TWI

Senior member
2,536 254
therefore the holy grail in a realistic scenario must mean consistently profitable as opposed to consistently winning

I would call that a consistently profitable trading system rather than "the holy grail". I would expect something miraculous from a holy grail if such existed, which it does not.
 

andycan

Established member
630 28
literally speaking its a myth but we all know in this case it means something else
it means to achieve perfection or thats what most believe it to mean
perfections is unrealistic but to make money is not but then again for those that dont make money or are trying to, the thought of making money consistently would probably be looked upon as a 'holy grail'
 

Pat494

Legendary member
14,621 1,578
andycan said:
The holy grail i hasten to add would have to mean perfection.
and as it stands its pretty unlikely anyone over a meaningful period of time would be able to achieve this.
Thus the question needs to be raised whether the holy grail is the end result of money or perfect trades.
we know perfect trades though a romantic notion is not realistic but we can achieve profitable trading accounts without having to achieve 100% success rate on trades
therefore the holy grail in a realistic scenario must mean consistently profitable as opposed to consistently winning

How true of life generally I think. One strives to inch nearer and nearer to perfection knowing that it is not possible to ever achieve it. In many cases without even realizing it.
Some even strive in the perfection of evil.
 

trendie

Legendary member
6,840 1,398
Pat494 said:
How true of life generally I think. One strives to inch nearer and nearer to perfection knowing that it is not possible to ever achieve it. In many cases without even realizing it.
Some even strive in the perfection of evil.

the holy grail could be recognising and accepting there is no perfection, and accepting the reality for what it is, rather than what we wish it to be.
 

Pat494

Legendary member
14,621 1,578
One should imho have goals/targets in life or living devolves into merely existing. The journey in life is to attain something or get part way to perfection. It gives energy and purpose to life.
I aim for 100% success in trading, even while knowing its not possible. It is however possible to get better and better at it. There lies the fascination of trading for me and perhaps for you.........
 

Charlton

Experienced member
1,501 325
dc2000 said:
Trading is a business its not personal
dc2000

You are right - it should be a business for it to be successful, and psychological/emotional baggage should not be a part.

The problem is that many are not consistently successful. Whether the reasons are related to the process of analysis of the markets, the execution of the trades, risk analysis, money management or psychological reasons that interfere with these have all been discussed on other threads, so I won't go into further detail here.

In essence, as you say, it is a business, so perhaps we should think about what would be the Holy Grail for any business and see if it applies here

Charlton
 

chump

Senior member
2,212 274
"for any business and see if it applies here".....LOL you are closer than you possibly know with that one.....let's think in terms of a client base that rarely questioned the value in the transaction . Now do we know any market with those characteristics :eek:
 
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CYOF

Experienced member
1,114 32
Pat494 said:
One should imho have goals/targets in life or living devolves into merely existing. The journey in life is to attain something or get part way to perfection. It gives energy and purpose to life.
I aim for 100% success in trading, even while knowing its not possible. It is however possible to get better and better at it. There lies the fascination of trading for me and perhaps for you.........

Hmm, I was going to post the attached document over in the Psychology Section as per my last post, but maybe this is the place for it.

As the saying goes: A Picture Speaks A Thousand Words
 

timsk

Legendary member
7,600 2,375
CYOF said:
As the saying goes: A Picture Speaks A Thousand Words
CYOF,
Indeed it does, although the white out type is hard to read!
It's interesting (to me) that you end on 'Continuous Improvement'. I am always bemused by all the excitement caused by 'Vendors' on this site. Without wishing to take the thread off on a well worn tangent, I'm mindful of a term any professional folk will be very familiar with: 'Continual Professional Development' - CPD. Even when I'm trading full time (soon, I hope) and I've got more wonga than a person heavily laden with muchos wonga, I'll still continue to go on courses, be they freebies offered by brokers or private traders offering high priced 1-2-1's. Obviously, there are some rip off merchants out there and care must be taken to ensure that one's money is well spent - regardless of how much one has to throw around. Caveat emptor and all that. Me, I want to know what you know, and you over there, and YOU as well! Some knowledge comes my way for free (thank you T2W members!) and some I have to pay for. That's life: swings and roundabouts.

Viz a viz the grail; this implies something static, something timeless. Once you are able to harness the magic of the grail, then you are immortal and beyond harms reach. Dream on! The market is not static and you are not immortal. What works today may not necessarily work tomorrow. This is a dynamic environment in which we are playing, where the socio economic and political sands are forever shifting. Don't stand still; keep moving (forward!), keep learning. Yes, I believe there is a holy grail and, like a Russian doll, there is a smaller parcel inside a smaller parcel inside a smaller parcel, etc. Eventually, you get to what must, surely, be the very last one. Carefully, you unwrap the cool, shiny slim object and study it intently. What you see is a microcosm of the market as a whole, all of what it hopes for and fears, neatly rolled up into one very special package: YOU!

Okay, so I've enjoyed a glass or two of wine this evening, but am I wrong . . .?
;)
Tim.
 

CYOF

Experienced member
1,114 32
Yes Tim,

The white text was intentional - one has to look closely to read it - makes one think a little :cheesy:

There are many successful business models out there that large successful companies use - and one of the main focus areas is in CI - or CPD, and many other naming conventions - but all are more or less singing off the same hymn sheet.

lets take a look at Microsoft - the most successful business model there is.

A key to the success of Microsoft has been their development of the Microsoft Solutions Framework - the MSF model.

The MSF model is the most successful model for implementing IT solutions - and has also been used by many industries outside of the IT sector.

Have to go now - so I will pick up later.

Regards,
 

new_trader

Legendary member
6,665 1,489
equtrader said:
We aren't dealing with metaphysics or psychology here. A Grail is a Grail regardless of whether someone doesn't succeed with it. Someone else will.

Joe

Isn't this somewhat of a contradiction? If a Grail is a Grail then anyone should succeed with it, shouldn't they? What is the difference between the "someone" that doesn't succeed with it and the "Someone else" that will?
 

new_trader

Legendary member
6,665 1,489
equtrader said:
We aren't dealing with metaphysics or psychology here. A Grail is a Grail regardless of whether someone doesn't succeed with it. Someone else will.

Joe

Isn't this somewhat of a contradiction? If a Grail is a Grail then anyone should succeed with it, shouldn't they? What is the difference between the "someone" that doesn't succeed with it and the "Someone else" that will?
 
 
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