Trading Seminars

[TBS]

I am not "selling" any system, in any way, shape, or form.I leave that for the likes of DW and VS. My approach is ( and always will be) to encourage others to think and analyse for themselves so that they can develop their own systems.

Yes you are. You are charging people 295gbp to come and listen to the details of your personal Dow trading system.

They are not coming to 'think or analyse for themselves', your advert and running order make it absolutely clear that you are going into the specific details of your system.

Granted you may not be selling them the system per se, but you are charging them for the pleasure of listening to you describe your system in detail - which is basically the same thing.

.. or are you about to alter the running schedule again?

What about my other questions?

Why does the title not make it absolutely clear who the audience are?

Why the 25% (my mistake to say 20% in my previous post) 'reduction' for T2W members when the seminar has never been run before and I doubt has been advertised anywhere else? (which is sharp practice at best, illegal claims at worst).

Have you contacted the FSA to make sure you are the right side of their rulings? - or would you prefer to speak to my contacts instead - they would also be interested in the original and secondary adverts, so make sure you have them to hand when you ring them.

It's a pity others don't do the same.

You still don't get it do you.

You created something that was patently wrong. I have already torn the original advert and content to shreads because you weren't going to provide what you claimed. That has now been changed to the current effort. However, yet again it is wrong.

So far your actions have been predictably unprofessional, I don't doubt your sincerity but that is as far as it goes.

As someone who does offer courses/seminars in trading subjects I get very angry with those who produce such a farce that it 'queers the pitch' for those of us that have a genuinely thought out and proven product to offer - at a reasonable price, without fancy 25% gimmicks.

So, do not start with the 'holier than thou' attitude that your parting comment suggests, it is you who are in the wrong - if you weren't perhaps you wouldn't have changed the original advert.

Please answer the questions.

 

[TBS]

TBS. I take it that you won't be attending then?

Difficult to make a decision when I don't know what the seminar is about, the content seems to vary so often.

 

[TBS]

.. oh, and one other question..

This will re-visit basic TA principles from a text book approach and show how those principles are adapted with specific reference to Dow Trading that Martin has used for many years.

How long have you actually been trading (as opposed to theorising) this dow system?

How long have you lived off the proceeds of this system as your main source of income - rather than a 'day job'?

 

[ChartMan]

There is no pleasing you, is there. :cheesy:
Of course, you never made a mistake in your life, did you. And I guess you never held a first seminar either.
No.

 

[Zenda]

Well as ex IFA prior to joining the Oil Industry - If the Seminar is soley based on the Dow then this is construed as "Giving Financial Advice" because it is specific. This is a Criminal offence - Contrary to the FSA - Even VS and DW can get that right!!

 

[BBB]

There's one thing that I just don't get.

If anyone is a successful trader, they will be making quite a tidy sum. Why would anyone need to sell their ideas if they work?

You never see Bill Gates, Richard Branson etc running courses on how to start and run a business do you?

If the reasons were because the 'trader' likes to educate people and benefit from that feeling of altruism and putting something back into the world then fine. But why would they charge money for that (other than costs) because the comparatively small amounts raised from the seminar would be insignificant to the money made by a valid concept.

As Grey1 says - 'I want to rip off the market, not my fellow trader'

 

[TheBramble]

TBS - I didn't know you also ran seminars.

I don't think in these circumstances, it does you any credit to be seen to be so ardently attempting to tear down and discredit 'the competition'.

Regardless of any deliberate or naively inadvertent intent (TBP) on Chartman's part, it might serve all parties better if this issue were taken to PM.

Just a thought.

 

[TBS]

There is no pleasing you, is there. :cheesy:
Of course, you never made a mistake in your life, did you. And I guess you never held a first seminar either.
No.

Ooh, I don't know, I make mistakes every day, some I learn from, others I repeat, if I make them in public I usually do something about it.

I have held plenty of 'first' seminars, tutorials, lectures, presentations with audiences from 1 to 500+, the trick is to make sure you know what you are doing before you go public.

Unfortunately you have chosen to pick a subject that is under heavy regulation and you don't know what those regulations are. Plus you have gone very public without understanding what you are getting into.

If you are going to play a game to the level you want to then you have to learn the rules.

So are you now saying that the whole thing is a mistake and you are cancelling it? or are you going to answer the questions asked?

 

[qaza]

There's one thing that I just don't get.

If anyone is a successful trader, they will be making quite a tidy sum. Why would anyone need to sell their ideas if they work?

You never see Bill Gates, Richard Branson etc running courses on how to start and run a business do you?

If the reasons were because the 'trader' likes to educate people and benefit from that feeling of altruism and putting something back into the world then fine. But why would they charge money for that (other than costs) because the comparatively small amounts raised from the seminar would be insignificant to the money made by a valid concept.

As Grey1 says - 'I want to rip off the market, not my fellow trader'

There must be many traders out there making a modest income from the mkts who would be delighted to sell their knowledge for a few thousand pounds. And I'm sure that there are many wannabe traders who would de delighted to part with £300 if they could gain a similarly modest income.

