TheBramble
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Wouldn't the term 'paramilitary' hint at some form of organised training though?
Atilla
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ABSOLUTELY!
What come back do any of us - law abiding & tax paying citizens have of getting back any of our money from the thieving politicians and bankers who have concerted to take from us.
THIS HAS GOT TO BE ONE OF THE BIGGEST ****ING THEFTS IN THE WORLD.
Pay off shareholder losses for taking risk through tax payers money.
Few low lives break some windows and the whole police force is out with riot shields wearing masks.
Bankers wreck the whole global economy and one gets away with £700,000 pension a year paying them selves 800% bonuse for the **** they've landed us in -whilst your labourer is lucky if he gets a 3-5% performance related bonus.
THE WHOLE ****ING SYSTEM IS BENT AND SCREWED.
WHAT COME BACK DO WE HAVE?
WHERE IS THE POLICE AND FSA AND WHY AREN'T THEY AFTER THESE FRAUDSTERS TO CLAIM BACK THEIR ILLEGALLY GAINED REWARDS.
I would like to conscienciously object to paying my tax until pensions and bonuses paid to these ******s are claimed back by the Inland Revenue....
How will I be treated if I hold back my VAT returns???
Crap Buddist
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Atilla you may wish to look into "lawful Rebllion" (essentially serving a legal notice to the Crown) as a means of expressing your concern,withdrawing your consent to the Crown and witholding your "Private" taxation payments.
Points to note. Doing business with the Crown Corporation.
The Crown rules ?
The Police work for/under the Crown
Solicitors are "officers of the court"
Courts are "officers of the Crown"
The police work for the state prosector (crown prosecutor)
The judge represents the ? You got it The Crown.
Your Council is also a Corporation of the Crown.
Again not all contracts with the Crown are bad. The crown offers protection to its citizens,limited liability for their actions etc and other benefits. But when statutes start to begin to harm man and his freedoms, people have a right to express and correct bad contracts or not consent to them.
Points to note. Doing business with the Crown Corporation.
The Crown rules ?
The Police work for/under the Crown
Solicitors are "officers of the court"
Courts are "officers of the Crown"
The police work for the state prosector (crown prosecutor)
The judge represents the ? You got it The Crown.
Your Council is also a Corporation of the Crown.
Again not all contracts with the Crown are bad. The crown offers protection to its citizens,limited liability for their actions etc and other benefits. But when statutes start to begin to harm man and his freedoms, people have a right to express and correct bad contracts or not consent to them.
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RedGreenBen
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I'm not sure it would. The term to me means something like 'having a role similar to the military' which would be a function of activity not of training.
They seem to be using violence, oppression and the threat of violence to achieve the state's objectives. That sounds more like a military activity than a civil one.
Remember when the police used to manage demonstrations by linking hands to contain crowds? Those were the days (and you could put your money in a bank and it would still be there when you wanted it etc etc!).
Ben
TheBramble
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My apologies, I was being facetious. My implication was that the police did not actually receive much, if any training at all.
TheBramble
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While I’m here, happened by some rather interesting advertising on a public phone box (UK) this morning.
It’s for the new (?) Police Terrorism Hotline.
It shows a wheelie bin full to brimming with old bottles of bleach and other such chemicals easily obtainable at supermarkets and hardware shops.
Can’t remember the byline verbatim, but something like “These wont go to make a bomb. Report anything suspicious. Don’t leave it to somebody else”. Then the 0800 number.
While it rather misses the point that any terrorist worth his salt would probably have access to retail suppliers of product necessary to make any device rather than have to depend on foraging in his/her neighbours’ wheelie bins, it does rather highlight the government’s on-going attempts to maintain, perhaps even increase, the nation’s sense of foreboding, fear and concern. Makes the proles that bit more pliable and easy to control.
And given the recent displays of Police ‘intelligence’ and beghaviour – do we really believe the people who it seems typically comprise this force are capable of protecting us from an apparently committed, intelligent, well funded and well organised group of hard core terrorists?
The reason we haven’t seen more terrorist atrocities is perhaps more appropriately explained by the simple fact they probably haven’t perpetrated any.
