The Truth about Oil

How do we feel about Solar power ? Who has the best sunshine ? Bugger me them oil countries again !! well , I like the idea of solar as all life on planet earth is solar powered, so why not go drect to source. The Sun. Those egyptians knew all this when they used all the oil up last time :)

Dont like the nuclear option, always scares me, all this burrying of radioactive waste in huge concrete bunkers beneath the earth ..... It's quite saddening really, i think the world should try to make a cleaner alternative for the future.

All this green concern with the politics, and they still want nuclear ? I dont like it anyway. i think something like that which after all will affect the future people for thousands of years dealing with the toxic waste ,should be put to the people/ UN nations..... its disaster waiting to happen...

Also Tidal power, using the tides beneath the surface, UK has some of the best tides/biggest tides, so lets invest there ?
 
How do we feel about Solar power ? Who has the best sunshine ? Bugger me them oil countries again !! well , I like the idea of solar as all life on planet earth is solar powered, so why not go drect to source. The Sun. Those egyptians knew all this when they used all the oil up last time :)

Dont like the nuclear option, always scares me, all this burrying of radioactive waste in huge concrete bunkers beneath the earth ..... It's quite saddening really, i think the world should try to make a cleaner alternative for the future.

All this green concern with the politics, and they still want nuclear ? I dont like it anyway. i think something like that which after all will affect the future people for thousands of years dealing with the toxic waste ,should be put to the people/ UN nations..... its disaster waiting to happen...

Also Tidal power, using the tides beneath the surface, UK has some of the best tides/biggest tides, so lets invest there ?

I think we'd all prefer to use wind / sea / sun to power us - the trouble is - does the sun provide enough energy to power us on an ongoing basis, going forward? - with oil we're tapping into millions of years of the suns energy (and using it up over a tiny timeframe).

I fear we'll cover the earth with turbines to satisfy the green lobby before the inevitable move to nuclear anyway, when the green option fails to deliver.

UTB
 
Hmm didnt know about the ocean thermals, I did picture pushing the sub tides through some sort of one way reducing gauge tunnel valve , so the tides power would be squirted to rotate turbines or something... gawd knows but the tides relentless, in /out, in/out, lets tap into that "motion of the ocean" which equals, moto . how could it fail....... :)
 
There's nothing like a good political brawl triggered by oil price discussions :)

As for Iran's role as an oil producer, it is true that they have the 2nd largest known crude reserves after Saudi Arabia, however the refinery capacity is lacking altogether (have a look at the petrol prices in Iran, you might be surpised). Replacing a producer on this level is much less demanding than rebuilding a complete petroleum industry. There are plenty of known oil/gas fields around the US alone that could certainly compensate for the loss. What we need to see is governments that are willing to exploit the resources we have in our back yard, rather than letting middle age sharia people in Iran and elsewhere call the shots.
 
As you suggest - we could make oil - but in the end the energy you get out wold have to be put it. Similar with Hydrogen, it will only be produced in plentifull supply by cracking water - and burning it will produce.......water. So the energy most come from elsewhere.

Nuclear is the only option. Unless Jtrader is correct.

UTB

Its got nothing to do with whether i am correct or not. I am simply forwarding credible information. I am not theorising. I am simply providing T2W members access to information/multiple sources that are telling a wholly different tale to the mainstream controlled media.

What strikes me about the importance of oil is its central role both to the economy, and the financial markets as a whole. Oil affects averyone. Therefore oil, AKA - Black Gold, Texas Tea is hugely important.
 
Good stuff, though, JTrader.
My perspective, admittedly small-minded focus, is to say, if oil is replenishable, where are the scientists chomping at the bit to prove it in a lab?
sorry to be practical.

EDIT: I tend not to be too concerned about politics and agendas, but focus on practicalities of physics, chemistry, maths and engineering for my conclusions as to what can be done or cannot be done.

Oil has to be self-generating, othewise how would it have arrived in the first place.....this is not in question....

