Why do a few succeed?

Its weekend so maybe this can spark some fundamental discussion.

Succeed in what respect, one might ask.

Lets keep it simple and define success in trading as an income thats twice as much as your current boss makes. Thats in case you still have one.

If you dont have a boss - also not in prison or any kind of (mental) institute - and still care to share, especially for you "why did you succeed?"

I think its understanding your market, the ability to act in a businesslike manner and proper funding.

superfly said:

I think its understanding your market, the ability to act in a businesslike manner and proper funding.

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It is difficult to understand trading as there are many factors to consider and a lot of noise to disregard.

I have simplified my system to a 50/50 chance of getting it right having cancelled out time in the short run to be insignificant. It's up or down.

The rest is down to money management and risk reward ratio.

Technical Analysis comes last to confirm direction.

That's the theory. Why do so few succeed? Because practice is always much harder than theory. The two are not necessarily compatible either as one is led to believe.

I would like to know if anybody has learnt to ride a bicycle by reading about it?

Because trading looks easy. The sad fact is, most end up

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showthread.php?t=18797&page=1&pp=10

A bit of this wont hurt

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TibQ_1zH3U
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EueFhYZ4HxI&feature=PlayList&p=A1C08DCB429445BC&index=13

laptop1 said:

Because trading looks easy. The sad fact is, most end up

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showthread.php?t=18797&page=1&pp=10

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Thanks, thats why the central question to me is "how to succeed" and what common/personal skill is eminent for that success.

For example the ability to align all strategic, tactical and operational activitities closely to the chosen window/view on the target market, must be one of those common skills.

superfly said:

Thanks, thats why the central question to me is "how to succeed" and what common/personal skill is eminent for that succes.

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Tenacity

Z

zupcon said:

Tenacity

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Had to look up the meaning:

Of such tenacity his grip
That nothing from his hand can slip.
Well-buttered eels you may o'erwhelm
In tubs of liquid slippery-elm
In vain -- from his detaining pinch
They cannot struggle half an inch!
'Tis lucky that he so is planned
That breath he draws not with his hand,
For if he did, so great his greed
He'd draw his last with eager speed.
Nay, that were well, you say. Not so
He'd draw but never let it go!

Prince Wen Hui's cook was cutting up an ox. . . . The ox fell apart with a whisper. The bright cleaver murmured like a gentle wind. Rhythm! Timing! Like a sacred dance. . . . Prince Wen Hui: Good work! Your method is faultless! The cook: Method? What I follow is Tao beyond all methods! When I first began to cut up oxen I would see before me the whole ox all in one mass. After three years I no longer saw this mass. I saw the distinctions. But now I see nothing with the eye. My whole being apprehends. My senses are idle. The spirit free to work without plan follows its own instinct guided by natural line, by the secret opening, the hidden space, my cleaver finds its own way... Then I withdraw the blade, I stand still and let the joy of the work sink in. I clean the blade and put it away. Prince Wan Hui: This is it! My cook has shown me how I ought to live my own life!"
~ Chuang Tzu (c.360 BC-c. 275 BC)

superfly said:

Its weekend so maybe this can spark some fundamental discussion.

Succeed in what respect, one might ask.

Lets keep it simple and define success in trading as an income thats twice as mutch as your current boss makes. Thats in case you still have one.

If you dont have a boss - also not in prison or any kind of (mental) institute - and still care to share, especially for you "why did you succeed?"

Click to expand...

I think that very few people treat trading in the business-like way that it requires.

If you were going to start your own business, you would spend a great deal of time making a business plan, securing the right finance, calculating your break-even requirements, etc.

I think that the successful traders are those that are prepared to work hard and don't see trading as an easy route to wealth. In my opinion, successful traders could probably be successful in any endeavour that they decided to put their minds to.


Thanks

Damian

"how to succeed" ...a decent starting point is give your brain as little down time as possible. It doesn't need much rest really

Let me put it this way..take two guys doing the same job for 20 years ...one has 20 x 1 years experience whilst the other has 20 years experience. For clarity the first guy learned little new after the honeymoon period whilst the 2nd guy has continued to actively think about how he does his job and probably will continue to do so for as long as he does it.
Underlying the above is a mass of data involving personal character traits.

chump said:

"how to succeed" ...a decent starting point is give your brain as little down time as possible. It doesn't need much rest really

Let me put it this way..take two guys doing the same job for 20 years ...one has 20 x 1 years experience whilst the other has 20 years experience. For clarity the first guy learned little new after the honeymoon period whilst the 2nd guy has continued to actively think about how he does his job and probably will continue to do so for as long as he does it.
Underlying the above is a mass of data involving personal character traits.

