Smart Live Markets - Spread Bet on MT4

[gle101]

Fair point gle101, I think my main reason for posting was to sort of say thanks really to SLM for (potentially) a great offering and I guess to people on this thread for contributing. There was one comment in particular, wont bother going back to find it, it's not that important, that sort of showed there are people out there who just want want want. And no, it wasn't Black Swan! Seems some people are a little over cautious maybe because of past experiences but hey if we all were like that we wouldn't cross the road to get to the shops!! Sometimes life is too short and you have to jump in at some point.

Remember, a bad workman blames his tools but if the hammer is actually broken then fair enough he can't nail into the wood. I think SLM seem to be a pretty solid hammer so far, so all I'm saying is if you go live with them and everything goes ok (fills, opening hours etc) and you still aren't satisfied, well, maybe you can consider yourself a bad workman... (not directed at anyone at all).

I'm just excited about spreading on MT4 with a seemingly genuine broker/bookie that's all.

TOC

Yes I agree, I like the way SLM is listning to the traders and try to do something about it immediately. I am also looking forward to see how they are progressing in the month to come.

You should have been around a couple of years ago, the language used by many was terrible. Today it is quite civilized in my opinion.

 

[Black Swan]

Hi all

I started a thread on T2W coz lately I've been walking down the road of "trying to find a decent SB broker". It's a long, tough, often disheartening path.

I have to say, though, that recently I've opened a demo with SLM for the reasons everyone is talking about in this thread (MT4, good spreads, AMAZING customer service) and so far I have been impressed more than with any of the many others I have tried in past/recent times.

I want to spreadbet as yes perhaps I'm lazy when it comes to tax. My head is full of charts, markets, MM, risk management, attitude towards markets etc. - the stuff that's important, not s*dding tax returns. Frankly, we are blessed in the UK to have this opportunity no-one else does and I simply refuse to believe this idea that spreadbetting is a path to ruin in trading, but I don't blame the people that feel this way if they've been stung by the conmen in this game, like I have before.

If (and I mean a big IF) you can find an honest SB broker then why should it be any different from trading futures, FX spot, stocks etc.. It shouldn't, it works, you can trade your way to financial freedom with any trading vehicle, but there is that big IF....

So I'm hoping SLM are the answer to my IF.

So far, so good. I recommend them for anyone who is basically on this same path as me. I haven't found anything wrong with them yet but yes I'm on demo and I've read some people moan about late market opening and heavy re-quotes BUT equally I have notice how quick the customer service from SLM, live on this thread, have heard the moans, answered fairly and above all SOLVED the problem! I mean would you get that from IG? CMC? Capital? No. You moan about an issue on a forum, they wont roll up their sleeves and fix it like SLM have! You moan in an email and you get a reply from a receptionist saying thanks for your comments. Only with SLM have I experienced true efforts to accomodate customer needs, I mean actually hear the problem and say "ok sorry my fault I forgot to push a button, problem now solved" from a company rep (who I believe is higher than a rep, I think these guys answering on this thread/emails obviously are the show-runners which is even better customer service frankly).

Where else in the world of SB are you going to find that?? They have even said that a poor data spike will be a). refunded b). re-positioned as if nothing had happened. If CMC (aka Steal4Free) did this, no offence, but they would be out of business by October.

So for all the gripes and moans and never ending requests on this thread, guys at SLM I want to say: if you are reading this, a huge well done from me. You new service is not perfect yet, but I really think it can be. You seem genuine, I think I can trade profitably with you without worrying whether you'll steal it back like other SB companies, I think I can contact you without having to climb Everest, I think I can trust you to do business with. Thanks for your efforts, you obvoiously know you are a small fish in a big pond right now yet I think if you carry on with such wonderful customer attention and responses to needs/wants to build your business, you will maintain this edge you have currently (with MT4 etc..) and you will one day swallow IG whole.

I noticed a few posts on this thread were a bit too negative towards a new SB company who are clearly trying their hearts out to give you what you want. Not really fair. Give these guys a chance to spread their wings a little coz from where I'm sitting they have answered many prayers of the SB community already and are trying hard to answer more.

