francisfinley
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take it from me you need to explore everything yourself with small bits of money with as many as you can.
take it from me you need to explore everything yourself with small bits of money with as many as you can.
Yes they do vary on different platforms I used a system once on one feed but switched to demo trading on another and the results were quite an eye opener. In a choppy market the difference between brokers is quite apparent. It underlines the fact that any system you run needs to be in synch with the platform you're trading on.
thanks for info francis it was a question put to me basically means if you get a flash crash you'll get margin calls and potentially a huge bill. So at what point would Smartlive close your position on a margin call and what is the liability to make the account good? It's worth knowing how this would be resolved because it varies between brokers.
Actually does cover it in their Risk Warning that you are liable to unlimited losses:
http://www.smartlivemarkets.co.uk/pages/base/risk-warning.aspx
"However even a small movement in price against you can lead to substantial losses and you may be required to deposit additional margin with us immediately to keep these trades open. You are liable for this and for any losses that may occur if your positions are closed. The potential losses, or profits, for margin traded products are unlimited and this should always be considered by you when making trading decisions."
http://www.smartlivemarkets.co.uk/pages/base/risk-warning.aspx
"However even a small movement in price against you can lead to substantial losses and you may be required to deposit additional margin with us immediately to keep these trades open. You are liable for this and for any losses that may occur if your positions are closed. The potential losses, or profits, for margin traded products are unlimited and this should always be considered by you when making trading decisions."
francisfinley
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slipped twice again thru stop, 3.3 pips and 2.3 pips.
normal market.
normal market.
busfarehome
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Got stopped out at 1.58890 GBP/USD 17:30 ish (18:30 platform time).
Price never even reached there, highest it went was 1.58870. The odds really are stacked against us.
Price never even reached there, highest it went was 1.58870. The odds really are stacked against us.
1.5889 and 1.5887 is 2 pips which is probably the spread so were probably legitimately stopped it's not so clear to see that with 5 decimal place brokers. It looks like 20 pips but it's actually only 2. The charts tend to only show mid-price so you need to add the spread onto what is displayed a bit of a pain but they're all the same.
I just checked this, highest price weas 1.5887, but this is teh ask price, GU has a 2pip spread so the bid price was 1.5889 and as you were selling this is the price that would have stopped you out.
Only problem I'm having is at the daily roll over (10pm UK time) where liquidity is low and my EA crashes on some pairs ...probably due to a lack of ticks being generated or some pricing logic error at the rollover...dont have this problem on any other MT4 broker I've tested. I've generaly foud SLM to be be pretty slow to generate ticks compared to my other MT4 brokers. Dunno if anyone else is having the same problem with EA's around this time?
pineappleman
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I think the answer is this: the only real serious spreadbet broker is ProSpreads, as they offer near DMA trading direct onto futures exchanges (they only one in the world who do) and now have an FX spot offering too. They genuinely never requote coz they dont quote you in the first place, the underlying market does right? So you pay the market spread and then a little on top (in the spread) which is how they make their money - it's transparent and honest. But their margin requirements are professional too (FX spot is £5k margin I think, don't quote me on that) and their futures margins are high too - coz they're profession brokers who do not want the silly punters playing around with £1 stakes.
So you need to trade small if you cannot afford ProSpreads at first, trade with someone like SLM or another spreadbet broker to grow account then transfer to the big boys broker ProSpreads - which means considering trading FX futures perhaps - worth a thought.
Anyway, any SB bucketshop will come with fill issues, it's a shame yes and it hurts but it's life. But if you start with small account and find yourself actually getting good enough to build it, wait until you honestly have enough cash then move to PS - it's my honest opinion SLM are the best SB broker for small accounts and smaller players, but if you want to get rich from trading you do not need to be fighting a broker as well as yourself in the heat of battle, so ProSpreads are the goal I think.
Yes i know people will say "but you pay in the long run with PS over real DMA futures trading etc" maybe that's true but you'll pay less with PS over any other SB broker in the world due to the fact you simply do not/cannot get stung by dodgy fills and requotes. So if you really really want to stay with tax free spreadbetting, you gotta aim for ProSpreads but starting small means bucketshops like SLM. That's just the way it is!
So you need to trade small if you cannot afford ProSpreads at first, trade with someone like SLM or another spreadbet broker to grow account then transfer to the big boys broker ProSpreads - which means considering trading FX futures perhaps - worth a thought.
Anyway, any SB bucketshop will come with fill issues, it's a shame yes and it hurts but it's life. But if you start with small account and find yourself actually getting good enough to build it, wait until you honestly have enough cash then move to PS - it's my honest opinion SLM are the best SB broker for small accounts and smaller players, but if you want to get rich from trading you do not need to be fighting a broker as well as yourself in the heat of battle, so ProSpreads are the goal I think.
Yes i know people will say "but you pay in the long run with PS over real DMA futures trading etc" maybe that's true but you'll pay less with PS over any other SB broker in the world due to the fact you simply do not/cannot get stung by dodgy fills and requotes. So if you really really want to stay with tax free spreadbetting, you gotta aim for ProSpreads but starting small means bucketshops like SLM. That's just the way it is!
I think the attraction of Smartlive is the automated EAs on MT4 it certainly is my requirement I'm not sure about Prospreads on that score. I like the idea of placing trades without even having to look at a chart or latest prices now there aren't any SB companies that I know do that. With all of the code developed for MT4 that limits your options for SB imo.
I have a account with PS, tohough I've not placed many trades with them yet. Like you said the appeal it's essentially the equivalent of an STP broker so you're not gonna get re-quotes and execution is extremely fast. The lack of mini lots is disappointing though, if they could bring that in then I'd use them more often.
