Ukraine invasion

Mumpsimus said:
Wrong. Do more reading.
Click to expand...
I've done plenty of reading on this but I wonder what are your sources. The organisation's own declarations since even before the day of its establishment have made its objective clear, which is the unification of the nations states of Europe into one country. Churchill explicitly called this the "United States of Europe". The EU and its predecessor bodies pull back from giving the final state a name, especially one that so closely reflects the USA's name, which country they abhor of course.

It would be hard to find any statements or actions by the EU and its predecessor bodies that declare that the United States of Europe is NOT their objective.

Of course, there are plenty of such declarations by national politicians in many countries who valued membership and did not wish to alarm and mobilise their citizens against such a submergence of their own sovereignty.
 
I am pro United States of Europe.
What is the alternative?
Call the US as cop every time?
Be bullied by Russia or China?
 
CavaliereVerde said:
I am pro United States of Europe.
What is the alternative?
Call the US as cop every time?
Be bullied by Russia or China?
Click to expand...
I am pro-United Kingdom.
The alternative is on-going membership of NATO, plus such other military alliances as are appropriate, and even membership of the UN is better than non-membership.
I have no faith that the EU or whatever it will be called in some years' time will act decisively with military force where the UK would consider this the best option.
Whatever happens, I am unwilling to be ruled in my own country by foreigners.
 
TheNewbieTrader said:
Very tough situation at the moment, and I don't see it getting resolved any time soon. Putin is a crazy man.
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I think it will be resolved in 3 months.
Let's wait the reaction of Russian people when they wont' be paid their monthly salary.
Russia is very close to bankruptcy.
 
tomorton said:
I am pro-United Kingdom.
The alternative is on-going membership of NATO, plus such other military alliances as are appropriate, and even membership of the UN is better than non-membership.
I have no faith that the EU or whatever it will be called in some years' time will act decisively with military force where the UK would consider this the best option.
Whatever happens, I am unwilling to be ruled in my own country by foreigners.
Click to expand...

RACIST :LOL:
 
CavaliereVerde said:
I am pro United States of Europe.
What is the alternative?
Call the US as cop every time?
Be bullied by Russia or China?
Click to expand...
If Europe ever wants to be taken seriously on the world stage then they need to get their act together. Like a certain Donald J Trump told them. Funny how Germany has suddenly come to the realisation that the US is not coming to the rescue and that a major threat is very close to home.

In the mean time, there are no serious credible EU forces to bring to bear.
Frankly, EU is a joke.
 
No way back for Putin. His tactical incompetence is staggering. The west has also overestimated Russia's capability and resolve. Expect forces from within to rid Russia of this menace.

The only danger to the world is a cornered Putin and the nuclear option. Then we will find out if he is insane or not.

Not excusing the west's pathetic leaders in any way. They are another total shower of sh1t.
 
counter_violent said:
No way back for Putin. His tactical incompetence is staggering. The west has also overestimated Russia's capability and resolve. Expect forces from within to rid Russia of this menace.

The only danger to the world is a cornered Putin and the nuclear option. Then we will find out if he is insane or not.

Not excusing the west's pathetic leaders in any way. They are another total shower of sh1t.
Click to expand...
Its possible that the gritty Ukrainian defence of their homeland against heavy odds will be gauged to have saved the people of Taiwan.

If the invasion of Ukraine goes badly enough it is increasingly possible that Ukraine will be able to mount a concentrated counter-attack with armoured forces. This would need to be supported by air power. If this starts to gain ground, it becomes increasingly possible Putin will use tactical nuclear weaponry. Its unlikely these will be directed at centres of population, as at Hiroshima and Nagasaki. It was long speculated during the Cold War that the side that would use nuclear weapons first would be the side losing a conventional battle, and their deployment would be battlefield, not strategic. Expect the usual voices to holler out that this is the end of the world and that nuclear weapons must be disabled immediately.

Either way, the supply of jets to Ukraine beefs up their offensive capability and brings nuclear weapon usage closer. The supply of ground-to-air and anti-tank missiles on the other hand is defensive and the more Stingers we can get to Kiev the better.
 
Russia's problems and responses to perceived threats will end up changing the country for ever. China's global influence and dominance continues unchecked. (handed to them on a plate)

Trump was right again. China was and is the issue. Russia pales into insignificance by comparison.

www.bbc.co.uk

War in Ukraine: Russia soon unable to pay its debts, warns agency

Russia will soon be in a position where it is unable to pay its debts, says Fitch Ratings.
www.bbc.co.uk
 
Rinse repeat strategy...

Iraq uses chemical weapons on Iran offensive killing 00s of 000s. Atrocities of US and UK in ME.

UK's Thatcher, gave the WMD weapon to Saddam. Release him to use it against Iranians and Kurds.
Then invade the country, after he destroys them, claiming he had WMD.

Insane abuse of human rights.

These are the very people who claim to uphold democracy and protect a free World.

 
counter_violent said:
No way back for Putin. His tactical incompetence is staggering. The west has also overestimated Russia's capability and resolve. Expect forces from within to rid Russia of this menace.