This business is not only about making mega bucks, for many on this board an extra few hundred pounds a month is all they are looking for

 

[Trader333]

All you need to do to make any FSA issues go away is to say that this is a strategy for use specifically by Spreadbettors and it is then classed the same way as tipsters for Horseracing. The rules then come under "Gaming" and not investing.


Paul

 

[TBS]

TBS - I didn't know you also ran seminars.

I don't think in these circumstances, it does you any credit to be seen to be so ardently attempting to tear down and discredit 'the competition'.

Regardless of any deliberate or naively inadvertent intent (TBP) on Chartman's part, it might serve all parties better if this issue were taken to PM.

Just a thought.

I run a basic TA course about 3 times a year, basically it is an introduction for those that want a basic grounding in the subject.
I also run other courses and have been employed as a trainer on a private basis by City University Business School and a few trading houses and banks.

Here are some comments from some of those that attended last year

http://www.trade2win.co.uk/boards/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4991&perpage=15&pagenumber=1

There is no 'competition' as you put it, I believe I have set out very good reasons why this seminar should be discredited throughout this thread and I have made it very clear why I as a trainer am more that a little irritated by the rather unprofessional way in which it has been put forward.

A public offering has been made for the seminar, it should be discussed in public.

 

[Bigbusiness]

TBS,

I can understand why you want to air these views in public but can't you try pm's first? If that doesn't work, then you can tell us all about it here.

This public slanging match probably wont do your reputation any good either.

 

[eminem]

Chartman, if your charts and strategy is based on the Dow CASH you can't actually trade that (as others have said before) as it is you can only "trade" it via SB companies which is not "investing". That should get round the FSA issue. If in doubt you could also remove the word "Dow" from any charts you present and use them as generic examples of chart patterns/formations.

Yours hopefully, ex-finanical seminar presenter
c/o Wormwood Scrubs.

 

[Zenda]

Trader BBB - you have obviously not had any dealings with the authorities in financial services - Try convincing them - its gambling advice ! Spreadbetting Companies are already worried that Mr Brown has left them alone for a long time - it is why they all adopt a low key profile and try to give the impression they are superior to bookmakers- I fear not much longer! Rumour has it that All UK spreadbetting traders are within the Chancellors Sites!!

Emenem Your the Man!!

 

[FetteredChinos]

Rumour has it that All UK spreadbetting traders are within the Chancellors Sites!!


Gordon Brown runs all the SB companies?? no wonder he can afford such a diverse selection of ties...

 

[BBB]

qaza -

I understand what you are saying.

If however a newbie wants to make a few hundred quid - thats fine. So why not just keep the few hundred quid in the first place? Most basic books will give the reader all he needs to know about TA. There's no need to spend a few hundred quid.

If you really want to be successful however then I'm afraid I have some bad news coming....

You're going to have to put a lot of work and hours in. That applies even if you want to make 'only a few hundred quid'.

You're going to have to find a system that suits you personally, gives you an edge, and reflects the individuals understanding of how the market works. Show a chart to 100 traders and they will all see different things. Anyone who thinks the path to riches or ' a few easy hundred quid' lies in the price of a seminar, book, home study course or what ever is on a hiding to nothing.

I have nothing against ChartMan. It would be stupid of me to knock his ideas or methods - as I dont even know what they are. Even if I did, it could well be that they work for him, not me. If anything, I have respect for him as at least he has the guts to comeback and answer any criticism other members may have.

I just don't agree with the concept of ANYONE selling their methods or stating they will work for anyone else. If they are only ment to provide a grounding, then the student is better off buying a few books for half the price. Should they have any questions, then there is this BB called T2W! The rest my friends is down to the individual and how hard he is prepared to learn.

No free lunches in this life - especially trading.

 

[darrenf]

Rumour has it that All UK spreadbetting traders are within the Chancellors Sites!!

Can you tell us more about these rumours?

 

[TBS]

TBS,

I can understand why you want to air these views in public but can't you try pm's first? If that doesn't work, then you can tell us all about it here.

This public slanging match probably wont do your reputation any good either.

It was a publically offered course, therefore any problems with it should be discussed in public.

I don't consider this a slanging match, purely some statements of fact.

.. you could have pm'd me your concerns...................

 

[TheBramble]

Can you tell us more about these rumours?

Well, if there weren't, there are now...

 

[Zenda]

Wish I could!

Wish I could - perhaps I just started it - however thats not the case - My contacts in Lunnon (source secret and it's not Greg Dyke) working within the industry say theres a chance - because it is regulated under the financial Services Authority - unlike bookmakers (who are not- in many cases ) the reclassification of Spreadbetting companies - is an obvious target. However I'm too busy trading - just moved my stop to place my latest trade into a (Not with my money anymore situation!) hoping for a bearish run down and I will then lower my limit!!