TOC

I think I just threw up... Yep good luck with them, once you finally open a real account keep trading and don't forget to spread the word, they'll need approx 1,000 repeat customers so they can sell up to fxcm..

 

[Tired_Of_Conmen]

I think I just threw up... Yep good luck with them, once you finally open a real account keep trading and don't forget to spread the word, they'll need approx 1,000 repeat customers so they can sell up to fxcm..

Hey Black Swan, just to ask, who do you trade with? I totally understand your cynical side really I do!

But a positive mental attitude will win in trading much more than a positive mathematical expectation model ever will!

TOC

 

[gle101]

I think I just threw up... Yep good luck with them, once you finally open a real account keep trading and don't forget to spread the word, they'll need approx 1,000 repeat customers so they can sell up to fxcm..

Why sell to fxcm, they are not exactly in the forefront when it comes to SB companies.

 

[Tired_Of_Conmen]

Why sell to fxcm, they are not exactly in the forefront when it comes to SB companies.

I know!! I don't understand his fascination with them either! They're awful!

Hence why we're all so excited about a new SB company!!

If FXCM or any other of the con merchants out there were any good this thread wouldn't be 46 pages long!!

TOC

 

[Ross Spur]

FXCM have a good platform and would be, or could be, in the forefront if they offered competitive spreads.

 

[Black Swan]

Hey Black Swan, just to ask, who do you trade with? I totally understand your cynical side really I do!

But a positive mental attitude will win in trading much more than a positive mathematical expectation model ever will!

TOC

Yay!! I likes the pma bit, and it's true. You have to have positive expectancy about the positive expectancy of your edge...Anyhow moving on, I have a couple of dormant SB accounts, one I keep barely live just to get the charting package for free although I might just close that given I'm enjoying the fxcm strat-tester platform atm. I also manage someone else's SB account/fund under a power of attorney arrangement...

You should only use SB firms (long term) if tax is an issue, or the securities you wish to trade are not available with any other firms let me explain;

You can learn how to be a successful forex trader using for example a micro account with fxcm or Alpari, or demos from other firms. If you can make them 'work' then swing/position trading with an SB firm makes complete sense. Any short term TF trading with an SB firm is swimming against the tide, not that they are devisive, they are simply not set up to help you take money out of the markets by trading of, for example, ten minute TFs and below..Having said that I have no doubt there's guys reading this thinking "yeah whatever" whilst raking it in trading the ftse at one pip spread* with IG... and good luck to 'em...

None of the larger SB firms deserve the false reps they are given. The majority of whiners moan because they fook up. I've heard all the rumours, stories etc.. about the random spikes, bad fills, whips..et..etc...but you can get that with (supposed) dma and tbh if I take 50 short term TF trades a week then perhaps 5% will have issues, it goes with the territory, it is what it is...My Son's account had an issue with fxcm micro recently they sorted it after a couple of e-mails..

So SML? Good luck to them, but the success you have will not be down to them, their honesty, the platform...it'll be down to you, you can replicate that success anywhere if your edge works. For me I want quick fills at the price quoted and as low a spead as I can get, I want at best spreads of between 0.5-2 pips...does it matter that I make 22 pips profit on a trade or 25? Not really but it's about long term planning, self respect, respecting the industry you find yourself in, and being a professional..

 

[gle101]

Yay!! I likes the pma bit, and it's true. You have to have positive expectancy about the positive expectancy of your edge...Anyhow moving on, I have a couple of dormant SB accounts, one I keep barely live just to get the charting package for free although I might just close that given I'm enjoying the fxcm strat-tester platform atm. I also manage someone else's SB account/fund under a power of attorney arrangement...

You should only use SB firms (long term) if tax is an issue, or the securities you wish to trade are not available with any other firms let me explain;

You can learn how to be a successful forex trader using for example a micro account with fxcm or Alpari, or demos from other firms. If you can make them 'work' then swing/position trading with an SB firm makes complete sense. Any short term TF trading with an SB firm is swimming against the tide, not that they are devisive, they are simply not set up to help you take money out of the markets by trading of, for example, ten minute TFs and below..Having said that I have no doubt there's guys reading this thinking "yeah whatever" whilst raking it in trading the ftse at a quid a pip with IG... and good luck to 'em...

