Praying won't help you...

[mrsoul]

So what we have here is tar who is somewhat (but not very) knowledgeable in Islam, a bunch of other people who are completely clueless as to the history and evolution of the three major Abrahamic monotheistic (and I use the term loosely) religions although some people seem versed in eastern philosophy. I'd also go as far as to say that I doubt anyone has read two of the major books if even one. We also have a bunch of steadfast atheists.

to use trading as a metaphor, this convo is about as advanced as the first steps 5m ema crossover threads.

I really can't understand how people who have hardly committed to studying something can have such strong opinions and hold their unscholarly(?) opinions with such high regard and steadfast conviction.

I also don't understand why people automatically associate atheism with intelligence. Just goes to show that people who think that way know neither science nor religion.

IMO this conversation would probably have been a lot more interesting if people discussed why they believed what they believed rather than talking smack about other beliefs and why they are wrong. Same old "facts" ("Blah blah blah war!" "blah blah blah darwin is b0llox" "blah blah blah you just die") and no more understanding of others.



Mr Hoggums, you just reeled of a list of human emotions and conditions and gave an example of human reasoning. One of the fundamental teachings of religion is that as the whole human experiences is defined by the world we feel (as a result of our bodies and chemicals/hormones and our succeptability to emotion... basically being human) and observe (both philisophical and physically) we can never truly comprehend God as not only does He(as dogma dictates He should be referred) exist beyond our universe and beyond our observation. He is also capable of creating the universe(s?) by some as yet unknown means, also orchestrating pre-destination on a sub-atomic level therin (trivia: see newtons third law of motion & pre-destination). As such, trying to understand His actions, motives and/or basically "why anything" rather than the "how" is a redundant pursuit.

I believed in God because I'm comfortable with not being able to understand everything and I don't always need an answer.
Not a perfect analogy but do you think the fly by Mr Rothschilds desk knows why he's long weapons stocks?

Atheists are people who have not done their homework.
If atheists take the the time to explore the fact that God must exist in order for you to exist, then the atheist argument falls flat.
The atheist argument is like a newbie trader claiming that he has the Holy Grail without having done any research.
Basically, the atheists claim that because they can't figure out how to prove that God exists that, therefore, God must not exist.
This is an unsound argument.

If it weren't for God, there would be no atheists.

 

[superfly]

By using the word God in some way we are accepting that this being is concious and superior to us.
In the Hindu scriptures which are far ahead of understanding the universe and life, than any of the monothesist religions (Judiasm Christanity and Islam)
It says that God may just be a figurement of mans imagination
and we need this super power to give out lives meaning.

Mr Gamma
Thanks

 

[Trader333]

Basically, the atheists claim that because they can't figure out how to prove that God exists that, therefore, God must not exist.

That may be the case for some but not for many very highly educated people. Most of the scientists who do not believe in God do so because they argue that there is a lack of evidence to prove that God exists from a purely scientific standpoint.


Paul

 

[mb325]

mrsoul, if you, or any believer in god, are prepared to believe 'the fact' that god must exist in order for you to exist, then what happens if you apply your own argument from above to this statement?

If God must exist in order for you to exist, then who or what exists in order for God to exist? When would this chain of A exists in order for B to exist in order for C to exist stop?

 

[mrsoul]

mrsoul, if you, or any believer in god, are prepared to believe 'the fact' that god must exist in order for you to exist, then what happens if you apply your own argument from above to this statement?

If God must exist in order for you to exist, then who or what exists in order for God to exist? When would this chain of A exists in order for B to exist in order for C to exist stop?

God is eternal.
He always existed and will always exist. He had no beginning and has no end.
The same is true of the infinite universe; it had no beginning and has no end; it always existed and will always exist.

 

[Atilla]

God is eternal.
He always existed and will always exist. He had no beginning and has no end.
The same is true of the infinite universe; it had no beginning and has no end; it always existed and will always exist.

Here is your universe...

A hamster will continue running on a wheel forever and ever not realising it's beginning or its final end - but ultimately knows the wheel has always been in its cage and will continue to be there after it dies...


Why not pop your head out and have luk outside the wheel. :cheesy:

 

[Atilla]

So what we have here is tar who is somewhat (but not very) knowledgeable in Islam, a bunch of other people who are completely clueless as to the history and evolution of the three major Abrahamic monotheistic (and I use the term loosely) religions although some people seem versed in eastern philosophy. I'd also go as far as to say that I doubt anyone has read two of the major books if even one. We also have a bunch of steadfast atheists.

to use trading as a metaphor, this convo is about as advanced as the first steps 5m ema crossover threads.

