When Are We Going 2 Cut the BS?

[zigglewigler]

As ever, I get back this weekend to find a Trade 2 Win thread going off track because people can't be bothered to read the thread from the start and actually understand it.

This is NOT a suggestion for a competition.

This is an idea for additional functionality to this site. So that anyone who might have some useful insight into a certain trading approach, could then also substantiate it if they wished, which would lead to insightful discussions about such approaches.

This is NOT simply about starting a thread where live (or live as) trades are posted for every monkey that has an agenda to take shots at. We've seen it before.

It would have to be a new part of the site, along the lines of 'Live Calls' or something more original, that would demonstrate accurate calls (yes, calls where over the given period, more points won over points lost, if you need the obvious explained) revealing the system or not, with MODERATORS keeping the flamers out.

The point of it?

None, if you'd find none!

Plenty, if you'd find it useful to understand the merits of various approaches talked about on T2W and would like to gain a little psychological confidence (as limited as it would be) that most newcomers could benefit from.

What amuses me, is how vociferous the posts are from those opposed. The majority are for! Those against bang on about it. Just say no, then move on.

So this goes to a poll. Yes or no will do. Then maybe we could go from there.

 

[RUDEBOY]

I don't know how to post charts. How do i post charts? I would post charts if i knew how to. Any advice, anybody.

 

[TheMoneyMachine]

As ever, I get back this weekend to find a Trade 2 Win thread going off track because people can't be bothered to read the thread from the start and actually understand it.

This is NOT a suggestion for a competition.

This is an idea for additional functionality to this site. So that anyone who might have some useful insight into a certain trading approach, could then also substantiate it if they wished, which would lead to insightful discussions about such approaches.

This is NOT simply about starting a thread where live (or live as) trades are posted for every monkey that has an agenda to take shots at. We've seen it before.

It would have to be a new part of the site, along the lines of 'Live Calls' or something more original, that would demonstrate accurate calls (yes, calls where over the given period, more points won over points lost, if you need the obvious explained) revealing the system or not, with MODERATORS keeping the flamers out.

The point of it?

None, if you'd find none!

Plenty, if you'd find it useful to understand the merits of various approaches talked about on T2W and would like to gain a little psychological confidence (as limited as it would be) that most newcomers could benefit from.

What amuses me, is how vociferous the posts are from those opposed. The majority are for! Those against bang on about it. Just say no, then move on.

So this goes to a poll. Yes or no will do. Then maybe we could go from there.

Fantastic idea Zigglewigler, it will certainly separate the talkers from the walkers and most importantly provide a platform for any snake oil salesmen that dare to reel in the unwary to prove themselves under the spotlight.

Regards

TMM

 

[badtrader]

And where would one place these live trades? I am willing to give 1 call a day on the FX makets

 

[Trader333]

I don't know how to post charts. How do i post charts? I would post charts if i knew how to. Any advice, anybody.

Presumably you know how to save a chart as an image on your pc ?

When you come to make a post that you wish to add a chart to then click on "Advanced" and you will see an Icon that says "Insert Image" when you pass your mouse over it. The icon is yellow with grey and looks like and envelope with a stamp on it. Then you just browse to where you have saved the image and upload it.


Paul

 

[trendie]

hey, zigglewigler !!

what made you change your mind about having some mechanism to identify real traders from the beginners? ( I ask as when I suggested essentially the same on another thread, your response was decidedly different )

- no-one is obligated to post real-time calls.
- there is nothing wrong in people posting out of a sense of ego.
- there is EVERYTHING wrong when people post pompous and arrogant statements, but cannot actually trade.
- system-sellers could prove the worth of the systems via such a mechanism.
- each member willing to post live calls could have an icon, alongside their stars or whatever, identifying those willing to post calls. ( technically feasible )
- newbies could then not be impressed by number of posts, or status, just whether the poster can "walk the talk"

How about: ( we already have a journal facility )
another journal facility whereby once the post is made it cannot be edited ??
( that way, the poster cannot retrospectively alter their trades )
This should be technically feasible, as we already have journals functionality.
However, someone, perhaps paid, is going to have to validate and prove the calls.
OR; the posting of trades, MUST follow a protocol. such as, for the trade to be valid, the instrument must be stated,an ENTRY price must be stated, an AMOUNT, a STOP-LOSS and possibly a PROFIT-TARGET.
If any part is missing the trade is invalid.