None of the larger SB firms deserve the false reps they are given. The majority of whiners moan because they fook up. I've heard all the rumours, stories etc.. about the random spikes, bad fills, whips..et..etc...but you can get that with (supposed) dma and tbh if I take 50 short term TF trades a week then perhaps 5% will have issues, it goes with the territory, it is what it is...My Son's account had an issue with fxcm micro recently they sorted it after a couple of e-mails..

So SML? Good luck to them, but the success you have will not be down to them, their honesty, the platform...it'll be down to you, you can replicate that success anywhere if your edge works. For me I want quick fills at the price quoted and as low a spead as I can get, I want at best spreads of between 0.5-2 pips...does it matter that I make 22 pips profit on a trade or 25? Not really but it's about long term planning, self respect, respecting the industry you find yourself in, and being a professional..

I agree, most of the SB today are decent companies with good service. SLM could become one of these, but it will take some time and effort to get established in this tough business. FXCM as a SB is not established at all, as a SB company that is, so I don't understand why you keep beating the drums for them the way you do on this thread. They might suit you kind of trading, but the majority of traders is not interested in paying the kind of spread they are offering.

 

[Tired_Of_Conmen]

You have to have positive expectancy about the positive expectancy of your edge

...

the success you have will not be down to them, their honesty, the platform...it'll be down to you, you can replicate that success anywhere if your edge works. For me I want quick fills at the price quoted and as low a spead as I can get, I want at best spreads of between 0.5-2 pips...does it matter that I make 22 pips profit on a trade or 25? Not really but it's about long term planning, self respect, respecting the industry you find yourself in, and being a professional..

BS, thanks for a fantastic reply!

Yes I couldn't agree more, it's back to the workman-tools issue isn't it? If you can trade your model successfully with the right mindset then you should be able to use any broker and win. Obviously then we all want the tightest spreads and best execution, which is where this issue of a new kid on the block (SLM) comes in.

If SLM turn out to be rubbish long term, then of course it's either back to an old broker who may not be perfect but is good enough, or the hunt continues for another great one I've yet to come across.

I'm not looking for perfection really as I know it can't exist, and I'm certainly not looking for any broker to land profits in my lap, I know only I can do that.

And as for timeframes, that's been an issue in the past so much for me that I now trade longer timeframes only because the smaller the frame, the easier it is for a broker to manipulate it, and even if they don't (like you said) the whole SB theme is not built for tiny timeframes. And yes I agree, somewhere somehow some guys will be creaming the SB brokers on 1pip spread charts using 1 minute charts haha! But for me, that's not practical. I could do this (mentally) if I wanted to to learn it, but it's not my style. Like you said, if you can hold decent swings (whether longer term intraday frames or even Daily and above) in a trading model and make it work, then any SB broker will probably be ok to use.

So why am I so into SLM right now? My excitement over SLM lies in the fact I get to use a charting package I am comfortable with and that I can adapt using EAs to my own needs, I get to trade in 10p increments which allows pretty tight money management, the customer service has been out of this world not just for me but many it seems, the financing charges are small, the spreads are good, they're new so they're trying to please people shaping their business around what we want and they allow you to hedge (which most SB brokers don't). All these are very very good selling points.

TOC

 

[Black Swan]

I agree, most of the SB today are decent companies with good service. SLM could become one of these, but it will take some time and effort to get established in this tough business. FXCM as a SB is not established at all, as a SB company that is, so I don't understand why you keep beating the drums for them the way you do on this thread. They might suit you kind of trading, but the majority of traders is not interested in paying the kind of spread they are offering.

I'm not pushing fxcm as an SB option, I've no idea what their sb spreads are like, I'm suggesting that theirs and alpari's micro accounts are a much better start if you are going to trade forex singularly. Even on micro their (fxcm) EUR/USD spread hovers around 2 pip...GBP/JPY 4-5 pip...USD/JPY 2 pip...and you don't pay for stops...