It’s for the new (?) Police Terrorism Hotline.
It shows a wheelie bin full to brimming with old bottles of bleach and other such chemicals easily obtainable at supermarkets and hardware shops.
Can’t remember the byline verbatim, but something like “These wont go to make a bomb. Report anything suspicious. Don’t leave it to somebody else”. Then the 0800 number.
While it rather misses the point that any terrorist worth his salt would probably have access to retail suppliers of product necessary to make any device rather than have to depend on foraging in his/her neighbours’ wheelie bins, it does rather highlight the government’s on-going attempts to maintain, perhaps even increase, the nation’s sense of foreboding, fear and concern. Makes the proles that bit more pliable and easy to control.
And given the recent displays of Police ‘intelligence’ and beghaviour – do we really believe the people who it seems typically comprise this force are capable of protecting us from an apparently committed, intelligent, well funded and well organised group of hard core terrorists?
The reason we haven’t seen more terrorist atrocities is perhaps more appropriately explained by the simple fact they probably haven’t perpetrated any.
Crap Buddist
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Hhmm yes, the terror threat is THE big Kahuna when it comes to controlling the behaviour of the people and removing a few more of their rights and freedoms.
If one looks at the Convention on Civil & Political rights that the United kingdom has signed up to along with most of the rest of the planet ,then under the derrogations of obligations section the United Kingdom (corporation status) Has since November 2001 declared a "Threat To The Nation" status,"until further notice". This threat is still perceived till this day some 7.5 years on.
Under these declared derogations then governments can be excused from certain legal obligations like right to detain, search, hold people especially if they quote the Anti Terrorism legislation.
That is their golden key to mass population control. Maintain the fear and threat of terrorism and they then use that to snoop very closely if they choose and detain terror suspects.
Like that diabetic chap was tasered on the bus in the uk because of his failing to respond properly etc. etc. Tasered under terror legislation and arrested.
What i want to know is when will the terror threat end ?
I don't think it's ever designed to from here on... seems a bit grim I know..
And lets not forget that school in Yorkshire was trying to get school children to think like a terrorist. How sick is that ?
You can bet your bottom Euro, that you ,the UK will have National ID cards to help counter immigrants, terrorism. People in europe are already being given fines on the spot for failing to produce their national ID.
Another cash cow for the Crown being created. Mass enrollment for National ID in the UK planned for 2012.
Showz uz yourz Paperz Pleazze...
If one looks at the Convention on Civil & Political rights that the United kingdom has signed up to along with most of the rest of the planet ,then under the derrogations of obligations section the United Kingdom (corporation status) Has since November 2001 declared a "Threat To The Nation" status,"until further notice". This threat is still perceived till this day some 7.5 years on.
Under these declared derogations then governments can be excused from certain legal obligations like right to detain, search, hold people especially if they quote the Anti Terrorism legislation.
That is their golden key to mass population control. Maintain the fear and threat of terrorism and they then use that to snoop very closely if they choose and detain terror suspects.
Like that diabetic chap was tasered on the bus in the uk because of his failing to respond properly etc. etc. Tasered under terror legislation and arrested.
What i want to know is when will the terror threat end ?
I don't think it's ever designed to from here on... seems a bit grim I know..
And lets not forget that school in Yorkshire was trying to get school children to think like a terrorist. How sick is that ?
You can bet your bottom Euro, that you ,the UK will have National ID cards to help counter immigrants, terrorism. People in europe are already being given fines on the spot for failing to produce their national ID.
Another cash cow for the Crown being created. Mass enrollment for National ID in the UK planned for 2012.
Showz uz yourz Paperz Pleazze...
0007
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48 hours since the police raids in the North West. I would've thought we might have heard "unofficially" about any bombs / chemicals / guns / real evidence etc by now. Is the "student vetting" issue just another political smokescreen? (they've had since 911 to sort that one out)
Hope this isn't another WMD debacle.
Hope this isn't another WMD debacle.
Atilla
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I was listening to Radio4 this afternoon and heard some of the accounts from the protesters and on the whole it was largely peaceful. One lady said they were trying to leave the area for up to 2 hours but would not be allowed through police corden.
