Pat494
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err they don't just publish lies Attila. Its just that you usually seem to see some other side of the situation.
P.S. no e in the middle of arguments
War with Iran
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err they don't just publish lies Attila. Its just that you usually seem to see some other side of the situation.
P.S. no e in the middle of arguments
Atilla
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But this is precisely the points being argued.
We have been at war since 2003 for the last 7 years based on a pack of lies - as shown publicly in the media - reports and enquiries...
You use it against one party but not the other...
Pat494
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But this is precisely the points being argued.
We have been at war since 2003 for the last 7 years based on a pack of lies - as shown publicly in the media - reports and enquiries...
You use it against one party but not the other...
I too was against the Iraq war. I remember watching Coln Powell trying to put the US side of the case with the WMD argument. I recall I watched an honourable man squirming under political pressure to put forward " facts " that he obviously didn't believe in .
It is left to "us the people" to try and make a judgement as to who is telling what. Not easy. The good guys have fortunately seen off lunatics on the extreme right ( Hitler ) and the extreme left ( Stalin ). You would think that was that. The moderates have won but no, now it is extreme religious nuts. Lets hope moderation and toleration can see off these b*stards too
scose-no-doubt
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Why did you rep my earlier post? It was sarcastic. Did you not realise I was referring to Israel's treatment of Palestine when you were talking of Iras attitude towards israel.
Pot and kettle if you ask me
Pot and kettle if you ask me
Pat494
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I'm glad the Millibands have found the FAIR word to mix in with all the usual cliches of new and change etc.
Not a concept other than rhetorical usually or completely over the top by promoting the losers and lost philosophies. Well there is always the unlikely possibility.
Gotta keep hopeful ?
Not a concept other than rhetorical usually or completely over the top by promoting the losers and lost philosophies. Well there is always the unlikely possibility.
Gotta keep hopeful ?
Pat494
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I recommended your post scose not reported it
Atilla
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Shell seems to be tolerating the US embargo and sanctions on Iran really really well...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/sep/27/shell-buys-more-oil-iran
Glad some people know the difference between rhetoric and reality and simply getting on with business of working together.
Pat494
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I suppose I ought to declare my position on this knotty problem.
The human race only has 1 planet and so we had better try not to destroy it. In fact it is up to everyone big or small to do their bit to improve conditions on this fragile planet.
We need less nuclear weapons NOT more - I would like to see unhindered inspections
Women shouldn't be stoned to death = they have been recently in Iran
Gays shouldn't be executed for being perverts - they have been recently in Iran
Those that disagree with the regime shouldn't be executed - they have been recently in Iran ( Attila you wouldn't last too long if you spoke your mind there I reckon )
there are plenty of issues such as torture, famine, health that also need addressing
etc.
Things will never be perfect but they can improve or slip backwards into chaos
you decide which way you are pushing
ya well that's my rant over. Think I will watch telly so good night
The human race only has 1 planet and so we had better try not to destroy it. In fact it is up to everyone big or small to do their bit to improve conditions on this fragile planet.
We need less nuclear weapons NOT more - I would like to see unhindered inspections
Women shouldn't be stoned to death = they have been recently in Iran
Gays shouldn't be executed for being perverts - they have been recently in Iran
Those that disagree with the regime shouldn't be executed - they have been recently in Iran ( Attila you wouldn't last too long if you spoke your mind there I reckon )
there are plenty of issues such as torture, famine, health that also need addressing
etc.
Things will never be perfect but they can improve or slip backwards into chaos
you decide which way you are pushing
ya well that's my rant over. Think I will watch telly so good night
arabianights
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this thread is stupid
Ambrose Ackroyd
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Most threads are stupid.
Stupidity is a natural trait of human beings.
Atilla
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DD - FYI - Nato holding a summit in Lisbon to discuss new challenges like Cyber-Attacks...
Well I'll be damned... We have to right to launch Cyber-Attacks on other nations but they have no rights to launch one on us...
Sounds like someone is trying to pick a fight eh???
Interesting stuff...
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/09/28/iran-unveils-squadrons-of-flying-boats/?eref=time_world
Well I'll be damned... We have to right to launch Cyber-Attacks on other nations but they have no rights to launch one on us...
Sounds like someone is trying to pick a fight eh???
Interesting stuff...
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/09/28/iran-unveils-squadrons-of-flying-boats/?eref=time_world
Ambrose Ackroyd
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dick_dastardly
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? +
?+ +
?dd
Atilla
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dd
Hi DD,
I was responding to your interest re: this post but got the threads mixed up...
Originally Posted by dick_dastardly View Post
Atilla! How come you're not getting all excited about this computer virus thingy that's affected all these Iranian nuclear technicians?