 

[Tired_Of_Conmen]

I'm not pushing fxcm as an SB option, I've no idea what their sb spreads are like, I'm suggesting that theirs and alpari's micro accounts are a much better start if you are going to trade forex singularly. Even on micro their (fxcm) EUR/USD spread hovers around 2 pip...GBP/JPY 4-5 pip...USD/JPY 2 pip...and you don't pay for stops...

This is all just personal choice really I guess. Whichever broker you have found your comfort zone with may not be the same as another trader. The fact we're all different I guess keeps the entire industry going anyway!!

TOC

 

[gle101]

I'm not pushing fxcm as an SB option, I've no idea what their sb spreads are like, I'm suggesting that theirs and alpari's micro accounts are a much better start if you are going to trade forex singularly. Even on micro their (fxcm) EUR/USD spread hovers around 2 pip...GBP/JPY 4-5 pip...USD/JPY 2 pip...and you don't pay for stops...

I am sure you agree, not all SB traders trade FX , in fact I think most SB traders trade other instruments like the indices and stocks.

 

[Black Swan]

I am sure you agree, not all SB traders trade FX , in fact I think most SB traders trade other instruments like the indices and stocks.

apparently (good authority etc) with most SB punters it's 50/50; 50% currency, 50% others...
I have no 'kin idea why anyone would use an SB firm to trade equities though...and cfd trading is (imho) total gash...but each to their own..

 

[Tired_Of_Conmen]

apparently (good authority etc) with most SB punters it's 50/50; 50% currency, 50% others...
I have no 'kin idea why anyone would use an SB firm to trade equities though...and cfd trading is (imho) total gash...but each to their own..

Totally agree.

FX is the "big sexy market" of modern traders and that aint gonna change. If you can do it tax free with the same spreads and (in theory) the same execution, why would you bother with a "real" FX account over an SB account? So yeah I can see why the vast majority of spreadbets are FX rather than any other single market.

Also, I agree on the equities comment. The spreads on most share prices with SBs are awful and a couple I have seen are just a sick joke. But I've seen a sicker joke when it comes to spread costs: check out IG's option spreadbets. LOL!! You simply can't trade them. Most commodity spreads are also traditionally cr*p.

Spreadbetting is great for FX and Stock Index bets which are not too short-term in duration. If you want to swing/position trade (intraday or longer) the FX majors or main Indices, then SB is great.

TOC

 

[Ross Spur]

Spreads on main UK shares are OK, but a bit of a joke on US markets. Why trade shares with SB? The obvious reason is because you need virtually no money to do it!

 

[Tired_Of_Conmen]

Spreads on main UK shares are OK, but a bit of a joke on US markets. Why trade shares with SB? The obvious reason is because you need virtually no money to do it!

Yeah it's just whatever you need as an individual. There is no one-size solution to any of this. If you want to hold share positions for a few days or weeks then SB is great.

Anyway, whatever works for you/me/him/her/us LOL!

Hope this thread goes back to talking about Smart Live Markets ... anyone got any issues/praise with them? Anyone trading live still with them? Anyone found anything better in the SB world other than what's been debated already?

How are these market-opening-times problems now? They were an issue a few weeks ago, with horrid delays at the open of indices I believe. Are they solved?

What about the constant re-quote problem from a few weeks back? Solved?

TOC

 

[Tired_Of_Conmen]

As a sidenote, I just refreshed this page and saw the "new look" CMC's spreadbetting banner advert at the top of the page, anyone seen it? Eurgh, I feel sick!

It goes... "Can you come out to play today... and tomorrow... and the next day..."

...and it ends by saying the demo platform never runs out.

See this is the problem with many SB brokers. They think we're in this for a laugh, it's just a big game. We are mug punters who will deposit a few quid, have a casino-style punt and lose. But as long as we all had fun huh?!

Makes me so angry.

