Index Spread Betting

top trader said:
long RIO at 4863p, £1/point
Click to expand...
Posted Thursday 7th @ 14:48

top trader said:
long rio at 4835p, £1/point.
total £2
Click to expand...
Posted Thursday 7th @ 15:19

Have been a great admirer of your posts since you started and would like to say well done in getting your account from 5k to what it is now since you started almost 2 months ago. Apologise for interupting you but I have question thats reared it's head.

I noticed this RIO trade that was allowed to slowly trickle offside to around 4465 on the 12th aprox 13:05 which would have made your two trades about 385pts offside and would equate to aprox £770 loss at that point. You then closed out yesterday 14th @08:17 for just £21 profit. Risk to reward is off the scale.



Question is, how far offside do you allow a trade to go before enough is enough and what is your stop loss policy?

Thanks.
 
Lee-
Sorry for the delayed reply.
As you know RIO and all other miners are very volatile. They move 3-5% in a day. when i bought RIO I was hoping to get QUICK (as you must have worked it out bu now) £100-£150. It didn't. As you said it went down to -£770. Therefore as with all my other trades if anything goes against me I close it as soon as it breaks even.

I am still long in IPR. In my other account I closed it flat at 394.5p (but failed to close it here).
I traded again few more times on friday when it was around 384p and managed to get enough profit (because with other account my gearing is over 10%). In this account I have rarely been trading over 3 times, if I did the result would have been even better but then again I am happy with it. Once the whole market settles down I will.

GOOD LUCK with your trading.

I don't mind either you or others posting their trades and ideas here.
 
Thanks for clearing that up.

I keep watching with amazement, this is the field I grew up in. I started papertrading when I was just 12/13 years old as it was what my father done and still does to a small degree. Opened trading account through him at 17 and preceded to get my own account at 18. Moved into indices around 4 years ago and a few times a year take the odd trade in companies.

I dont post my trades in open forum as everyone has their own style and way of doing things and one thing I've found from past experiences is that people start scrutinising and becoming nasty, and this I found are from people that dont trade or have just started out and are either with the mindset that it must be b8llocks due to them losing so much or bulshiness due to them making rediculous amounts in a very short time.

I post like you on my blog on the profile page but only on a weekly basis with screenshots of weekly trades for verification purposes as well as areas I'm looking for. Please feel free to look.

In the meantime, I wish you well and will keep watching.
 
Hi Toptrader,

Sorry to pester you again but you did welcome my initial question on offside trades so here are two more queries:

Following on from my last post that you kindly responded (but avoided the question). I have now seen two more trades that have been grossly off side with regards to risk to reward and in the ratio of around -3 (minus three), risk to reward should be around +3 (plus three). Still not satisfied, I sit and wonder how long off side you allow it to go before calling it a day and closing the trade. I also wonder if you have something special or over the last 2 months have been relying solely on luck within a trading range. If I must admit, I'm starting to feel its the latter.

There has also been no trading posts from you since these got tied up,( i missed you) I'm wondering if one day you get tied up in another trade and we never see you again when the range breaks. Maybe your margin was tied up to a level you feel comfortable, either way the margin would have been put to better use elsewhere.


Here's the two offenders:

Xstrata (XTA) Long @2939 for £2pp on 08:43(GMT) 15-08-08

Trailed to 2755 @08:00 19-08-08 meaning 184pts offside or £368(minus)

Then closed today for just £106 (53pts) @ r=(-3)


International Power Plc (IPR) Long @394.8 for £30pp on 14:48(GMT) 14-08-08

Trailed to 375.6 @09:10 18-08-08 meaning 19.2pts offside or £-576(minus)

Still offside from today by aprox 13.8pts (at time of writing) equals £-414(minus)

Then added £20 to IPR today @381.2 as an average down method to be used only if conviction in trade as oppose to many that chase lost profits only to eventually lose out.

IPR is currently trading around 380. Both trades now offside.


Heres the question:

(original) How long do you allow a trade to go offside before calling it a day?

and now in addition:

What is your stop loss policy?

Thanks in advance and I look forward to your continued success.
 