If we were running out, the question would be - does it regenerate as fast as the world is using it.........

From my posted articles, the point is that oil is not nearly as scarce as OPEC etc. want you to believe. Artificial scarcity and the notion of PEAK OIL production are the 2 myths that keep oil prices high.

Oil has gone from $60 a barrel to $147 a barel in 18 months. Some were laughing when i posted articles about oil hitting $200 a barel. Its not that far away now.




The key thing, for me, with any articles I post (all of which have supporting documents/references. If it was just 1 blokes theories, i wouldn't give accredit it with much value), whether they are from controlled mainstream media sources, or uncontrolled media sources, is to look at them with an open mind. Be open to the possibility that the version of reality that is presented on the mainstream news may have a hidden agenda, and may not be the true story. This is not to say that they will always be correct or thatthe mainstream are always lying. But being able to have an open mind on things is a valuable quality/skill to possess....
 
Be open to the possibility that the version of reality that is presented on the mainstream news may have a hidden agenda said:
I certainly 2nd that, journalists have, if not a hidden agenda, an obligation to produce news articles on a daily basis and are not necesseralily more informed than Joe Blow.
 
Furthermore, there are many mainstream media reports saying that oil wells that were run dry 50 years ago, are now full again.Therefore what has happened there then?
 
I think we'd all prefer to use wind / sea / sun to power us - the trouble is - does the sun provide enough energy to power us on an ongoing basis, going forward? - with oil we're tapping into millions of years of the suns energy (and using it up over a tiny timeframe).

I fear we'll cover the earth with turbines to satisfy the green lobby before the inevitable move to nuclear anyway, when the green option fails to deliver.

UTB

hmm yes concentrated power, like the fat off an animal contians most calories! But one day the oil will be gone anyhow and people will have to adapt, unless the world order "culls" the population... in order to eek the oil out for a bit longer !! :) blast, not going down that route.

But what do we need oil for today ? How can people live a life with avoiding using oil? thats an education just waiting to happen..
Modern western worlds already developed they can cut back ? If anyway can find info on how many of our day to day products needs and services requires oil, lets have a look. What I am getting at is what oil based products can we drop off today/next few years and not use or use an alternative...

Thats the next big FOOD /Product label This Item is OIL friendly ?

We can convert sun power with planting tree's trees for fuel, maybe theres a future whereby we throw a few logs in the engine aswell as the fire !! yes we going back for our future........ Lumber is good ?

Tree power.
 
The 'Abiotic Oil' Controversy

......
Refilling Fields?

Abiotic theorists often point out evidence of fields refilling. The most-cited example is Eugene Island, the tip of a mostly submerged mountain that lies approximately 80 miles off of the coast of Louisiana. Here is the story as related by Chris Bennett in his article "Sustainable Oil?" on WorldNetDaily.com:

A significant reservoir of crude oil was discovered nearby in the late '60s, and by 1970, a platform named Eugene 330 was busily producing about 15,000 barrels a day of high-quality crude oil. By the late '80s, the platform's production had slipped to less than 4,000 barrels per day, and was considered pumped out. Done. Suddenly, in 1990, production soared back to 15,000 barrels a day, and the reserves which had been estimated at 60 million barrels in the '70s, were recalculated at 400 million barrels. Interestingly, the measured geological age of the new oil was quantifiably different than the oil pumped in the '70s. Analysis of seismic recordings revealed the presence of a "deep fault" at the base of the Eugene Island reservoir which was gushing up a river of oil from some deeper and previously unknown source. (8)

A "river of oil" from an unassociated deep source? This does sound promising. But closer examination yields more prosaic descriptions and explanations.

According to David S. Holland, et al., in Search and Discovery, the reservoir is characterized by

1. Structural features dominated by growth faults, salt domes, and salt-related faulting.

2. Thick accumulations of predominantly deltaic deposits of alternating sand and shale.

3. Young reservoirs (less than 2.5 m.y. old) with migrated hydrocarbons whose origins are in deeper, organic-rich marine shales.