I'm not in this for a giggle. I haven't studied markets, MM, myself etc.. for years and years to "come out and play". I'm in this for the long term to create wealth to retire on one day. I don't want my broker to expect me to lose all in the name of a bit of fun. I expect to win and keep winning, over time, and eventually have a nice account to show for it. Slowly and professionally.

CMC take note. You now promise no dealer intervention, no requotes etc but I've already seen/heard this means slow fills and wide spreads - that's how you keep your promises: you don't have to requote if you fill ultra slow and widen your already wide spreads.

You can just tell by that advert alone they wont take you seriously as a trader. It's a casino to them where you must lose at some point.

B*stards.

CMC (aka Steal4Free)... please disappear.

TOC

EDIT: and yes, they have screwed me in the past, like many, by fiddling with open FTSE positions without my consent. You ring them and a rude "dealer" tells you that you did it, not them.

 

[lovejoy21]

Yeah it's just whatever you need as an individual. There is no one-size solution to any of this. If you want to hold share positions for a few days or weeks then SB is great.

Anyway, whatever works for you/me/him/her/us LOL!

Hope this thread goes back to talking about Smart Live Markets ... anyone got any issues/praise with them? Anyone trading live still with them? Anyone found anything better in the SB world other than what's been debated already?

How are these market-opening-times problems now? They were an issue a few weeks ago, with horrid delays at the open of indices I believe. Are they solved?

What about the constant re-quote problem from a few weeks back? Solved?

TOC

I started trading live with on from Monday this week - I saw this thread last week as was searching for a new SB firm and one with MT4 is a very good potential offering for me.

I only trade forex and so far (I know only 3 days) I've not had any problems with execution. I compared spreads to my other SB brokers (IG and Trade Fair) and on average for the pairs I trade SLM were better (mainly the usd, chf jpy related pairs).

Their margin requirements aren't as good as tradefair but in par with IG.

I can't fault them so far and their customer service was very quick to respond to a couple of queries I had.

I'm used to trading with MT4 brokers like fxpro, alpari and jadefx so an SB firm using MT4 is a very good proposition for me for the charting, custom indicators and EA's (I dont use EA's to trade just to manage trades etc).

Their max bet size is low compared to other SB firms though - £50 max per pip, so more geared for the smaller trader...their minimum is 0.10 lots or 10p per pip.

I'll post any other useful comments when I've had more experience with them.

 

[Tired_Of_Conmen]

I started trading live with on from Monday this week - I saw this thread last week as was searching for a new SB firm and one with MT4 is a very good potential offering for me.

I only trade forex and so far (I know only 3 days) I've not had any problems with execution. I compared spreads to my other SB brokers (IG and Trade Fair) and on average for the pairs I trade SLM were better (mainly the usd, chf jpy related pairs).

Their margin requirements aren't as good as tradefair but in par with IG.

I can't fault them so far and their customer service was very quick to respond to a couple of queries I had.

I'm used to trading with MT4 brokers like fxpro, alpari and jadefx so an SB firm using MT4 is a very good proposition for me for the charting, custom indicators and EA's (I dont use EA's to trade just to manage trades etc).

Their max bet size is low compared to other SB firms though - £50 max per pip, so more geared for the smaller trader...their minimum is 0.10 lots or 10p per pip.

I'll post any other useful comments when I've had more experience with them.

Thanks for posting your experience, please do post more if anything goes wrong, right or as expected! It's a big help.

Yes the margin could be less for things like indices and I understand they are working to reduce them now but their FX margins are pretty much what you expect in the industry like you said.

The £50 max per pip is FX as it gets higher for some other instruments and yes this is lower compared to some. But I have a feeling this will increase one day if the company grows well. They're probably feeling out the ground a little as much as we are and so it seems natural for a new company to have small maximums at first. But I think most people starting out trading or even who are on their way to building nice accounts would still not qualify for much over £50 per pip! So like you said, aimed at smaller to medium traders methinks.

Thanks again for your input and please do post anything else about SLM should you start encountering issues with them, it really helps everyone else.

TOC

 

[redart]

unable to place a trade on the SPX or Dow for the last few minutes since the news came out.
Annoying. First real complaint from me.
Not having this issue with my other brokers.