IGindex requoted already closed trade?!

[montmorencyt2w]

My Tradefair charts registered strange spikes in the 1H chart around 2300 BST last night.
(Monday 10th May 2010)

Thought it was just those involving AUD at first, but also EUR.

A couple of open orders that might have been triggered were not triggered, so I presume it is a chart error, and probably just as well that they were not triggered, but curious. Anyone else see this?

 

[thjb]

you had best to show the high and the low price

 

[Jack Hughes]

Isn't it strange that when the SB company makes mistakes, and admits to it, the customer is still somehow responsible?

You should definitely refer this to the FOS.

 

[manulefx]

Refer this to FOS, I feel IG index has acted irresponsibly as a spreadbetting company. They mention the underlying spread on the futures, you are not trading the underlying spread - you are trading on the prices they have given. They have adjusted the price feed retrospectively and now say that the spread has widened to 800 points from the normal 6 points.
When the market moves like it on that day, they will find it impossible to hedge their positions and balance their books. What they may have done is they have looked at how much money they would have paid out and adjusted the price accordingly by widening the spread to 800 points to limit their losses.
I feel there should be a lot more people affected by the widening of the spread to 800 points, where are these people? Either you are the tip of the iceberg or they have waived these nominal payouts.
FOS complaints are very costly for a spreadbetting company, specially if its only for £500 - £1000. However, given the fact it is £26k, its probably worth them to take a punt.
Just my opinion.

 

[Jack Hughes]

Refer this to FOS, I feel IG index has acted irresponsibly as a spreadbetting company. They mention the underlying spread on the futures, you are not trading the underlying spread - you are trading on the prices they have given. They have adjusted the price feed retrospectively and now say that the spread has widened to 800 points from the normal 6 points.
When the market moves like it on that day, they will find it impossible to hedge their positions and balance their books. What they may have done is they have looked at how much money they would have paid out and adjusted the price accordingly by widening the spread to 800 points to limit their losses.
I feel there should be a lot more people affected by the widening of the spread to 800 points, where are these people? Either you are the tip of the iceberg or they have waived these nominal payouts.
FOS complaints are very costly for a spreadbetting company, specially if its only for £500 - £1000. However, given the fact it is £26k, its probably worth them to take a punt.
Just my opinion.

Agree with all that. It would be interesting to know how many T2W people were given back £26k as a result of IG's errors.

 

[gedward3]

Agree with all that. It would be interesting to know how many T2W people were given back £26k as a result of IG's errors.

Its b@ll**** as they could have hedged using the S and P or the Mini Dow
and kept the client good without going to the time and effort to do this.

In effect if there is something that moves the market that is quite
extraordinary they will pull this sh1t every time.

Chase it up with the FOS. Im usually for the SB companies but this
just takes the biscuit and proves there are no big winners with them at
all. Why let you keep a trade open overnight if this is a risk aned they will
pull stunts like this.

Ged

 

[gle101]

Refer this to FOS, I feel IG index has acted irresponsibly as a spreadbetting company. They mention the underlying spread on the futures, you are not trading the underlying spread - you are trading on the prices they have given. They have adjusted the price feed retrospectively and now say that the spread has widened to 800 points from the normal 6 points.
When the market moves like it on that day, they will find it impossible to hedge their positions and balance their books. What they may have done is they have looked at how much money they would have paid out and adjusted the price accordingly by widening the spread to 800 points to limit their losses.
I feel there should be a lot more people affected by the widening of the spread to 800 points, where are these people? Either you are the tip of the iceberg or they have waived these nominal payouts.
FOS complaints are very costly for a spreadbetting company, specially if its only for £500 - £1000. However, given the fact it is £26k, its probably worth them to take a punt.
Just my opinion.

You are trading on the movement and reflection of the underlying instrument and spread in which the SB instrument is based upon (it can be several index during off hours). However, I found it very hard to believe even during that crazy evening and night that the actual underlying market spread went up to a staggering 800 points. Should be quite easy to investigate into if that is the case.

 

[pboyles]

You are trading on the movement and reflection of the underlying instrument and spread in which the SB instrument is based upon (it can be several index during off hours). However, I found it very hard to believe even during that crazy evening and night that the actual underlying market spread went up to a staggering 800 points. Should be quite easy to investigate into if that is the case.

Think about it, you placed a bet with a bookie and when the result didn't suit them they changed it. If you were betting on a football match and the bookie added 2 goals after the final whistle would it be acceptable? That's exactly what has happened here, the result didn't suit them so they changed it using a widened spread as an excuse.

Get a futures account and forget about this spreadbetting crap.

 

[Jack Hughes]

I've noticed that IG's long and detailed fob offs always include a phrase like this:

I can appreciate your frustration regarding the issue you have encountered and can only imagine your disappointment upon the realisation that the profit you thought you had rightfully made was removed from your account.

re. the 800pt spread, if this really happened, how long did it apply for, I wonder? A second, maybe?

 

[gle101]

Think about it, you placed a bet with a bookie and when the result didn't suit them they changed it. If you were betting on a football match and the bookie added 2 goals after the final whistle would it be acceptable? That's exactly what has happened here, the result didn't suit them so they changed it using a widened spread as an excuse.