One reason people use SLM is for the MT4 platform which is the most popular platform amongst retail FX traders and has the ability to run automated trading robots (EA's), scripts and custom indicators....that's why I use SLM...though the spreads on some of the minors are too large to make it worthwhile (the tax advantage does not go as far as people think!) eg. EAUD, ECAD, ANZD 10 spread...in the real forex world 4-5 spread is more commonplace for these pairs.
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francisfinley
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gotta add my tenpenneth here.
if you have an EA that works you wont be using it for spreadbetting imo. you'd be with a decent broker.
spreadbetting is just gambling. it is what it says on the tin im afraid.
there are a very select few that beg to differ but they know what i mean.
all i want is for my order to open fill instantly, to close instantly and at the price i f*cking set. THAT is not wrong or a wayward expectation but these cu*ts would have you believe it is and the hype and bull**** eminating from some of the forum dwellers is a joke.
you try and do / get that spreadbetting. near enough impossible.
best experience ive had is dealingdesk (london capital i believe) tradefair are not too bad either.
ive tried
igindex - hate the platform.... spread needs to be lower...
iii (using cityindex) - changed to someone else now i believe.... was pants.
finspreads - ****e
Capitalspreads - awful
ETX - ok but spread to high
ODL - awful if you make profit!
tradefair - ok
Dealing Desk - best experience
CMC Markets - worst experience
as a side note dealingdesk started off well but they all get victims of success and started to tighten up..
if you do spreadbet just remember its a casino not the real thing.
if you have an EA that works you wont be using it for spreadbetting imo. you'd be with a decent broker.
spreadbetting is just gambling. it is what it says on the tin im afraid.
there are a very select few that beg to differ but they know what i mean.
all i want is for my order to open fill instantly, to close instantly and at the price i f*cking set. THAT is not wrong or a wayward expectation but these cu*ts would have you believe it is and the hype and bull**** eminating from some of the forum dwellers is a joke.
you try and do / get that spreadbetting. near enough impossible.
best experience ive had is dealingdesk (london capital i believe) tradefair are not too bad either.
ive tried
igindex - hate the platform.... spread needs to be lower...
iii (using cityindex) - changed to someone else now i believe.... was pants.
finspreads - ****e
Capitalspreads - awful
ETX - ok but spread to high
ODL - awful if you make profit!
tradefair - ok
Dealing Desk - best experience
CMC Markets - worst experience
as a side note dealingdesk started off well but they all get victims of success and started to tighten up..
if you do spreadbet just remember its a casino not the real thing.
if you're trading with EAs though you can trade them with SB (Smartlive) and professional brokers at the same time if you've got VMs with MT4 on you can trade them live simultaneously. From what I've seen so far the prices are pretty much in synch but I can only go on what I've seen so far if that changes then obviously my bias will change. Trouble with micro lots on brokers is you pay on the spread if you're trading full contracts then your probably better off with a professional broker account. The EAs do work on Smartlive I'm amazed to be honest the only thing I'm not sure about is how long they will be effective before the gremlins creep in. Potentially a huge market though as most SB companies get you locked in on their clunky processor intensive bespoke trading platforms and their pretty tacky charting packages which leave out a lot of the useful charting tools. The prices conveniiently don't match the quotes on the platform etc. A lot of SB companies don't listen to the concerns I've had with them they just keep releasing even more cumbersome platforms with more bells and whistles I just do not need or want.
francisfinley
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the house always wins.
easy drop me a pm if you want to use other spreadbettors - ive had software developed so i can get the output from MT4 to click anything on the screen.
you can still automate any web platform without api ********. check out viperclicker - i just had it rebuilt to read the indicator files in MT4..............
as for SLM - be fu*king careful my experience has been poor. endless slippage and this morning a trade got entered totally wrong.
It probably depends on how you use the platform I guess though Francis but I've always been a pending order man because of the systems I use. what I have noticed is when I manually close trades i get 'invalid price' or words to that affect on occaisions then have to repeat the process. Most stuff I do goes on behind the scenes so I just check that the reports I get from my software tally up with the detailed account report from MT4. If they don't match then something underhand is going on like spreads increasing once near stops or take profit levels.
francisfinley
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yar. i just want to take some of the sheen off the hype - just because its on mt4 doesnt mean this lot are any good.
they are nowhere near as good as dealingdesk.
dealingdesk do not slip me through my stop in normal market conditions EVER.
news maybe.
to have slippage twice in an hour is unacceptable on 2 seperate occasions in a week..........
as someone else has said and ill keep saying i dont care for the excuses. i dont care what is the norm. i know with MOST vendors i do not get slipped like i do with SLM. i have tested several spreadbet places (bucketshops/casinos) so i feel i can give a fairly objective view even in my subjective take.
your order should open where you ask it to, your order should close where you set it to close. end of story.
SLM do not do this.
ask GLE101 for his views - hes got more experience with spreadbet places....
i think he recommends cityindex atm - but i have been with them in the past and they were cack.
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If you have a big account then IMO you'd be better of using an EA on an ECN broker for sure....better spreads and execution overcomes the tax advantage of spreadbetting IMO. If you have a smaller account then there is not much difference between using one market maker over another, be a FDX broker or a spreadbetting firm. For example Alpari UK and SLM...if I run an EA on both I'll get about the same results but I get a tax saving on SLM. IMO the grass is only greener on the otherside if you use an ECN broker otherwise from my experience of both they are pretty much the same...all market makers just some are spreadbetting firms and some are FX Brokers.
My EA has been running fine for 6 weeks on SLM apart from a problem at daily rollover where it seems to have some sort of price fixinf / tick generate error which causes my EA to crash...only happens on ECHF, ACAD and UCAD for some reason.
It's not DMA but it gives you DMA functionality for spreadbetting something I've not seen from any other broker. Maybe CMC will rival them but their spreads are too wide at the moment for FX IMO