Lord Anton Kreil

[BasisSpreads]

Maybe! Still no need for you to be offensive!

Maybe Im offensive but he gets on my nerve with his "im a pro goldman trader and everyone else is inferior to my pro knowledge" behavior. And you have come here with exactly his same behavior with the exact same quotes and feeling of superiority in what he teaches.

What you should understand for real is that there are HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of Investment Bankers with his profile, employees of banks who work in finance, and a TINY BIT of INDEPENDENT Traders who constantly make money. These are the gems, not an ex employee.

 

[MungoBoy]

Maybe Im offensive but he gets on my nerve with his "im a pro goldman trader and everyone else is inferior to my pro knowledge" behavior. And you have come here with exactly his same behavior with the exact same quotes and feeling of superiority in what he teaches.

So you thought that I was Anton ? A guy from germany, full of english grammar and spelling errors ?

I was only repsonding to the guy named @thefaithfulservant who also kept PM'ing me for further feedback.

So the best thing I came up with, was to reply publicly so others could read my personal impressions with the video series.

What you should understand for real is that there are HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of Investment Bankers with his profile, employees of banks who work in finance, and a TINY BIT of INDEPENDENT Traders who constantly make money. These are the gems, not an ex employee.

Yes this most likely is the case!

But it still doesn't invalidate the contents of the PTM and PFTM series as a source of information!

And I better rely to someone who has some proper education in economics than listening to some baker or mason, who tries to sell their uneducated and overpriced stuff to people.

 

[joetroscoe]

I recently completely these courses. I paid for them. They are probably 1500 dollars because of the need to price people out who are going to distribute the videos. It's the same reason that when rents get too low, it is time to move. As far as the content of the courses, unlike what some speculators on the course content say on this thread, the course tells you how to find assets to trade, which assets to select, when to trade them, how much to risk, and when to add. It is all in there. The course was good for me as an intermediate trader because I did not pay much attention to fundamentals in the past. The course shows you how you can prove to yourself that daytrading is difficult most of the time and when to day trade when to opportunity does come. It tells you everything you need to know to generate trade ideas. I should have done this a long time ago.

 

[foroom lluzers]

Is this thread akin to 95% club who can't , those who can do and Anton fighting for a pitch to educate others or others fighting for pitches?

Please tell me I want to know!

 

[joetroscoe]

Is this thread akin to 95% club who can't , those who can do and Anton fighting for a pitch to educate others or others fighting for pitches?

Please tell me I want to know!

Okay I will tell you.

This thread is showing the 95% of the too cheap or too poor that want to know what inside the course but don't want to pay for it. Typical welfare mentality if you ask me, wanting something for nothing. Every favorable view of the material is put down as either Anton himself, or a fan boy of Anton. The Institute is at it's core a headhunting enterprise set up to train, monitor and then place talent. The trader gets good training and maybe placement into the industry with a valid track record. The Institute gets traders to trade the Institutes money and kickback from hedge funds for placing already trained talent. It is a win win situation for everybody. The brokers get an inflow of winning clients which means bigger commissions. The institute does not receive IB fees from any of their global brokers. Their business plan is transparent and there are no conflicts of interest.

 

[edmond360]

Okay I will tell you.

This thread is showing the 95% of the too cheap or too poor that want to know what inside the course but don't want to pay for it. Typical welfare mentality if you ask me, wanting something for nothing. Every favorable view of the material is put down as either Anton himself, or a fan boy of Anton. The Institute is at it's core a headhunting enterprise set up to train, monitor and then place talent. The trader gets good training and maybe placement into the industry with a valid track record. The Institute gets traders to trade the Institutes money and kickback from hedge funds for placing already trained talent. It is a win win situation for everybody. The brokers get an inflow of winning clients which means bigger commissions. The institute does not receive IB fees from any of their global brokers. Their business plan is transparent and there are no conflicts of interest.

Yes he is himself at pains to keep pointing that out. If you listen to him then he's obviously not a fraud, is a former professional trader, knows what he is talking about, and is running a proper business for good reasons. He does deserve more credit and respect than he gets.