4. Rapidly changing stratigraphy, due to deposition and subsequent reworking.

5. Numerous oil and gas fields with stacked reservoirs, long hydrocarbon columns, and high producing rates. (9)

While it is true that the estimated oil reserves of Eugene have increased, the numbers are not extraordinary. The authors note that "From 1978 to 1988, these operations, activities, and natural factors [including better exploration and recovery technology] have increased ultimate recoverable reserves from 225 million bbl to 307 million bbl of hydrocarbon liquids and from 950 bcf to 1.65 tcf of gas." Other estimates now put the estimate of total recoverable oil as high as 400 Mb.

None of this is especially unusual for a North American oil field: most fields report reserve growth over time as a consequence of Securities and Exchange Commission reporting rules that require reserves to be booked yearly according to what portion of the resource is actually able to be extracted with current equipment in place. As more wells are drilled into the same reservoir, the reserves "grow." Then, as they are pumped out, reserves decline and production rates dwindle. No magic there.

Production from Eugene Island had achieved 20,000 barrels per day by 1989; by 1992 it had slipped to 15,000 b/d, but recovered to reach a peak of 30,000 b/d in 1996. Production from the reservoir has dropped steadily since then.

The evidence at Eugene Island suggests the existence of deep source rocks from which the reservoir is indeed very slowly refilling - but geologists working there do not hypothesize a primordial origin for the oil. In "Oil and Gas - 'Renewable Resources'?" Kathy Blanchard of PNL writes, "Recent geochemical research at Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution has demonstrated that the wide range in composition of the oils in different reservoirs of the Eugene Island 330 field can be related to one another and to a deeper source rock of Jurassic-Early Cretaceous age." (10) Her article explains that this kind of migration from nearby source rocks is hardly unique, and discusses it in the context of conventional biotic theory. A technical paper by David S. Holland, et al., "Eugene Island Block 330 Field - U.S.A. Offshore Louisiana," published by AAPG, notes that the Eugene Island oils show

abundant evidence of long-distance vertical migration. Based on a variety of biomarker and gasoline-range maturity indicators, these oils are estimated to have been generated at depths of 4572 to 4877 m (15,000 to 16,000 ft) at vitrinite reflectance maturities of 0.08 to 1.0% and temperatures of 150 to 170C (300 to 340F). Their presence in shallow, thermally immature reservoirs requires significant vertical migration. This is illustrated on Figure 36, which represents a burial and maturation history for the field at the time of petroleum migration, that is, at the end of Trimosina "A" time approximately 500,000 years ago. A plot of the present measured maturity values versus depth is superimposed on the calculated maturity profile for Trimosina "A" time to illustrate the close agreement between measured and predicted maturity profiles. The clear discrepancy between reservoir maturity and oil maturity is striking and suggests that the oil migrated more than 3650 m (12,000 ft) from a deep, possibly upper Miocene, source facies. Petroleum migration along faults is indicated based on the observed temperature and hydrocarbon anomalies at the surface and the distribution of pay in the subsurface. These results are consistent with those of Young et al. (1977), who concluded that most Gulf of Mexico oils originated 2438 to 3350 m (8000 to 11,000 ft) deeper than their reservoirs, from source beds 5 to 9 million years older than the reservoirs. (11)
...................
 
I certainly 2nd that, journalists have, if not a hidden agenda, an obligation to produce news articles on a daily basis and are not necesseralily more informed than Joe Blow.

YES. you only have to watch the journalists try to link reasons for daily price movements... Sometimes I reflect on the people who own a PLC biz. go to the market and release the bumper profit surge and then say right lets check our stock price..

ehh down 15 % ? what the, &*%&(()(&J*^^ ! :LOL:

Bloombergs a reet good larf watching them explain away the tics, beating the bear markets....... next minute ooppss , the index has tanked 200 points... :LOL:

"Bernie, lets cut to the weather mate, can we explain that one, for ****s sake.... !"