I thought that as an IT chap and trade2win's resident conspiracy theorist expert you would have jumped straight on this one?
I'm almost disappointed in you.
dd
This computer virus thingy can be used against them but not against us.
My view is that - it will lead to the abuse of NATO and ultimately its break up if some countries use it to attack others and then expect the whole alliance to defend it self.
It is pretty stupid but stupid is as stupid does... Thought you might be interested in developments that's all. No conspiracy theory just fact. http://www.acus.org/natosource/nato-secgen-proposes-cyber-attacks-trigger-nato-response - Check it out...
NATO SecGen proposes that cyber attacks trigger NATO response
dick_dastardly
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Don’t understand how you arrive at this conclusion?
What makes you so sure that a cyber attack would be launched by one military force against another?
Surely the one lesson we can learn from history is that civilian populations are the primary target in military conflicts?
Now I’m not suggesting that THIS was a cyber attack but could it be a taste of what the future has in store for us?
I see that peeps on this thread are arguing about does Iran have nukes? Will Iran have nukes? Would Iran attack another country? How much does this nation or that nation spend on defence?
The next nuclear attack ( and there will be a next one ) wont be launched by any army, navy or air force against another nation’s missile silos. It will result from a nuke secretly deployed in some major population centre ( probably in the West ).
Such a device would be smuggled into a country piece by piece and assembled in some rented apartment.
Countless thousands will die in the blink of an eye, many of them Muslims. Something to look forward to Atilla?
BTW – still don’t get what your point is about the flying boats? Look like fun though. I want one for Christmas.
dd
Pat494
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Glad some people know the difference between rhetoric and reality and simply getting on with business of working together.
Seems like your boy is upping the rhetoric to new dimensions of rudeness. I can find an extract if you want.
Atilla
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All I'm saying is that some NATO countries are prepared to use cyber attacks against Iran whilst at the same time considering a NATO alliance response if they in turn are attacked them selves. This is surely a case of double standards. Is it not?
However, on a very serious topic some people are asking questions about NATO - its existence, justification and purpose today??? It could be the end of the road.
I also hear what you are saying about dirty bombs and agree with you. But even here how would anyone view the use of uranium tipped bombs against densely popullated civilian areas.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/61412.stm
For example Deformed Iraqi babies caused by USA use of depleted uranium This isn't new news. It is been out quite some time.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=1777
http://www.cuttingedge.org/news/n1965.cfm
http://mindprod.com/politics/iraqdubabiespix.html
The same **** can be found in Afghanistan and Gaza
We attack and kill and use all kinds of weapons of mass destruction and then claim it is they wanting to do this **** on us.
I do believe the defence industry are just feeding their habits and pockets. Your average citizen has no interest in war and is just cannon fodder. If they blow up few of us it will only give more justification for more defence spending to bomb the **** out of them.
Circle of life as we know it...
dick_dastardly
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You do NOT hear what I am saying. I am NOT talking about a dirty bomb, I am talking about a nuclear detonation in the heart of a large city in the West.
A FEW OF US
and just exactly how many millions of us is a few?
dd
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Iran could say something very similar - and with more justification. Iran has been repeatedly threatened by the United States and Israel, including the implicit nuclear threat of "all cards on the table". The United States has on quite a number of occasions threatened the use of nuclear weapons in various parts of the world - more frequently than all other nuclear powers put together.
The United States in it's war on Iraq has killed rather more people than would a strike with 20 kton nuclear weapon.
Now we know that the US has the capacity both in conventional military terms and with nuclear weapons to carry out it's threats. Iran has neither. I should think that continuing aggression against Iran is the surest route to nuclear weapons proliferation when Iran eventually looses patience and decides that nuclear weapons are the only realistic deterrent that it could mount.
As for the leadership in Iran handing over nuclear materials or mythical nuclear weapons to terrorist groups, I'd say the proposition is ludicrous. The absolute last thing they need is loose cannon providing a justification for full scale military assault.
Atilla
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You do NOT hear what I am saying. I am NOT talking about a dirty bomb, I am talking about a nuclear detonation in the heart of a large city in the West.
A FEW OF US
and just exactly how many millions of us is a few?
dd
By dirty bomb I meant a nuclear / radio active bomb. Could be chemical too these days who knows. Doesn't change the arguements. I do hear what you are saying.
Any comments on break up of NATO as out dated to current situ?
We feel we are bigger and stronger and can bomb the ****s out of people at will killing innocents along the way as acceptable such that if one of us dies a 1000s of them die. Look at the ratios.
In such an event as a dirty bomb I'm pretty sure this ratio will be maintained but such is the consequences of these unjust wars.
Quote MI5 intelligence -versus - Blair belief. Wars are making us a target. Not safer.
What da ya think?