With regards to IPR:



Am posting this chart to use at a later date without the need to use hindsight.



I am raising no questions with this graph at this current point in time, it is here for reference only for a future date and is posted in no way as to influence, hinder or aid yours or anyone else's trading in International Power plc (IPR).


Lee Shepherd
 

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Lee Shepherd said:
Hi Toptrader,

Sorry to pester you again but you did welcome my initial question on offside trades so here are two more queries:

Following on from my last post that you kindly responded (but avoided the question). I have now seen two more trades that have been grossly off side with regards to risk to reward and in the ratio of around -3 (minus three), risk to reward should be around +3 (plus three). Still not satisfied, I sit and wonder how long off side you allow it to go before calling it a day and closing the trade. I also wonder if you have something special or over the last 2 months have been relying solely on luck within a trading range. If I must admit, I'm starting to feel its the latter.

There has also been no trading posts from you since these got tied up,( i missed you) I'm wondering if one day you get tied up in another trade and we never see you again when the range breaks. Maybe your margin was tied up to a level you feel comfortable, either way the margin would have been put to better use elsewhere.


Here's the two offenders:

Xstrata (XTA) Long @2939 for £2pp on 08:43(GMT) 15-08-08

Trailed to 2755 @08:00 19-08-08 meaning 184pts offside or £368(minus)

Then closed today for just £106 (53pts) @ r=(-3)


International Power Plc (IPR) Long @394.8 for £30pp on 14:48(GMT) 14-08-08

Trailed to 375.6 @09:10 18-08-08 meaning 19.2pts offside or £-576(minus)

Still offside from today by aprox 13.8pts (at time of writing) equals £-414(minus)

Then added £20 to IPR today @381.2 as an average down method to be used only if conviction in trade as oppose to many that chase lost profits only to eventually lose out.

IPR is currently trading around 380. Both trades now offside.


Heres the question:

(original) How long do you allow a trade to go offside before calling it a day?

and now in addition:

What is your stop loss policy?

Thanks in advance and I look forward to your continued success.
Click to expand...

Market will take them back , it is like betting at odds ( 1.1 ) u will win most of the time but one loss will erase 10 profitable trades ,, we need an edge and it is difficult to have an edge especially we pay extra spread , but not impossible , i guess !!
 
Lee and tar: I wondered about stops when this thread first started and tt did reply, but some more elucidation would help.
 
i am happy with my positions in IPR. EVENTHOUGH it suppose to be a safe share, you never know what happens next. of my other trading accounts i ALWAYS come out by averaging out. once at breakeven I closed it. this is, i must confess,because i have deep pocket. so in case something goes wrong i put more money in. i am working here on the same basis but trading on a 2 0r 3 times gearing. i know it is very dangerous strategy but it has been working for me for last 10 years. this is because i ALWAYS take out profit on a very regular basis. useful in rainy days.

as i said before i have 10% stop/loss policy which is very high. since i went long in IPR the performance has gone down a bit but i am not worried. it will come back.

i hope i have answered most of your queries.

closed £20/point IPR for net +£49.

long RR. AT 368.3P, £20/POINT.
 
Last edited:
at the moment IPR is at 384p which is 11p down, costing me -£330, not much since pot value at the moment stands at £8402 in just over 2 months from 5k.

edit- in my other account i am long in rr.,bay,pru,rbs and barc. in all i will close them for reasonable profit. i traded IPR saveral times this week for few percentage profit, sometimes for less than a tenner.
 
Last edited:
IPR recovering nicely in a weak market, 388.25p at the moment.
BP. looking good for a long position, 510.25p at the mo.
 
In my other account I closed all others (RR.,BARC,PRU and RBS longs except, BAY) ahead of long weekend. BAY did reach in profit yesterday but wasn't much ££s to close.
 
IPR closed for - £120.
nothing open.
pot value £8549

i am going away on holidays (due to unavoidable circumtances) for probably 2 months this weekend therefore i will not trade in this account as much (probably few deals). still 3 more days to go.

i am going to keep on trading in my another account with reduce frequency.

good luck to all and trade safe.
 
Personal question : do u make living from trading ? do u trade anything else but uk shares ?
 
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