There is a new guy who does a mid session round up, and its good to watch his face, if he's smiling, sell into strength, if he seems a little depressed ,buy weakness. It's really quite a good indicator!

nice postings. Long live the journalists. Its not their fault and they do provide a vital service for industry, just not in the way they think, probably.
 
"Bloombergs a reet good larf watching them explain away the tics, beating the bear markets....... next minute ooppss , the index has tanked 200 points..."

It's certainly a constant source of daily amusement. They still haven't come up with an explanation about the Dow ending up ydy... :)
 
American Liberty: Is Oil a Fossil Fuel?
Is Oil a Fossil Fuel?

The forthcoming issue (Dec. 8) of the scientific journal Nature will contain an article that abundant quantities of methane have been conclusively shown to exist on Titan, one of the moons of Saturn. “We have determined that Titan's methane is not of biologic origin," reports Hasso Niemann of the Goddard Space Flight Center, a principal NASA investigator. Methane, a key hydrocarbon and the principal component of natural gas, actually has been found throughout the solar system. If methane can be produced by an abiotic (or abiogenic) process, so can more complex hydrocarbons. Once you have methane, “the rest is easy,” says Stanford Penner, Ph.D.

Dr. Penner, who is an authority on the Second Law of Thermodynamics, notes that Russian and Ukrainian scientists have produced an elegant proof that abiotic oil production (from intense pressure and high temperatures at least 100 kilometers below the earth's surface) is entirely consistent with the Second Law of Thermodynamics, but that no such proof has ever been put forth for the fossil fuel theory. In fact, he states that there is no “fossil fuel theory,” merely a hypothesis for which no proof has ever been set forth.

Furthermore, oil has been discovered in the earth's Archeozoic rock formations. These are the most ancient of rocks, which were formed before any plants or animals existed on earth. So petroleum here must have had an inorganic origin, rather than being produced from dead dinosaurs and ancient forests, as is commonly believed.

Finally, some older oil wells previously regarded as depleted have been known to be replenished from below. This is certainly evidence that oil is being produced at depths in the earth (where there are no fossil remains) and being pushed upward by intense pressure from below. The best example of this is Green Island in the Gulf of Mexico. When all the oil that could profitably be extracted had been pumped out, the wells there were closed and forgotten about. Then, twenty years later, those wells were found to contain more oil than before any had been removed! If petroleum is constantly produced by an inorganic process, we are never going to run out of oil.

All of which shows that political policies based on the idea that the world is running out of oil are based on a false theory. Just like claims about man-made global warming ruining the earth (see our new chart on global warming). Both ideas depend on “consensus,” a popular belief that prevails because of constant repetition rather than scientific proof.
 

interesting stuff, but at the end it says (to paraphrase) "all of this shows that oil isn't running out" .


To me, all that shows is an example of them clinging on to a theory themselves, rather than being open minded. Can oil be replenished? - maybe. But where are the facts about rate of use / rate of replenishment that would truly put it to bed? It's a crumb of science being used to justify a much larger conclusion - and not suprisingly from a source that wants us to believe that we're all being controlled / fooled.

I'm not necessarily saying that it's wrong, but let's not be fooled that there are no vested interests here. The BBC will exist (from our taxes, like it or not) no matter what their journo's write. Prisonplanet wont exist without conspiracy theories. Who's being controlled?

UTB
 
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interesting stuff, but at the end it says (to paraphrase) "all of this shows that oil isn't running out" .


To me, all that shows is an example of them clinging on to a theory themselves, rather than being open minded. Can oil be replenished? - maybe. But where are the facts about rate of use / rate of replenishment that would truly put it to bed? It's a crumb of science being used to justify a much larger conclusion - and not suprisingly from a source that wants us to belive that we're all being controlled / fooled.