Apparently with no warning one police officer breaks through two others in the line and shoves this lady hard. Another elderly lady standing behind her falls to the ground.
Police then shout and continue standing in their ground.
One other police constable who phoned in said he had often seen police use excessive force. It was some elements in the force who enjoyed the opportunity to have a fight with some easy prey.
He continued to add the police perspective is likely to be was reasonable force used and he could not see any other outcome.
On this talk show they also mentioned surveillance cameras. Funny how the police suddenly become camera shy and we have to try and find mobile phone films of these incidents when you simply know there are cameras in every corner in the city.
What gets me is on TV you see the police display a very nice gently gently softly softly approach to thugs and hard nuts disturbing the peace and causing trouble whilst on the other hand heavy handed physical approach to civilian protests.
With the police investigating them selves, there is no compulsion to weed out the bad temperament elements. I feel our police force is one of the best in the world but as with many other industries I can't help feeling that no action now and more cover-ups is likely to take us into another familiar route to decline and decay in a national asset.
RedGreenBen
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No, my apologies, you were being subtly facetious and (after 12 hours of trading) I totally missed your fair point.
Still thugs though
Ben
TheHoneyMonster
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There is no doubt that police forces are becoming more and more militarised all across the UK, in unison with other western countries.
Go to any major city in the UK and theres a fair chance that police officers you see will be carrying tasers AIUK : USA: Tasers: New report reveals rising USA death toll
Last year a manchester police marksmen was shot and killed during training.
I've seen a firearms response team respond to a seemingly harmless incident in a hotel, where a couple of black african fellas had refused to leave. The SWAT team were quickly on the scene, entered very agressively with their machine guns, had the men pinned to the ground, before eventuually removing them, for whatever minor offence they had committed, but with big public buildings it would seem police no longer take any chances.
Still, the incident was quite shocking to witness, and you could see how it could easily have got further out of hand had the men responded in any other way than a docile way, with all that police testosterone flowing.
When one of the marksmen inside the building saw a few of us watching through a discreet window, he came over banged on it, and with a very hostile look on his face, signalled for us to clear off. Presumably the fewer witnesses to such incidents the better. Never good to argue with, wind up or provoke a man with a machine gun though.
Go to any major city in the UK and theres a fair chance that police officers you see will be carrying tasers AIUK : USA: Tasers: New report reveals rising USA death toll
Last year a manchester police marksmen was shot and killed during training.
I've seen a firearms response team respond to a seemingly harmless incident in a hotel, where a couple of black african fellas had refused to leave. The SWAT team were quickly on the scene, entered very agressively with their machine guns, had the men pinned to the ground, before eventuually removing them, for whatever minor offence they had committed, but with big public buildings it would seem police no longer take any chances.
Still, the incident was quite shocking to witness, and you could see how it could easily have got further out of hand had the men responded in any other way than a docile way, with all that police testosterone flowing.
When one of the marksmen inside the building saw a few of us watching through a discreet window, he came over banged on it, and with a very hostile look on his face, signalled for us to clear off. Presumably the fewer witnesses to such incidents the better. Never good to argue with, wind up or provoke a man with a machine gun though.
Atilla
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I hate to say this but I don't think this incident was as bad as the Tomlinson unprovoked push behind the back.
I'd say a back hand and a small swipe at the legs reasonable to someone who was shouting and aggressive. There were other gits yelling and screaming too.
karl6666
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bored hippies
The death after a good shove was an accident, doesnt anybody watch rugby.
These smelly hippies could of done a peaceful demo in the park its big enough.
The bird with the bushy f@nny is going to sue the police for brutality after being hit with a flexi trungeon, she was told to move why didnt she just turn around and go home, the police should have pepper sprayed them all and thrown them in the cells for a week. The police did nothing wrong.
Imagine my wife and young son caught up in the mesh whilst she was doing the shopping.Smashing windows and trying to burn down buildings
Im 43 and never been in a fight or caught up in such a mess in all my life.
K
The death after a good shove was an accident, doesnt anybody watch rugby.
