UK Politics

Pat494 said:
Seems silly to me that people getting huge pensions are generally those that are rich enough already. While the vast majority of pensioners have to suffer the cold, damp one room housing in grotty areas. Shame on the politicians for not doing enough about it.
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Pat - The idea that most pensioners are living in poverty hasn't been true for many years. All measures of poverty are relative to the average or the mean of what other people's incomes are but the percentage of pensioners in poverty is lower than the other age groups in the population.
fullfact.org

Poverty in the UK: a guide to the facts and figures - Full Fact

How many people are in poverty in the UK, and how has this been changing in recent years?
fullfact.org fullfact.org
 
tomorton said:
Pat - The idea that most pensioners are living in poverty hasn't been true for many years. All measures of poverty are relative to the average or the mean of what other people's incomes are but the percentage of pensioners in poverty is lower than the other age groups in the population.
fullfact.org

Poverty in the UK: a guide to the facts and figures - Full Fact

How many people are in poverty in the UK, and how has this been changing in recent years?
fullfact.org fullfact.org
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You know my disclaimer is going to be calling out fullfact as being less than full of facts (as we have seen on a few occasions) and therefore anything presented by them is to be taken with a pinch of salt.

The SMC whilst claiming to be non-partisan, has a host of NGO, charity and individuals behind it, and therefore (without doing the diligence needed) I would consider the report to be anything but non-partisan.

Having said that it would have been much more informative for some £££ figures to be provided alongside the waffle and I would then be able to make my own rather simplistic judgment on where the poverty line lies, unfortunately, they have not managed to do that and instead have stated that one man's poverty is another man's rich, so it depends, leaving us no better off in terms of knowledge or being able to understand who is poor and who is not!
 
Signalcalc said:
You know my disclaimer is going to be calling out fullfact as being less than full of facts (as we have seen on a few occasions) and therefore anything presented by them is to be taken with a pinch of salt.

The SMC whilst claiming to be non-partisan, has a host of NGO, charity and individuals behind it, and therefore (without doing the diligence needed) I would consider the report to be anything but non-partisan.

Having said that it would have been much more informative for some £££ figures to be provided alongside the waffle and I would then be able to make my own rather simplistic judgment on where the poverty line lies, unfortunately, they have not managed to do that and instead have stated that one man's poverty is another man's rich, so it depends, leaving us no better off in terms of knowledge or being able to understand who is poor and who is not!
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The figures they quote are not their own research, and I haven't heard of their source data being challenged. Of course, any body in politics gets caught out from time to time in using data selectively and using sources which are later discredited or contradicted by better research. That's life.

But on this issue is your point that you don't want to read what fullfact put up because they put it up or that they have put up incorrect conclusions?
 
I do hope that Labour and the LibDems don't watch this because, if they do AND they act on it, there's a chance they'll get their poop together in time for the next election. Very funny and very true - JP at his best. Enjoy . . .

 
tomorton said:
But on this issue is your point that you don't want to read what fullfact put up because they put it up or that they have put up incorrect conclusions?
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Incomplete analysis is where I was headed, they talk about percentages and comparisons but don't put monetary figures on it, for a better evaluation I think some monetary figures would help with context, given that poverty is largely related to money (although clearly that is not all it is related to).
 
timsk said:
I do hope that Labour and the LibDems don't watch this because, if they do AND they act on it, there's a chance they'll get their poop together in time for the next election. Very funny and very true - JP at his best. Enjoy . . .

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He has a point even though insulting stupid politicians is fun. A bit like Ozzie sledging at the Test Match. The game is usually won by the side that throws less insults at the opponents. NOT MORE. Tends to get the sympathy vote of the neutrals.
 
timsk said:
I do hope that Labour and the LibDems don't watch this because, if they do AND they act on it, there's a chance they'll get their poop together in time for the next election. Very funny and very true - JP at his best. Enjoy . . .

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Very right. The longer the Marxist leaders of Labour stay in place to "ensure a smooth transition" to a new leader, the less chance the party has of electoral victory. Every month Jeremy Stalin remains leader adds another year to Conservative government.
 
Labour need a total re-think. Jess Phillips is the only candidate who can win the next election for them.
 
counter_violent said:
Good start. So, Northern voters are stupid are they.

metro.co.uk

Labour leadership contender denies calling northern voters 'stupid'

Emily Thornberry is said to be considering legal action against a former colleague, who lost in Labour's dismal election performance on Thursday.
metro.co.uk metro.co.uk
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Taking legal action against a former colleague over hearsay is a great way for Emily Thornberry to start a leadership bid campaign. That will really help strengthen the party and should win her endless support from her other party colleagues......
Top leadership material by Labour standards.
 
DT5 said:
Labour need a total re-think. Jess Phillips is the only candidate who can win the next election for them.
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She's a lightweight.
If she was any kind of independent leading thinker, she wouldn't have gone along with the party line of supporting the loser Corbyn.
Labour don't have any credible leadership candidates. They are all as guilty as each other of "going along with it"instead of "standing up to it" when they know perfectly well that militant left wing politics have no place in the UK.
 
Last edited:
I don't see Labour presenting a credible opposition with a possibility of election until the leader after the leader after next. They still have not managed to recover from the Blair years - Gordon Brown, Ed Miliband, Jeremy Stalin and Harriet Harman standing in. I ask you!
 