Problems: scalping, by its very nature wont be feasible, as you would be too busy trading to post.

Hope this helps.

 

[Stockjunkie]

Sorry but I have no idea what you are talking about, I have never seen any of your reults.
I have been to your website today and clicked on the proof links but there is nothing there.
Please post or email the links, whatever you prefer.

Nonsense , the online material you speak of is perfectly OK , try again .

In any case I have PM'ed you in event you try to deny it yet again which I am sure you will .

That means nothing, professional traders are some of the worst trader I know. A friend gave £1 million to a broker to invest an ended up with £1k.

That's a really dumb thing to say . You friend deserves all he gets fro handing money to a BROKER . Brokers churn client's money , traders trade . Have you not noticed ? In which case you have no business talking about real trading.

There are quite a few traders on this site that could beat the so called professional hands down.

BS . if they are so good let them step forward and show their account records .

Most " experienced " traders here are nothing but 1 lot wonders who have been doing for years and losing ! No names mentioned eh ?

They wouldn't and couldn't even get the chance to apply as a pro in-houser .

What are you talking about ?

Look , I am not going to explain to the difference between paper trading and real trading , brokers vs traders . if you don't know this by now I feel sorry for you .

So either you put up records of real trades or as a professional or this conversation is over .

Bye.

 

[Stockjunkie]

What amuses me , is how vociferous the posts are from those opposed. The majority are for! Those against bang on about it. Just say no, then move on.

So this goes to a poll. Yes or no will do. Then maybe we could go from there.

nah , not half as amusing as the fact that so called live calls are contradictory to the very thing you postured to oppose .

IE ) live calls are just live calls , they are not trades and could be more BS as you originally put it .

Only trading records ( winning ones over time ) show trading ability .

 

[badtrader]

Putting up records don't mean ****, I can give you statements that would blow you mind away, but then you would question them. The only way to prove if you are a so called trader, is trade live in a chat room over a few weeks, giving live calls.

But then again I dont have time for this,as I am a real trader :cheesy:

"am I bothered"



I stick with my little room ...Live cable trading

You should come in for a look,you may learn somthing

 

[sandpiper]

- system-sellers could prove the worth of the systems via such a mechanism.

There are numerous portals and sites where legitimate system vendors can do so already, all better equipped than T2W to handle that kind of traffic. I doubt legitimate system vendors would bother with T2W other than as a means of utilising free advertising space.

- newbies could then not be impressed by number of posts, or status, just whether the poster can "walk the talk"

If anyone is impressed by number of posts, or status, from here or anywhere else, then quite honestly they deserve what they get. People need to get off their backsides and establish the credentials of posters for themselves before taking anything anybody says anywhere on here seriously.

As much as I hate to agree with the RUDE ONE, he's spot on. Nobody is going to find the keys to their new Porsche in this place. It is pretty easy to work out who is who and whether they do or don't trade and why they post what they post, etc, etc.

Only having the market for company isn't quite the same as the boss telling you what a marvellous human being you are and how big the securicor van is going to have to be to deliver your bonus. It's a very human condition to want to establish some sense of 'self worth' not based solely on what you take out of/put into the markets but rather based on other peoples admiration, as long as everybody recognises it for what it is.

I'm also going to have to agree with stockjunkie (god forbid) in as much as live calls without evidence of money on the line are pretty pointless in terms of establishing someones ability as a 'trader'. In truth, they may be a great analyst (technical or otherwise) and sh*** trader.

I would think the thread(s) will prove to be as pointless as the texas_hedge thread (for most everybody except for hedge that is) with anybody daring to ask questions about calls being subjected to abuse from the throngs of piggybackers and admiring fans. (I'd steer clear JT if I were you!!!!). There are countless sites around the net where you can see exactly how this stuff usually turns out (well actually the archives of lots of unpleasant stuff from SI and the old trendvue (who could ever forget swager) and TT (who could ever forget swager...again) have long since disappeared ...... it usually ain't pretty....

Having said all that. I would vote YES if there were a poll. We are all adults after all.....

 

[sandpiper]

bad,

you go girl... outstanding..... my visits to 'my little room' are significantly less profitable . 5 stars... and worth every one......

stockjunkie,

In all fairness.. some of the traders in 2nd, 3rd...and 1st tier IB's are truly awful. At best, they recognise just how **** poor they are and work off information flow from guys who know what they are doing. At worst, they think they are good and **** away tens of millions... jeez there are countless examples... UBS gilts, JPM fixed income, AIB FX, etc, etc.