These smelly hippies could of done a peaceful demo in the park its big enough.
The bird with the bushy f@nny is going to sue the police for brutality after being hit with a flexi trungeon, she was told to move why didnt she just turn around and go home, the police should have pepper sprayed them all and thrown them in the cells for a week. The police did nothing wrong.
Imagine my wife and young son caught up in the mesh whilst she was doing the shopping.Smashing windows and trying to burn down buildings
Im 43 and never been in a fight or caught up in such a mess in all my life.
K
0007
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The death after a good shove was an accident, doesnt anybody watch rugby.
These smelly hippies could of done a peaceful demo in the park its big enough.
The bird with the bushy f@nny is going to sue the police for brutality after being hit with a flexi trungeon, she was told to move why didnt she just turn around and go home, the police should have pepper sprayed them all and thrown them in the cells for a week. The police did nothing wrong.
Imagine my wife and young son caught up in the mesh whilst she was doing the shopping.Smashing windows and trying to burn down buildings
Im 43 and never been in a fight or caught up in such a mess in all my life.
K
And what happens if you get a party in power eg like the Nazis? Where's your democracy gone then?
Atilla
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The death after a good shove was an accident, doesnt anybody watch rugby.
These smelly hippies could of done a peaceful demo in the park its big enough.
The bird with the bushy f@nny is going to sue the police for brutality after being hit with a flexi trungeon, she was told to move why didnt she just turn around and go home, the police should have pepper sprayed them all and thrown them in the cells for a week. The police did nothing wrong.
Imagine my wife and young son caught up in the mesh whilst she was doing the shopping.Smashing windows and trying to burn down buildings
Im 43 and never been in a fight or caught up in such a mess in all my life.
K
Strange I've never seen an accidental shove like that before. Lemme guess it's ok for police to happy slap people???
My friend Dave once did a rugby tackle on me when we were playing football. My legs went up in the air and I was not expecting it and went free falling - waving hands in the air as if like a bird trying to fly whilst looking for a branch to cling to.
Mate it was one of the most scariest moments of my life when I wasn't expecting it. If I was older with a heart condition that would have, I'm sure taken me out.
I still would have forgiven Dave as it was after all a game of football and poor ******* got over zealous and confused!!!
But that was unwarranted and NO FREAKING ACCIDENT!
What is worse is that they were hitting women and normal protestors with the edge of their shields on their heads and necks. When all they wanted to do was go home...
Imagine your child and wife caught with the edge of shield on the side of their head.
That's the problem with people there is right and there is wrong. Don't take sides and justify acts.
Do you think that copper striking the legs and shoving Mr Tomlinson didn't realise he would experience pain or fall on the floor?
ASK THE QUESTION WHAT WAS HIS INTENTION?
ASK THE QUESTION WHY HE DID WHAT HE DID? If he is a thrill seeker he should try base jumping or something...
WHY DID ALL THOSE OTHER COPPERS STAND THERE AND WATCH HIM?
For you to say that death was accidental is dellusion. You are in denial.
You punch someone in the head and 4 hours later dies from an haemorrhage - you may not have killed him but you have contributed or accellerated the cause of death. G20 man 'died of haemorrhage' - Yahoo! News UK
Freaking sad world we live in when people can't decipher what is right and what is wrong.
Atilla
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karl6666
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Strange I've never seen an accidental shove like that before. Lemme guess it's ok for police to happy slap people???
My friend Dave once did a rugby tackle on me when we were playing football. My legs went up in the air and I was not expecting it and went free falling - waving hands in the air as if like a bird trying to fly whilst looking for a branch to cling to.
Mate it was one of the most scariest moments of my life when I wasn't expecting it. If I was older with a heart condition that would have, I'm sure taken me out.
I still would have forgiven Dave as it was after all a game of football and poor ******* got over zealous and confused!!!
But that was unwarranted and NO FREAKING ACCIDENT!
What is worse is that they were hitting women and normal protestors with the edge of their shields on their heads and necks. When all they wanted to do was go home...
Imagine your child and wife caught with the edge of shield on the side of their head.