I'm not necessarily saying that it's wrong, but let's not be fooled that there are no vested interests here. The BBC will exist (from our taxes, like it or not) no matter what their journo's write. Prisonplanet wont exist without conspiracy theories. Who's being controlled?

UTB

Absolutely, any source can skew their slant based on their agenda.
I posted those 2 links (that had nothing to do with prisonplanet btw) to illustrate simple talk, examples/proof of "refilling oil wells".
For all i cared the article could have also said that the neo-cons will lead us to world peace. Admittedly, the 2nd one is weak on links/references/examples etc. I can't do google searches all day long, i just wanted to illustrate the simple point.



As for the BBC etc. If people were unhappy with the yellow journalism, the repeats, the endless football coverage etc. and eg. a facebook campaign urging all citizens to stop paying their license fee became viral, and the majority of the country stopped paying their license fee, what would happen? Would all 40 million or so be sent to jail, or would the 40 million citizens bring about a change?
This is just one example of how we are controlled by a tiny entity. Other examples could include mass refusal to pay - wheely bin over-fill fines, council tax, speeding fines, high petrol prices, high electricity prices etc.

The public generally do not realise that they actually have the overwhelming power, and that the control currently rests with a tiny minority who are ruling & exploiting them! Power to the people!
 
....

We can convert sun power with planting tree's trees for fuel, maybe theres a future whereby we throw a few logs in the engine aswell as the fire !! yes we going back for our future........ Lumber is good ?

Tree power.

I still think alcohol, (ethanol) is the way to go. Sun grows sugar beet, then we ferment it further. Brazil is supposed to use ethanol-friendly cars already.
only problem is food/fuel balance, with respect to populations.
plus side, anyone can grow it themselves, and thus reduce external dependence.

JTrader: thanks for posting the abiotic oil article. Never come across that one before. Will read up on more articles (by geologists) about that.

Tenapeny has already beaten me to the OTEC article. Thats been one of my pet fave ideas for a long while.
 
I still think alcohol, (ethanol) is the way to go. Sun grows sugar beet, then we ferment it further. Brazil is supposed to use ethanol-friendly cars already.
only problem is food/fuel balance, with respect to populations.
plus side, anyone can grow it themselves, and thus reduce external dependence.


JTrader: thanks for posting the abiotic oil article. Never come across that one before. Will read up on more articles (by geologists) about that.

Tenapeny has already beaten me to the OTEC article. Thats been one of my pet fave ideas for a long while.

I still think electric powered cars is the way to go.
Sony Pictures Classics Presents : Who Killed the Electric Car?

Who Killed the Electric Car?
 
interesting stuff, but at the end it says (to paraphrase) "all of this shows that oil isn't running out" .


To me, all that shows is an example of them clinging on to a theory themselves, rather than being open minded. Can oil be replenished? - maybe. But where are the facts about rate of use / rate of replenishment that would truly put it to bed? It's a crumb of science being used to justify a much larger conclusion - and not suprisingly from a source that wants us to believe that we're all being controlled / fooled.

I'm not necessarily saying that it's wrong, but let's not be fooled that there are no vested interests here. The BBC will exist (from our taxes, like it or not) no matter what their journo's rite. Prisonplanet wont exist without conspiracy theories. Who's being controlled?

UTB

Oil is running out but, even if it is not, it is controlled by countries who have no love for the West. We are going to be held to ransom for oil and gas supplies by nations who resent us rather than like us and who have as much sympathy for us as we had for them in the past. The boot is on the other foot, so I am praying that our leaders and our brains can come up with something new.

Human ingenuity will have to come up with something, fast, or we will have to live according to what energy is available. I'm thinking of a Mad Max situation.

When I was young people lived near their jobs. A trip to the seaside was a major event for me. A new lifestyle has been built up around cheap and plentiful fuel, in which we commute hundreds of miles a week to work and travel further away on our holidays each year.

Everything must be tried but the product must become available in enormous quantities or it will always be expensive for everyday use.
 
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