lives -so how about a windfall tax on the greedy banksters as a benefit of Brexit?
 
I only trade FTSE Index options but clearly the billions of QE are still rattling around the banks-and all that talk of low interest rates damaging the banks? Hilarious and wrong. Their mark ups are fantastic, their product is gifted to them and even delivered to them for free. FTSE doesn't care about the plague, banks don't care about us-that money could have saved lives -so how about a windfall tax on the greedy banksters as a benefit of Brexit?

Highly unlikely imo.

One of the hidden reasons for Brexit was allegedly to avoid the financial transactions tax the EU was planning as a way to claw back the billions banks received from taxpayer bailout.

UK being the globes financial hub didn't want to pay any nominal % for the billions they received and thus via farage motor mouth supported this Brexit move.

 
OMG Fancy putting a remainer to replace Lord Frostyarse.


Let's hope sound of reason prevails.

Brexiteers dropping like flies. So where are the promises? 5 years and counting.

All that energy and resources wasted. WASTED on what exactly?

What has changed?

What have Brexiteers achieved?

Be interesting to see what is achieved in another 5 years time.

You need to get with the times dear.

Truss backed the wrong horse back in 2016 and has since become a full on advocate of Brexit. When she was asked recently how she would vote today, she said, in favour of Brexit.

According to Windy, all she has done is sign One crumby trade deal with Australia. This is also total nonsense. Go look it up on the UK gov website, (i'm not doing the work for any of you). We have hundreds of new deals, roll over agreements etc.
 
You need to get with the times dear.

Truss backed the wrong horse back in 2016 and has since become a full on advocate of Brexit. When she was asked recently how she would vote today, she said, in favour of Brexit.

According to Windy, all she has done is sign One crumby trade deal with Australia. This is also total nonsense. Go look it up on the UK gov website, (i'm not doing the work for any of you). We have hundreds of new deals, roll over agreements etc.
I did all sorts of searches for Brexit new deals, post brexit new deals and new international agreements and a bunch of non-deal related stuff comes up.


What search string did you use so I can do some work and be amazed at what I've been missing.

Here's one from your daily trash that supported Brexit. Bit of a turn-coat if you ask me!
 
I did all sorts of searches for Brexit new deals, post brexit new deals and new international agreements and a bunch of non-deal related stuff comes up.


What search string did you use so I can do some work and be amazed at what I've been missing.

Here's one from your daily trash that supported Brexit. Bit of a turn-coat if you ask me!
You dont need to be enthralled or amazed at any of this. It all takes time to work through the channels.

The sky didn't fall in when we left, nothing got worse for everyday folk, the doom mongers were not correct. yada yada yada.

We wont be rejoining, so there's nothing to argue about.

 
I think the cabinet and the tories said this would be the easiest trade deal in history or rather that UK could write them up prior to leaving the EU.

6 years later...

Daaa daaaaaaaaa https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61463207

Boris Johnson is flying to Belfast to try to sort out the consequences of a Brexit deal he signed.

Bumbling baffoon. Was clear from the start what a loafer he is. Utterly totally useless. The guy is an embarrassment to the tory party imho. What a rucksack. Get's carried everywhere. Full of gaseous vapour.
 
I think the cabinet and the tories said this would be the easiest trade deal in history or rather that UK could write them up prior to leaving the EU.

6 years later...

Daaa daaaaaaaaa https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61463207

Boris Johnson is flying to Belfast to try to sort out the consequences of a Brexit deal he signed.

Bumbling baffoon. Was clear from the start what a loafer he is. Utterly totally useless. The guy is an embarrassment to the tory party imho. What a rucksack. Get's carried everywhere. Full of gaseous vapour.
He's not just a bumbling buffoon but, a pathological liar too. The worst PM in my lifetime of almost 80 years.
 
He's not just a bumbling buffoon but, a pathological liar too. The worst PM in my lifetime of almost 80 years.

He does take some beating, doesn't he?

What gets me most is bringing parliament into disrepute. Has the makings of a tyrant.

This is what happens when non-qualified with limited intelligence, bodies are supplied with excess amounts of money and privilege, talk their way into positions they are not fit for.

That Jacob Reece is another knob who speaks loadsa crap without knowing what the fred his going on about. I remember shouting expletives at the TV set watching him tell us prices will fall after Brexit coz we'd be able to make better deals with the rest of the world and buy goods and services cheaper!

I really think these knobs should be hosted on telly and made to listen to their past promises and account for their lies.

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I think we need to train the long term unemployed on how to pick fruit?

One would think the Brexit clever clogs could muster up a plan of sorts between their 5-Mega Minds right?

Well they probably could if they weren't all either trying to give lucrative contracts to their buddies or bonking their secretaries...
 

I think we need to train the long term unemployed on how to pick fruit?

One would think the Brexit clever clogs could muster up a plan of sorts between their 5-Mega Minds right?

Well they probably could if they weren't all either trying to give lucrative contracts to their buddies or bonking their secretaries...
Just as an aside I thought I'd look at employment data, unemployment data and fruit picking jobs.

As we all probably know unemployment is at historically very low levels. The rate of increase in job vacancies is slowing down but there are still more jobs than there are unemployed people to take them.

Fruit picking jobs are advertised as typically 6 days/wk, 8hrs/day. Pay is just over the legal minimum wage. Pay varies by quantities picked plus overtime. Average weekly salaries around £417/wk. Accommodation is available but seems to be of variable quality, and nor is it free. Neither is food. Nor is travel to/from home. This model is tailor-made for foreign migrants. It inherently will not work well for UK-based employees. Simply increasing wages is not going to resolve the issues here.
 
Just as an aside I thought I'd look at employment data, unemployment data and fruit picking jobs.

As we all probably know unemployment is at historically very low levels. The rate of increase in job vacancies is slowing down but there are still more jobs than there are unemployed people to take them.

Fruit picking jobs are advertised as typically 6 days/wk, 8hrs/day. Pay is just over the legal minimum wage. Pay varies by quantities picked plus overtime. Average weekly salaries around £417/wk. Accommodation is available but seems to be of variable quality, and nor is it free. Neither is food. Nor is travel to/from home. This model is tailor-made for foreign migrants. It inherently will not work well for UK-based employees. Simply increasing wages is not going to resolve the issues here.

Hmmm not sure about that Tom, uni students always looking for summer time jobs. Agree, rates of pay poorly for hard labour but for young people who spend money going to a gym and getting tattoos, it's a bargain I reckon.

Saves money on fake tans too.

I did something like this when I was a young lad in Spain. G8 happy times. :love:
 
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