 

[DanielLambert]

Putting up records don't mean ****, I can give you statements that would blow you mind away, but then you would question them. The only way to prove if you are a so called trader, is trade live in a chat room over a few weeks, giving live calls.

But then again I dont have time for this,as I am a real trader :cheesy:

"am I bothered"



I stick with my little room ...Live cable trading

You should come in for a look,you may learn somthing

Is it a "test" day when u lose money ??

 

[fudgestain]

Why all the fussing and posturing over live calls?
Do it if your ego demands that you do it? Or don't do it. There is no harm either way.
Just stick it in the Dow 2005 thread if its a Dow index call. If it is FX, stick in a FX thread.
As on previous occasions you will get followers and 'arguers' if you give a sequence of daily calls. You may get ignored or you may be pilloried. So what?

Quite frankly, playing in the market is the only real game.

 

[RUDEBOY]

Trader 333, i'll try it later. Cheers, Paul.

 

[Stockjunkie]

Putting up records don't mean ****, I can give you statements that would blow you mind away, but then you would question them. The only way to prove if you are a so called trader, is trade live in a chat room over a few weeks, giving live calls.

I doubt it , blowing away normally means RISK a lot win a lot , that's gambling , I got no time for that , I get big returns for small risk and if anyone has seen my statements they would know that .

then again I dont have time for this,as I am a real trader :cheesy:

No sorry , this comment contradicts the above , if you are a " real " trader then you should know making a few calls over a short time like a couple of weeks means less than zero. It indicates that you are perhaps more the gambler type , who does not pay attention to detail , the market is ALL detail , a miss of 2 points could cost you 200 !

I stick with my little room ...Live cable trading
You should come in for a look,you may learn somthing

I don't know what it is and frankly I don't really want to know .

 

[Stockjunkie]

stockjunkie,

In all fairness.. some of the traders in 2nd, 3rd...and 1st tier IB's are truly awful. At best, they recognise just how **** poor they are and work off information flow from guys who know what they are doing. At worst, they think they are good and **** away tens of millions... jeez there are countless examples... UBS gilts, JPM fixed income, AIB FX, etc, etc.

If they have to work off other's info then they should give up , as that is the worst way to trade .

 

[badtrader]

Stockjunkie

I got nothing to prove to you who I am or how much I make.

Ego is a funny thing.

 

[Stockjunkie]

Stockjunkie

I got nothing to prove to you who I am or how much I make.

Ego is a funny thing.

Ah , according to this thread you do . It says basically put up or shut up unless of course the original poster is now shriking and changing his comment since someone has not only met his challenge but up the proof bar several notches which few have been able to meet , hence the sulks and the inevitable excuses of avoinding the issue not only cropping up but growing at virus like rates.

 

[badtrader]

Ah , according to this thread you do . It says basically put up or shut up unless of course the original poster is now shriking and changing his comment since someone has not only met his challenge but up the proof bar several notches which few have been able to meet , hence the sulks and the inevitable excuses of avoinding the issue not only cropping up but growing at virus like rates.

If you look at the time when I posted my comments it was late, after a few pints

Ok I will challenge you tomorrow in T2W Live chat room. and we both give live calls. Then we see Who's The Daddy

 

[tsuntzu]

I have only read through this thread and I couldn't help but smile to myself. Its a shame to see so much tension and bad feeling between people. It surprises me how quickly people want to blow their own trumpets and yet at the same time undermine others. I can understand peoples frustration at the amount of nonsense that gets posted on bulletin boards but I think anybody who passes an eye over the posts would soon gain familiarity with those, who on balance, may be worth listening too. I think any trader of worth gets his satisfaction from beating the market, not singing his or her praises left right and centre. One of the things I learnt during my journey from novice to competent trader, is that humbleness as a quality is very important. Everyday I trade I learn more about myself and my emotions and how to understand them to get the best from myself in the market.
Anyway I am that good now I am going to write a book, design a system, create my own website and maybe even bring out a range or merchandise, but most importantly of all, I am going to post on here as much as possible because trading all day really does give you time to do that.
Good luck.

oh before I get told I am not good enough for my views to count, I am a rubbish trader, but thats what drives me on