Here's another YouTube vid', this time from Paul Joseph Watson, whose style could not be more different to Jonathan Pie but, nonetheless, echos many of the same themes. Enjoy . . .

 
counter_violent said:
She's a lightweight.
If she was any kind of independent leading thinker, she wouldn't have gone along with the party line of supporting the loser Corbyn.
Labour don't have any credible leadership candidates. They are all as guilty as each other of "going along with it"instead of "standing up to it" when they know perfectly well that militant left wing politics have no place in the UK.
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Labour think reality exists on Twitter only! Sad misguided fools.

They are doing a DNC, never admit when wrong, blame everyone else, double down on bullshit, bunch of losers in all respects.

There'll be calls to impeach Boris next, it was der ru$$ians wot did it.
 
barjon said:
What a good idea! If you play rugby, it’ll be your fault if you break your arm so don’t call us. Accident while driving? But you do too many miles so piss off. Use KNIVES in the kitchen-well what do you expect, take your bleeding finger elsewhere or it’s £50 a stitch. Broke your leg skiing? How dare you indulge in such dodgy things. Your lifestyle is too high risk so that’ll be £10,000 please.
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It is a GREAT idea and a WORKABLE solution that can be crafted to improve the NHS.

If you participate in dangerous sports one should take out personal insurance yes.

Actuaries can calculate the risk in sport against the probability of injuries and premiums quite easily. Common sense to me.

People live so much longer now and number of severe mental illnesses are becoming more prevalent. Similar to family planning we need to devise death planning options. Look at Japan, they keep the elderly alive with tubes down their nostrils prolonging a life of misery to patient and family. Why not legalise Euthanasia making it available to those who want it. Ludicrous to keep people alive against their will in pain and suffering.

What is CLEAR is that NHS can't continue looking after the ageing population living longer with new ailments at standards people have come to expect.

Social care is a bottomless pit.

Then there is child care. I support IDS and child credit should only be given to first two children. If one can't afford children then one shouldn't have 3, 4, 5 or more. Freaking crazy giving child benefit to people who breed like rodents and do poor job of bringing up ill behaved brats.

Tough teaching people common sense and accountability.
 
Atilla said:
. . . Tough teaching people common sense and accountability.
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At',
You're a strange one! ;-) I reckon that if 100 ordinary people off the street read this post and were asked the question 'in the general election - which party do you think the writer voted for?' - all 100 would say Tory and would put you on the far right of the party. That's not to say I disagree with it. On the contrary, enabling people to end their lives in their own time does indeed make perfect sense. I'm not so keen on the idea of paying insurance for certain activities. Two reasons. Firstly, what constitutes danger - where's the cut-off point and how do you rate one activity against another? For example, I'm an angler and fish of rocks on the rugged south Devon coast. Undoubtedly, this is a dangerous sport and people lose their lives doing it every year. But is it more or less dangerous than sailing, or playing rugby or fell walking? I suspect actuaries will struggle to disentangle that little lot!
Tim.
 
timsk said:
At',
You're a strange one! ;-) I reckon that if 100 ordinary people off the street read this post and were asked the question 'in the general election - which party do you think the writer voted for?' - all 100 would say Tory and would put you on the far right of the party. That's not to say I disagree with it. On the contrary, enabling people to end their lives in their own time does indeed make perfect sense. I'm not so keen on the idea of paying insurance for certain activities. Two reasons. Firstly, what constitutes danger - where's the cut-off point and how do you rate one activity against another? For example, I'm an angler and fish of rocks on the rugged south Devon coast. Undoubtedly, this is a dangerous sport and people lose their lives doing it every year. But is it more or less dangerous than sailing, or playing rugby or fell walking? I suspect actuaries will struggle to disentangle that little lot!
Tim.
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Be careful Tim, but I'm pretty sure the major NHS costs don't come from sporting / pastime accidents.

I'm going to say its getting older plus poor lifestyle choices people make which drive NHS costs. This is where we either make some improvements or see the NHS swallow up our public spending. The NHS has the potential to soak up money from the other big budgets for services we think of as equally vital - education, welfare, defence etc.
 
timsk said:
At',
You're a strange one! ;-) I reckon that if 100 ordinary people off the street read this post and were asked the question 'in the general election - which party do you think the writer voted for?' - all 100 would say Tory and would put you on the far right of the party. ........................................... etc
Tim.
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I'm not completely sure about this but, you remember that guy on College Green for the duration of the Brexit campaign who had a very, very loud anti-Brexit voice & could always be overheard "putting his point of view" voiceover on any TV Brexit interview? Well, I reckon that could have been Atilla, and he's now been so stunned by the election result that, being a thinking man he's now had a change of heart. It's the only rational explanation I can see!
 
0007 said:
I'm not completely sure about this but, you remember that guy on College Green for the duration of the Brexit campaign who had a very, very loud anti-Brexit voice & could always be overheard "putting his point of view" voiceover on any TV Brexit interview? Well, I reckon that could have been Atilla, and he's now been so stunned by the election result that, being a thinking man he's now had a change of heart. It's the only rational explanation I can see!
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I agree and it would also explain why he hasn't posted much on here this year, as well as asking signalcalc to run the S+P comp.

Makes ya think ! :)
 
At is at last being a true democrat and accepting the will of the majority even if he has strong reservations.
Well done sir I applaud your sensible decision.
 
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