However, that does not mean his investment process will make you money once you start using it. I'm sure you have the same question and that is why you've read through this thread looking for answers to that. Let me help you out with my opinion, his methods are now obsolete and no longer work or at best generate very modest returns. I'm sure that when he was a professional trader his methods were all the rage and the way to get double digit returns, but like all things, if you use them today you're talking single digit returns (partly because of the public availability of economic data and it subsequently being priced into the market, and partly because of the sheer size and number of hedge funds today who all use the same data and who constitute a large part of the market you are trying to predict). Go look at the performance of global macro funds today, see how many are losing money or closing down. Ask yourself why the Institute do not make their own returns publically available. My guess is that they make their money from event driven strategies based upon 'off-the-grid' information and insight, none of which can or has been taught to you.

So where does that leave most people? They aren't interested in working hard for very modest returns, they'd be better off taking those £3k course fees and gambling them on the markets using admittedly less professional methods, but at least with the chance of getting lucky and winning big. With the rest of your wealth, you're better off taking the warren buffet approach of making smart investments and holding them until retirement. You'll stand to get better returns doing that rather than actively trading in and out of positions using the Institute's methods which will only cost you more in fees and missed dividends.

 

[joetroscoe]

Yes he is himself at pains to keep pointing that out. If you listen to him then he's obviously not a fraud, is a former professional trader, knows what he is talking about, and is running a proper business for good reasons. He does deserve more credit and respect than he gets.

However, that does not mean his investment process will make you money once you start using it. I'm sure you have the same question and that is why you've read through this thread looking for answers to that. Let me help you out with my opinion, his methods are now obsolete and no longer work or at best generate very modest returns. I'm sure that when he was a professional trader his methods were all the rage and the way to get double digit returns, but like all things, if you use them today you're talking single digit returns (partly because of the public availability of economic data and it subsequently being priced into the market, and partly because of the sheer size and number of hedge funds today who all use the same data and who constitute a large part of the market you are trying to predict). Go look at the performance of global macro funds today, see how many are losing money or closing down. Ask yourself why the Institute do not make their own returns publically available. My guess is that they make their money from event driven strategies based upon 'off-the-grid' information and insight, none of which can or has been taught to you.

So where does that leave most people? They aren't interested in working hard for very modest returns, they'd be better off taking those £3k course fees and gambling them on the markets using admittedly less professional methods, but at least with the chance of getting lucky and winning big. With the rest of your wealth, you're better off taking the warren buffet approach of making smart investments and holding them until retirement. You'll stand to get better returns doing that rather than actively trading in and out of positions using the Institute's methods which will only cost you more in fees and missed dividends.

Actually, I went to this thread because I read all the reviews, bought the course anyway, paid 1500 and finished it in five days of continuous study. I wanted to see whether or not his critics had actually taken the course. Turns out that most of them haven't. As far as returns go, I don't think you can make the returns of yesteryear because volatility has dried up, for now. He himself admits this in one of the freebies. So each potential spread has to be analyzed to determine if it is even worth the trouble. And even then, the trade could go wrong. Nothing about trading is easy. The methods in the course are method that will withstand market changes, which is nicest thing about it. Just go the process, put on the trades, cut losses, ride winners, keep refreshing the trade ideas and on it goes. Anton himself states these methods are to teach to get rich over a lifetime. At the very very best it would take you seven years to begin to feel a life changing impact. It was a great course. I just wish I had done it a few years ago.

 

[foroom lluzers]

Actually, I went to this thread because I read all the reviews, bought the course anyway, paid 1500 and finished it in five days of continuous study. I wanted to see whether or not his critics had actually taken the course. Turns out that most of them haven't. As far as returns go, I don't think you can make the returns of yesteryear because volatility has dried up, for now. He himself admits this in one of the freebies. So each potential spread has to be analyzed to determine if it is even worth the trouble. And even then, the trade could go wrong. Nothing about trading is easy. The methods in the course are method that will withstand market changes, which is nicest thing about it. Just go the process, put on the trades, cut losses, ride winners, keep refreshing the trade ideas and on it goes. Anton himself states these methods are to teach to get rich over a lifetime. At the very very best it would take you seven years to begin to feel a life changing impact. It was a great course. I just wish I had done it a few years ago.

Anton sounds very muck like a T2W member , does he post here?

 

[joetroscoe]

Anton sounds very muck like a T2W member , does he post here?