Get a futures account and forget about this spreadbetting crap.

Well, we actually don't know if the underlying spread was 800 points. It was a crazy market, and the real figures have to be investigated and presented. I agree, if you have large positions you should not be trading SB. Otherwise, SB is acceptable if one is aware of the risk involved.

 

[gle101]

I've noticed that IG's long and detailed fob offs always include a phrase like this:

I can appreciate your frustration regarding the issue you have encountered and can only imagine your disappointment upon the realisation that the profit you thought you had rightfully made was removed from your account.

re. the 800pt spread, if this really happened, how long did it apply for, I wonder? A second, maybe?

If it was for one second I can't see that the SB have done anything wrong.

 

[pboyles]

Well, we actually don't know if the underlying spread was 800 points. It was a crazy market, and the real figures have to be investigated and presented. I agree, if you have large positions you should not be trading SB. Otherwise, SB is acceptable if one is aware of the risk involved.

Should be possible to create a chart set to show the bid price and another set to show the ask price, then compare them to see any instances of large spreads. I used to be able to do that in tradestation but my current software cant. Can anyone else do it? If I had 26k riding on it I'd certainly try it.

 

[Jack Hughes]

GFT's software can show bid and offer, but I don't think you can go back that far on the TF needed.

 

[donaldduke]

another thing, did IG fill customer stops during that spike down.

if so, were those stops reimbursed by IG?

 

[gle101]

Should be possible to create a chart set to show the bid price and another set to show the ask price, then compare them to see any instances of large spreads. I used to be able to do that in tradestation but my current software cant. Can anyone else do it? If I had 26k riding on it I'd certainly try it.

Just have a look at the major index futures during the period in question. If no one shows that kind of spread you can be confident that IG had a price feed error, resulting in a spread of 800 points.

 

[gedward3]

Should be possible to create a chart set to show the bid price and another set to show the ask price, then compare them to see any instances of large spreads. I used to be able to do that in tradestation but my current software cant. Can anyone else do it? If I had 26k riding on it I'd certainly try it.

I would think they can show what they like on their charts as they are indicative
and they make the market. The FTSE would have been closed so they can just show
a wide bid and offer of £1 on each side to show they could not bring the price any
closer. Any trades in between will just be scrapped for winners and honoured
for the losers. They dont legally have to show any trades that went through only
the spike down and back up on the bloomberg price feed the day after.

If he has emails detailing the trades he took these would be the best way to
prove the trades took place and should be honoured as they prove the trades were
live at the time.

 

[gle101]

I would think they can show what they like on their charts as they are indicative
and they make the market. The FTSE would have been closed so they can just show
a wide bid and offer of £1 on each side to show they could not bring the price any
closer. Any trades in between will just be scrapped for winners and honoured
for the losers. They dont legally have to show any trades that went through only
the spike down and back up on the bloomberg price feed the day after.

If he has emails detailing the trades he took these would be the best way to
prove the trades took place and should be honoured as they prove the trades were
live at the time.

This is a total misconception. No wonder that traders give in when in dispute, when this kind of viewpoint flourish on the forum. According to the MiFID a price quote must be in correlation with that of the underlaying asset (or a combination of thereof), furthermore the SB must save and present history information of a trade when in dispute, if the counterpart ask for such information.

 

[Jack Hughes]

Do SBs really take much notice of MiFID, though?

There's been a distinct lack of happy punters coming on here confirming that losing trades were cancelled and money refunded by the generous folk at IG.

 

[gedward3]

This is a total misconception. No wonder that traders give in when in dispute, when this kind of viewpoint flourish on the forum. According to the MiFID a price quote must be in correlation with that of the underlaying asset (or a combination of thereof), furthermore the SB must save and present history information of a trade when in dispute, if the counterpart ask for such information.

Misconception from my part or your part.

Really then IG should have really closed him out as soon as the trade took place
within a few seconds as they could not hedge the trades or they should have hedged
themselves in another market. They thought it was gonna be a short drop with a
rebound but it went further than anyone would have imagined.

Most people rattle on and the SB themselves say they are always hedged on their
book in the market. Then why wasnt his trade honoured and why did they pull it back from him.

 

[gle101]

Misconception from my part or your part.

Really then IG should have really closed him out as soon as the trade took place
within a few seconds as they could not hedge the trades or they should have hedged
themselves in another market. They thought it was gonna be a short drop with a
rebound but it went further than anyone would have imagined.

Most people rattle on and the SB themselves say they are always hedged on their
book in the market. Then why wasnt his trade honoured and why did they pull it back from him.

Trading SB, could as we have seen, for some traders involve huge sums of money when things goes terrible wrong. It is important to do your homework if one comes in a position of a dispute with your SB. The MiFID financial directives regulate a lot on how such a markets as SB operates, this in reference of them to being a market maker. The SB cannot in a contract override these rules by letting the client sign a user agreement, this in order to be on the safe side when the client start trading with the company. Disputes is bound to happened with this kind of market, and I find it kind of strange that traders do not know more about these issues, as it should be apart of a overall risk management strategy.