The only danger to the world is a cornered Putin and the nuclear option. Then we will find out if he is insane or not.

Not excusing the west's pathetic leaders in any way. They are another total shower of sh1t.
Click to expand...

LOL.

Russia going in gently and slowly.

Not a mistake.

Efforts to avoid destruction and deaths.
 
Atilla said:
Rinse repeat strategy...

Iraq uses chemical weapons on Iran offensive killing 00s of 000s. Atrocities of US and UK in ME.

UK's Thatcher, gave the WMD weapon to Saddam. Release him to use it against Iranians and Kurds.
Then invade the country, after he destroys them, claiming he had WMD.

Insane abuse of human rights.

These are the very people who claim to uphold democracy and protect a free World.

Click to expand...
This wouldn't surprise me in the slightest. After all, it was the US who outsourced the gain of function bio weapon research program to China. It might also explain the Hunter Biden ongoing saga.
Did I ever mention that Faucci is up to his neck in it !
 
counter_violent said:
. . . Expect forces from within to rid Russia of this menace. . .
Click to expand...
Hi c_v,
Unlikely IMO, as Putin's approval ratings are up and most Russians support the war - although that's not what Russian state media calls it.

As far back as 2008, CIA Director William Burns sent a memo to the US Secretary of State before NATO’s 2008 Bucharest Summit, in which he said: "Ukrainian entry into NATO is the brightest of all red lines for the Russian elite (not just Putin). In more than two and a half years of conversations with key Russian players, from knuckle-draggers in the dark recesses of the Kremlin to Putin’s sharpest liberal critics, I have yet to find anyone who views Ukraine in NATO as anything other than a direct challenge to Russian interests." If you're interested, the quote comes from this excellent newsletter:

Mentioning NATO does not make you a "Putin apologist"​

I know the argument is that when sanctions hit then ordinary Russians will turn against Putin. Personally, I wouldn't bet on it: they're just as likely to dig in and put two fingers up to the west. Besides which, sanctions will hurt us in the west just as much as they hurt the Russians. In the meantime, as expected, the alliance between Russia and China grows ever stronger. Germany will really suffer when the gas stops flowing, but Putin won't as he'll easily find alternative customers who would much rather be nice 'n toasty than freezing their brass monkeys off while occupying the moral high ground.
Tim.
 
timsk said:
Hi c_v,
Unlikely IMO, as Putin's approval ratings are up and most Russians support the war - although that's not what Russian state media calls it.

As far back as 2008, CIA Director William Burns sent a memo to the US Secretary of State before NATO’s 2008 Bucharest Summit, in which he said: "Ukrainian entry into NATO is the brightest of all red lines for the Russian elite (not just Putin). In more than two and a half years of conversations with key Russian players, from knuckle-draggers in the dark recesses of the Kremlin to Putin’s sharpest liberal critics, I have yet to find anyone who views Ukraine in NATO as anything other than a direct challenge to Russian interests." If you're interested, the quote comes from this excellent newsletter:

Mentioning NATO does not make you a "Putin apologist"​

I know the argument is that when sanctions hit then ordinary Russians will turn against Putin. Personally, I wouldn't bet on it: they're just as likely to dig in and back and put two fingers up to the west. Besides which, sanctions will hurt us in the west just as much as they hurt the Russians. In the meantime, as expected, the alliance between Russia and China grows ever stronger. Germany will really suffer when the gas stops flowing, but Putin will easily find alternative customers who would much rather be nice 'n toasty than freezing their brass monkeys off while occupying the moral high ground.
Tim.
Click to expand...

There's only so much chaos that can be managed. I don't see Putin as capable of dealing with it. Only 2 weeks in, Imagine what it will be like for him in 2 months !
 
West is simply damaging its own interests imo.

India and China with phenomenal populations looking to uplift their standard of living to that of West's level... Growth will be in the BRIC nations not the West.

Economic sanctions never work and much ado about nothing.

US Dollar standard will collapse and fall like a heap of dung. Raise interest rates and see what the outcome is. Inflation already roaring ahead.

Ukraine is of no interest to US other than to be a thorn on side of Russia.

The situation will be managed. Russia will excel. NATO only acts to defend US interests. This is clear for everyone to see.

Germans will switch camp.

Macron and the French already having secret meetings with the Russians to support them and win favours. That'll be the response for US and UK shagging (scrapping) France over Australia submarine deal.

I'm absolutely astounded by how far heads are up US rectum. Russia simply addressing foolish Ukrainian act to join NATO. Ukraine with a diverse population, how was this mad decision made, needs to be investigated imo.

Not like they didn't know the consequences? I wonder what assurances they were given?

Anyhow, peace and stability will come back again and those who want to leave Ukraine can do so.

Here is a bit of balance to some really bizare reporting on developments. https://www.republicworld.com/world...-it-in-constitution-zelensky-articleshow.html
 
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