Very unlikely. No reason. The Institute has it's own community of traders. Here is yet another example inferring that Anton needs to post on a forum to promote a course that most of you cannot afford. What is the purpose of that? I will tell you this, if you can afford it, meaning that you can put up a five figure trading account in addition to this information, then you should definitely do it. There is no real point in paying what he asks for the course if you do not plan to become an Institute trader. It would be better to use that money for something else. The course is not for everyone. Again, this is spelled out from the start. The Institute is an organization for retail traders to learn to be their own hedge fund managers. They are so serious about this that with some brokers they have an agreement to rebate Institute traders until the price of the course is recouped, so the education is free. They are interested in the money that a hedge fund will pay a qualified trader with a proven track record. That is how they get their basic salary.

 

[edmond360]

Actually, I went to this thread because I read all the reviews, bought the course anyway, paid 1500 and finished it in five days of continuous study. I wanted to see whether or not his critics had actually taken the course. Turns out that most of them haven't. As far as returns go, I don't think you can make the returns of yesteryear because volatility has dried up, for now. He himself admits this in one of the freebies. So each potential spread has to be analyzed to determine if it is even worth the trouble. And even then, the trade could go wrong. Nothing about trading is easy. The methods in the course are method that will withstand market changes, which is nicest thing about it. Just go the process, put on the trades, cut losses, ride winners, keep refreshing the trade ideas and on it goes. Anton himself states these methods are to teach to get rich over a lifetime. At the very very best it would take you seven years to begin to feel a life changing impact. It was a great course. I just wish I had done it a few years ago.

It's very easy to see that the course is not ridiculously priced garbage like pretty much everything else out there. But you should still be very careful about putting five figure amounts into a method you've spent five days learning! Anton is a very polished speaker, his presentation skills are extremely persuasive and if you sit through a course narrated by him, obviously 99% of people are going to be taken in by it all and think they've learned something amazing. These are what people who've been applying similar methods for decades are saying about the market...

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...s-micro-returns-cast-pall-over-one-time-stars

 

[joetroscoe]

It's very easy to see that the course is not ridiculously priced garbage like pretty much everything else out there. But you should still be very careful about putting five figure amounts into a method you've spent five days learning! Anton is a very polished speaker, his presentation skills are extremely persuasive and if you sit through a course narrated by him, obviously 99% of people are going to be taken in by it all and think they've learned something amazing. These are what people who've been applying similar methods for decades are saying about the market...

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...s-micro-returns-cast-pall-over-one-time-stars

I finished the course in five days because I am an intermediate trader. I WAS a technical trader for 15 years. So a lot of Anton said, I knew. It is not about his oratory, it is the fact that he puts out a process and gives excel sheets and data so you can see for yourself. That is why I am defending the course. A beginner should probably go for the yearly course. The institute tells you how and when to trade. Volatility is terrible right now. Without looking at the books of the hedge funds, it is impossible to say whether macro works or not. What is the fund long and short of? Did they study volatility? I am sure many of these funds did. Volatility is just not there right now. Did they structure options trades? What did these funds do to max what little returns are available? I now have a deep disdain for media in general, financial media in particular. Retail traders are hedge fund managers. So we should build portfolios and wait this out. The actual point of this thread is to ask about the Institute. You have a PTM grad talking to you right now.

 

[foroom lluzers]

I finished the course in five days because I am an intermediate trader. I WAS a technical trader for 15 years. So a lot of Anton said, I knew.

So hedge funds recruit over 35 years of age as traders?

 

[joetroscoe]

So hedge funds recruit over 35 years of age as traders?

Not really sure. I was pointing out that they do place traders with track records. The main thing is that you are given an education, job opportunity, and a reliable platform. Hard to beat that.

 

[foroom lluzers]

Not really sure. I was pointing out that they do place traders with track records. The main thing is that you are given an education, job opportunity, and a reliable platform. Hard to beat that.

The main thing is that you are given an education and a fool and his money are parted.

 

[joetroscoe]

The main thing is that you are given an education and a fool and his money are parted.

The thing I find astonishing about this conversation is that you act as if 1500 dollars is a lot of money. Yes, it is important to get a proper education so that you will not be floundering around and ultimately lose much more money. Penny wise and pound foolish they call it in the UK. If you think that 1500 US is a lot of money then you have no business trading anyway. Come back when you are qualified to play this game. That is not an insult, that is reality. Contrary to forum beliefs, you need a certain amount of money to make this worth your efforts.

 

[foroom lluzers]

The thing I find astonishing about this conversation is that you act as if 1500 dollars is a lot of money. Yes, it is important to get a proper education so that you will not be floundering around and ultimately lose much more money. Penny wise and pound foolish they call it in the UK. If you think that 1500 US is a lot of money then you have no business trading anyway. Come back when you are qualified to play this game. That is not an insult, that is reality. Contrary to forum beliefs, you need a certain amount of money to make this worth your efforts.

Education can be gained by searching on google , listening to youtube videos . reading some of the articles on this forum , maybe some discussions on forums can give better education on how to lose fast and others can teach not to lose.As regards the dangling carrot of jobs with hedge funds , I am doubtful if hedge funds will take on 35 year olds as you say .

I did not mean to be insulting , when I stated a fool and his money are parted , I just felt it had a dangling carrot.

What is your verified record of placements with hedge funds.

 

[darktone]

The thing I find astonishing about this conversation is that you act as if 1500 dollars is a lot of money. Yes, it is important to get a proper education so that you will not be floundering around and ultimately lose much more money. Penny wise and pound foolish they call it in the UK. If you think that 1500 US is a lot of money then you have no business trading anyway. Come back when you are qualified to play this game. That is not an insult, that is reality. Contrary to forum beliefs, you need a certain amount of money to make this worth your efforts.

You have remember that youre talking to a grade A bellend, then its no so astonishing
FWIW, from what Ive seen, I like Antons approach to risk. 4/1 is professional, 63/1 is tarder.

 

[joetroscoe]

Education can be gained by searching on google , listening to youtube videos . reading some of the articles on this forum , maybe some discussions on forums can give better education on how to lose fast and others can teach not to lose.As regards the dangling carrot of jobs with hedge funds , I am doubtful if hedge funds will take on 35 year olds as you say .

I did not mean to be insulting , when I stated a fool and his money are parted , I just felt it had a dangling carrot.

What is your verified record of placements with hedge funds.

100%

I wanted to learn how not to be a punter, and that is what I received. It completely changed how I run my money. Now you are right, you can watch videos and hope that you can put the pieces together, sort of like a monkey banging on a typewriter and producing Shakespeare, or you can get a little money, invest in some people who have actually done the business and get a structured framework to operate from. People on trading forums get this whole concept backwards. We are trying to make money rather than control risk. We cannot place good stops because we have no concept of volatility of an asset. We over leverage, we concentrate too much risk into one asset class. On and on it goes.

 

[edmond360]

100%

I wanted to learn how not to be a punter, and that is what I received. It completely changed how I run my money. Now you are right, you can watch videos and hope that you can put the pieces together, sort of like a monkey banging on a typewriter and producing Shakespeare, or you can get a little money, invest in some people who have actually done the business and get a structured framework to operate from. People on trading forums get this whole concept backwards. We are trying to make money rather than control risk. We cannot place good stops because we have no concept of volatility of an asset. We over leverage, we concentrate too much risk into one asset class. On and on it goes.

The 'volatility' you're talking about is just a statistical approximation of the 'price action' which the people on forums talk about. So going from decent accuracy to approximation is not the way to do it. Think of it like this, a volatility statistic cannot capture the difference between a market trading like 'V' compared to one trading like 'W' or 'WWW' or 'I____' and numerous other possibilities. So who's really going to place the better stop, the guy using a statistic from historical data or the guy actually watching the market trade?

You can't plug price action into a Black-Scholes model, so this is why professional traders have developed techniques which rely upon a statistical approximation. It is not necessarily superior. The problem now is professional traders are not mathematicians or academics, they don't know the inner workings of how to model the economy using equations, they've just been taught to plug this number into this spreadsheet and bob's your uncle. When the economy changes, and certain approximations no longer hold the way they used to 30 years ago, those professionals lose money Anton included, and they lack the mathematical knowledge to be able to modify their models.

 

[iq200]

The proof of the pudding is in the eating

These kind of threads are funny because people who either don't trade or who aren't profitable fight to disprove some other course or prove the course they did was the best under the sun. If you can't make money after taking a course then what good is it??