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and don forget the processing while you sleep.

damianoakley said:

I think that very few people treat trading in the business-like way that it requires.

If you were going to start your own business, you would spend a great deal of time making a business plan, securing the right finance, calculating your break-even requirements, etc.

I think that the successful traders are those that are prepared to work hard and don't see trading as an easy route to wealth. In my opinion, successful traders could probably be successful in any endeavour that they decided to put their minds to.


Thanks

Damian

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thesis:
to be a big trader you must be good at exploiting a sound and robust businessmodel to the max
you dont have to be a brilliant technician

"and don forget the processing while you sleep." ...I find between 4am and rising time one of the very best times for thinking through issues ...some of my best insights come at that time of day when I am not distracted by anything else.

chump said:

"and don forget the processing while you sleep." ...I find between 4am and rising time one of the very best times for thinking through issues ...some of my best insights come at that time of day when I am not distracted by anything else.

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the clarity of early mornings are priceless
"when I am not distracted by anything else" that is one of the reasons I always look forward to long yourneys by plain/train
in addition to that, turbulence during flights always help me see things very clearly

thanX

Don't get carried away by the "upside" possibilities. Study the "downside" and the "What if" possibilities, too..

A well known poster has sold naked puts. The chances of him pulling off the trades are very good. It has been estimated that he could make 25,000 pounds. That is the upside. The downside is that if there is a crash down to say below 5800 on Footsie he could lose 800,000. Worth it? He, obviously, thinks that it is. Personally, I would not touch those odds, however unlikely the downside is likely to occurr, witrh a bargepole. Success is based on making 25000 pounds for a risk of 2500 because the process can repeated. 25,000 to 800,000 will catch you, perhaps not this time but, sooner or later.

I've taken advantage of this thread to emphasise the point because of the thousands of viewers watching the relevant thread.

Split

chump said:

"and don forget the processing while you sleep." ...I find between 4am and rising time one of the very best times for thinking through issues ...some of my best insights come at that time of day when I am not distracted by anything else.

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There is a technique which takes advantage of this 'phenomenon'. Before you go to sleep you can ask your subconscious to think about a particular problem and let you know it's thoughts next day.
I have used it many many times and it does work.
Can't remember where I found it years ago, so no link or reference to post. However here's a basic rule-set: -

1. The 'problem' should be realistic and capable of a solution or at least of new ideas.
2. You have to praise your subconscious for it's ability to be be so clever and knowing in sorting problems out for you and thank it for accepting the challenges you give it.
3. You have to ask your subconscious for permission to give it the task of thinking about the current problem. How do you do this because you need a Yes or No answer ? One way is to say to your sub that if the answer is no, then you will get an itch on your hand (or wherever you select). If no itch then answer is Yes. Or vice versa. If you get a yes, carry on... If you get a no, then respect it and try again another day.

4. Then you describe the problem or whatever it is in as simple terms as you can. No embellishment or waffle - just the nitty gritty.
(All the above 'talking' to your sub can be done out loud or in you head.)
5. Then you can go to sleep and let it get on with the job.
6. Next day somethng new will pop into your head. Thank and praise your sub again. Of course you may not get an answer you were expecting or even an answer you want, but if it's a right answer then you know where you stand.

All sound a bit cranky ? Who cares if it works - just remember that all the steps are important to the process. Through professional connections in my family I know that there are psychiatric techiques which can communicate with the subconscious, so this is no BS. The above is just a simple way of using one of them. The only caveat is that some people 'respond' better than others.

Glenn

Getting off-topic, but interesting stuff on sleep. I quite often find that if I've had a 'thinking day' (rather than a purely mechanical trading day), and am still mulling things over as I go to bed, I'll wake in the middle of the night with a brilliant idea or solution to whatever I've been thinking about. The only problem is that I then can't get back to sleep until I've done something about it...

Jack o'Clubs said:

Getting off-topic, but interesting stuff on sleep. I quite often find that if I've had a 'thinking day' (rather than a purely mechanical trading day), and am still mulling things over as I go to bed, I'll wake in the middle of the night with a brilliant idea or solution to whatever I've been thinking about. The only problem is that I then can't get back to sleep until I've done something about it...

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"Getting off-topic,..."

Perhaps, perhaps not.

Glenn