That's the problem with people there is right and there is wrong. Don't take sides and justify acts.
Do you think that copper striking the legs and shoving Mr Tomlinson didn't realise he would experience pain or fall on the floor?
ASK THE QUESTION WHAT WAS HIS INTENTION?
ASK THE QUESTION WHY HE DID WHAT HE DID? If he is a thrill seeker he should try base jumping or something...
WHY DID ALL THOSE OTHER COPPERS STAND THERE AND WATCH HIM?
For you to say that death was accidental is dellusion. You are in denial.
You punch someone in the head and 4 hours later dies from an haemorrhage - you may not have killed him but you have contributed or accellerated the cause of death. G20 man 'died of haemorrhage' - Yahoo! News UK
Freaking sad world we live in when people can't decipher what is right and what is wrong.
death prevented, he turned around and went to the pub .........easy. he was trying to walk through a police blockage, they are armed with batons, shields and coshes. let me guess, his family will sue the police, sell the story to the daily mail, make a film out of it, trevor mcdonald show, oprah winphrey.............
we was pushed over....... it wouldnt have made the media if it was a football supporter at the local match, just another daily paper selling frenzi
MP s creaming there exs, now that is serious, they want pepper spray and rubber bullets
:smart:
Mr. Charts
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Spot onStrange I've never seen an accidental shove like that before. Lemme guess it's ok for police to happy slap people???
My friend Dave once did a rugby tackle on me when we were playing football. My legs went up in the air and I was not expecting it and went free falling - waving hands in the air as if like a bird trying to fly whilst looking for a branch to cling to.
Mate it was one of the most scariest moments of my life when I wasn't expecting it. If I was older with a heart condition that would have, I'm sure taken me out.
I still would have forgiven Dave as it was after all a game of football and poor ******* got over zealous and confused!!!
But that was unwarranted and NO FREAKING ACCIDENT!
What is worse is that they were hitting women and normal protestors with the edge of their shields on their heads and necks. When all they wanted to do was go home...
Imagine your child and wife caught with the edge of shield on the side of their head.
That's the problem with people there is right and there is wrong. Don't take sides and justify acts.
Do you think that copper striking the legs and shoving Mr Tomlinson didn't realise he would experience pain or fall on the floor?
ASK THE QUESTION WHAT WAS HIS INTENTION?
ASK THE QUESTION WHY HE DID WHAT HE DID? If he is a thrill seeker he should try base jumping or something...
WHY DID ALL THOSE OTHER COPPERS STAND THERE AND WATCH HIM?
For you to say that death was accidental is dellusion. You are in denial.
You punch someone in the head and 4 hours later dies from an haemorrhage - you may not have killed him but you have contributed or accellerated the cause of death. G20 man 'died of haemorrhage' - Yahoo! News UK
Freaking sad world we live in when people can't decipher what is right and what is wrong.
Absolutely agree Atilla - but what do you expect??!!
Currently police officers earn, I dunno, 25 - 30k.
With the role of police officer comes alot of power. For 25k you are not going to attract the calibre of candidate that has the accumen / ability / intelligence to handle this power and responsibility - it goes to their heads; "give a man a uniform..."as the saying goes.
Cynical but true. Just look at the sequence of events over the G20 protests - you put a bunch of people who do not posess the skills to act in an appropriate manner in the middle of a couple of thousand p!ssed of hippies, give them sticks and shields, and don't expect trouble.
The same can be said of alot of roles like this (teachers are also a good example). They just arent paid well enough to attract the best people for the job.
Currently police officers earn, I dunno, 25 - 30k.
With the role of police officer comes alot of power. For 25k you are not going to attract the calibre of candidate that has the accumen / ability / intelligence to handle this power and responsibility - it goes to their heads; "give a man a uniform..."as the saying goes.
Cynical but true. Just look at the sequence of events over the G20 protests - you put a bunch of people who do not posess the skills to act in an appropriate manner in the middle of a couple of thousand p!ssed of hippies, give them sticks and shields, and don't expect trouble.
The same can be said of alot of roles like this (teachers are also a good example). They just arent paid well enough to attract the best people for the job.