I really can't understand how people who have hardly committed to studying something can have such strong opinions and hold their unscholarly(?) opinions with such high regard and steadfast conviction.

I also don't understand why people automatically associate atheism with intelligence. Just goes to show that people who think that way know neither science nor religion.

IMO this conversation would probably have been a lot more interesting if people discussed why they believed what they believed rather than talking smack about other beliefs and why they are wrong. Same old "facts" ("Blah blah blah war!" "blah blah blah darwin is b0llox" "blah blah blah you just die") and no more understanding of others.



Mr Hoggums, you just reeled of a list of human emotions and conditions and gave an example of human reasoning. One of the fundamental teachings of religion is that as the whole human experiences is defined by the world we feel (as a result of our bodies and chemicals/hormones and our succeptability to emotion... basically being human) and observe (both philisophical and physically) we can never truly comprehend God as not only does He(as dogma dictates He should be referred) exist beyond our universe and beyond our observation. He is also capable of creating the universe(s?) by some as yet unknown means, also orchestrating pre-destination on a sub-atomic level therin (trivia: see newtons third law of motion & pre-destination). As such, trying to understand His actions, motives and/or basically "why anything" rather than the "how" is a redundant pursuit.

I believed in God because I'm comfortable with not being able to understand everything and I don't always need an answer.
Not a perfect analogy but do you think the fly by Mr Rothschilds desk knows why he's long weapons stocks?

Do you know what the last thing that goes through a fly's mind as it hits your windscreen at 70mph? :cheesy:

 

[searchlight]

Mr Hoggums, we can never truly comprehend God as not only does He(as dogma dictates He should be referred) exist beyond our universe and beyond our observation. He is also capable of creating the universe(s?) by some as yet unknown means, also orchestrating pre-destination on a sub-atomic level therin (trivia: see newtons third law of motion & pre-destination). As such, trying to understand His actions, motives and/or basically "why anything" rather than the "how" is a redundant pursuit.

I believed in God because I'm comfortable with not being able to understand everything and I don't always need an answer.
Not a perfect analogy but do you think the fly by Mr Rothschilds desk knows why he's long weapons stocks?

Hi TF,
What you are basically saying is that ; You can never truly comprehend god and he exist beyond your universe and beyond your observation and he also capable of creating the universe(s?) by some as yet unknown means that you naturally don't understand.

So you gave up trying to understand his action , motives and choose to be fly in his desk. That is fine, if it is works for you.

I would rather take 5M EMA crossover instead. Which I can comprehend, observe and know; how it is created and why, and the purpose it serves.

searchlight.

 

[mb325]

God is eternal.
He always existed and will always exist. He had no beginning and has no end.
The same is true of the infinite universe; it had no beginning and has no end; it always existed and will always exist.

Prove any one of these statements.

 

[rathcoole_exile]

I rather think it's up to you to disprove them .....

 

[rathcoole_exile]

God's a Prod and hates Taigs

 

[mrsoul]

Prove any one of these statements.

If there was a brick wall that signifyed the end of the universe, there would always be more universe on the other side of that wall. Therefore, the universe is infinite.

 

[arabianights]

Amateurs. Allow me to prove that god is a banana using LOGIC

1. God is NOT a banana
2. Statement 3 is true
3. One, and only one, of the above statements is true

 

[rathcoole_exile]

you're Long Fyffes ?

 

[rathcoole_exile]

God's a Prod and hates Taigs

and 'Slims

 

[rathcoole_exile]

I've said it before on this forum - but I have no time for someone/something who is so conceited and vain he insists we gather together once a week to tell him and sing to him about how wonderful he is.

To any truely enlightened being, this would be unnecessary and irrelevant.

you sound like a true Presbyterian ......

 

[mb325]

Is statement 3 true??? I just googled 'how old is the universe' and it seems it is estimated to be between 13-20 billion years old.

 

[Trader333]

The same is true of the infinite universe; it had no beginning and has no end; it always existed and will always exist.

There is very strong scientific evidence to show that the universe is not eternal and had a definite beginning. You surprise me with this statement because if it is true it is counter to a God creating it.


Paul

 

[Atilla]

God = Zer0 !!!



Tu capish



De nada !!!

 

[ian]

Is statement 3 true??? I just googled 'how old is the universe' and it seems it is estimated to be between 13-20 billion years old.

That would depend on which universe your talking about - there could be more.
:smart: