VSAtrader / Socrates discussion

[CJIA]

Hmmm

Join Date: Nov 2005

Quick off the mark

 

[robq]

hmm, and lots of (lively) posts = lots of people browsing the site = lots of clicking on the google / ppc ads = ........

and that's the real answer, isn't it.

 

[Over the Top]

hmm, and lots of (lively) posts = lots of people browsing the site = lots of clicking on the google / ppc ads = ........

and that's the real answer, isn't it.

You're giving the administration/moderators the easy option in closing this thread by apparently taking the moral high ground at the apparent expense of reduction in traffic 'in the best interests' of the site's membership.

The fact remains there appears to be an awful lot of pent up anger, irritation and annoyance, not just with a certain member, but the way the moderators and administrators have conducted themselves.

While, if I were them, I'd also be considering stopping the pain by killing the thread, and perhaps a few members into the bargain, this is clearly an opportunity for those who feel done in to get off their chest that which should never have been allow to congest there in the first place. No sympathy.

 

[dc2000]

And bystanders have the right in a public board to read what is discussed, but not the right to interfere and derail discussions not directly pertinent to them.

Soc writing his own site rules now

And welcome aboard Westernforce nice to see new members from the warmer climates

 

[charliechan]

At the risk of being banned myself, to state that Albert receives no special treatment is ludicrous. Witness the first post from his thread of two years ago:



We are required to be "respectful" of Albert for some reason, while he is not required to be respectful in return. We are not allowed to be "rude, personal, aggressive . . . " at the risk of being banned, but Albert is given free rein to be as rude and personal etc as he pleases.

If you guys want to protect him for some reason, that's your prerogative. But please don't expect the members to believe that this protection does not exist.

--Db

hmm - that note that you quoted does seem as if who ever originally typed it had a soft spot for socrates!! was it a woman by any chance? his wife perhaps? i could be well off the mark on that one - just idle speculation (a rare luxuary outside my main market hours )

 

[charliechan]

I think it was Skinbleshanks that was moderating when Socrates was getting the special treatment. She is no longer a moderator and hasn't been here for a long time.

lol - looks like i was close!!

and was this skumbleshnaks his wife or girlfriend - or was there any other link tieing the 2??

 

[barjon]

Good morning all

Oh Dear - I've just missed a trade reading the latest posts here I know, I know - I shouldn't have joined..........

Firstly, let me try to explain how I go about my moderating so far as seems pertinent to the discussion. When I see them, or when they are reported, I will edit or delete posts that are direct personal attacks or direct personal insults. That seems straightforward enough doesn't it, but there is a line to be drawn between what is acceptable and what isn't. Many posts hover on that line and they are tricky - delete and receive a barrage of "draconian" moderating complaints, leave them and receive "soft" moderating ones.

I also keep an eye on threads and try to clear "off topic" posts when it seems that they are inhibiting discussion of the topic. These post can be inoffensive, but are distractions to the flow of the discussion. Once again there is a line to be drawn. No conversation takes place without asides, but the line is crossed when those asides cause too much of a distraction to participants and readers. "Too much" is, of course, a judgement call.

Now on to this thread and there a number of points:

1. This thread was started by Frugi to facilitate a discussion between VSAtrader and Socrates precisely because that discussion was disrupting the thread(s) where they started.

2. The Journey from the Basement was very tightly moderated to keep it strictly on topic in order to protect the topic and not, as a direct intention, to protect Socrates. Of course, Socrates started that thread and many of the disruptive posts were about him so I would accept that it had the indirect effect of protecting him.

3. Attention has been drawn to the fact that Socrates complains that people "interfere and make irrevelant comments on matters that do not concern them" when others complain that that is precisely what he does on other threads. Quite so, these are public boards where people are entitled to contribute and that is why those posts remain on this thread (although we are now far off the original topic ) - although some have been deleted - and why his remain on other threads - although many have been deleted.

4. No-one is asking that people trawl back through past posts to report them. All we are suggesting is that people use the report post button when they are concerned. Those reports are not consigned to the bin. I do try to let people who have taken the trouble to report a post know what has been done, but we are all busy people and can't always do that. Certainly they always receive our attention.

I expect I've missed some more trades now

Good trading

jon

 

[Minder]

.........have nothing to do with the topic originally under discussion see fit to interfere and make irrelevant comments on matters that do not concern them. What is even more annoying.......

The irony is delicious.

 

[dsn]

hmm, and lots of (lively) posts = lots of people browsing the site = lots of clicking on the google / ppc ads = ........

and that's the real answer, isn't it.

Maybe - and if so not just for t2w but also for the vendors who use it.

The sugar laced patronage of Socrates in some quarters is as clear as it is understandable. Having the local loony dancing in front of the shop window is something no vendor can risk, if a significant proportion of their income is not to disappear overnight. One alternative is to get him onside and singing your praises, whilst at the same time gently focussing his attentions elsewhere (via the use of whatever communication medium works best). Huge free marketing potential.

As I said - the manipulation can be quite skilful.

 

[dc2000]

I expect I've missed some more trades now

Depends what ya lookin for you could always short Dax n FTSE for something to do

 

[rossored]

I've deleted the last post.

PM's are private, not to be discussed openly on the boards unless both parties agree. Those people who get notifications to this board will see what's been written anyway.

Once again, members who use multiple nicks, aliases, serial nicks etc will find themselves banned...

OTT, it is quite clear who you are - your actions since i sent you the PM have made that very clear - a leopard does not change it's spots, and you are a creature of habit .

 

[Bigbusiness]

I have found Socrates response to what was said about him in the Mike Elvin book. It is a shame he responded to thirteen, who wasn't the most tactful of TTW'ers but at least he extracted a response. Perhaps I don't like Socrates polite rudeness because I don't like people who charge large amounts of money and then carry on like this. I just wonder how he got away with it. I know some people like to pay to be tied up gagged and blindfolded (Frank Bough springs to mind ) but it wouldn't be my idea of fun.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showpost.php?p=133948&postcount=402

 

[jimbo57]

I have found Socrates response to what was said about him in the Mike Elvin book. It is a shame he responded to thirteen, who wasn't the most tactful of TTW'ers but at least he extracted a response. Perhaps I don't like Socrates polite rudeness because I don't like people who charge large amounts of money and then carry on like this. I just wonder how he got away with it. I know some people like to pay to be tied up gagged and blindfolded (Frank Bough springs to mind ) but it wouldn't be my idea of fun.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showpost.php?p=133948&postcount=402

BB we should all thank you for providing this link.

This shows in some detail, please everyone read it, that in addition to sexcreta's other failings as a trader he is inherently a racist (pls read the opening paras carefully as he would no doubt wish you to)

Quite how T2W can defend such postings (defense by implication that is, as they are clearly available) - it is probably illegal

 

[robq]

Originally Posted by robq
hmm, and lots of (lively) posts = lots of people browsing the site = lots of clicking on the google / ppc ads = ........

and that's the real answer, isn't it.





DSN - I can't claim credit for the original post "hmm, and lots of (lively) posts...etc".

My contribution was just "and that's the real answer, isn't it."

I tried to find the original post just now and couldn't. Perhaps I simply missed it.

robq

 

[rols]

Tut tut!

I've deleted the last post.

PM's are private, not to be discussed openly on the boards unless both parties agree. Those people who get notifications to this board will see what's been written anyway.

Once again, members who use multiple nicks, aliases, serial nicks etc will find themselves banned...

OTT, it is quite clear who you are - your actions since i sent you the PM have made that very clear - a leopard does not change it's spots, and you are a creature of habit .

He is a bad, bad , boy!

 

[VSATrader]

Hearsay

We have no indication that Socrates is selling anything. He owns the rights to version 4 and has sold it in the past, but to my knowledge has never offered it (nor paid coaching) to anyone here. On the other hand, VSATrader has a financial interest in the current version of TradeGuider and it is being marketed today.

The mods are discussing ways to make it more obvious who is a poster with a commercial interest, and who is not. Several of our commercial posters have solid products and contribute greatly to the site, and some of them use the site for nothing more than trolling for the next sucker for their worthless schemes. It is always useful to 'follow the money.' An obvious label might help make it easier to suss out the poster's intent.

JO

This is a very interesting post as this moderator seems to know something I don't. I do NOT work for Trade Guider, nor do I have a commercial interest in them. I have received no payment from them except once when I did one seminar which they now sell, buy I have never promoted. I have to use TG charts, but if you have ever taken the time to look, you will see that I have posted using Meta-stock charts too, but I am not employed by them, or receive any financial reward for posting charts with their charts either.

I have the right to post any charts I see fits, but if this is not correct, and this will apply to all other posters who use charts including esignal charts or Java charts of web sites. Then write some guide lines for us all. If not then put up or shut up.

I happen to think that Tom Williams has opened many traders eyes, including my own, and I have the most profound respect for him. I have used VSA including Trade Guider for 9 years and have made many times my outlay on the software and upgrades that followed. what I stand for is the Wyckoff principles that Tom has expanded on over the years, while many people chose to go on holiday, I would spend all my free time studying Tom's book and the charts I would print off. This included bank holidays, Christmas etc.

So I realise that I might give the impression that I am funded by TG, but I'm not. But what makes me laugh at you moderators, is the fact that not one of you bothered to ask me before you made this statement.

The reason that Socs is more or less allowed to post what he likes, is that the Mods like people who provoke discussion , after all this is what this web site is about. but as far as I am concerned, I don't have time any more to come hear and read, because I trade FX now and this keeps me occupied.

I believe that the future of this board will become private threads in order to keep certain elements out of the discussion .

Tom and I have done a free seminar of the chart of the week, I will post the link as it would help people who are interested in the Wyckoff principles to learn from Tom first hand what this analysis is about, and I hope the mods will allow this one. I don't expect anyone to buy the software and have no interest if they do as I will not receive any reward. This link is an educational one.
http://www.tradeguider.com/cotw.asp

Regards Sebastian Manby

 

[SOCRATES]

You again overlook the significance of the OBVIOUS.

The obvious is that the avatar you are using is the logo of my software program, which you concede is my property, in your very first post on this thread.

This can be misinterpreted to imply that you are actually promoting VSA 4, which is not the case.

You may be discussing the concept of volume and price spread and using any program you like.

But you are not displaying my program, promoting it or selling or leasing it.

Tradeguider is not my program, and in any case it has a different logo.

So please remove my logo as it does not apply. Thank you Sebastian.

Kind Regards.

 

[JumpOff]

This is a very interesting post as this moderator seems to know something I don't. I do NOT work for Trade Guider, nor do I have a commercial interest in them. I have received no payment from them except once when I did one seminar which they now sell, buy I have never promoted. I have (?!) to use TG charts, but if you have ever taken the time to look, you will see that I have posted using Meta-stock charts too, but I am not employed by them, or receive any financial reward for posting charts with their charts either.

I am surprised to hear that you do not have a commercial interest in this product. I have never seen anyone tout the wonders of a program the way you do TG who doesn't have or hope to have an ongoing relationship with the product vendor. Are you saying you would not do a seminar again for them if they offered to pay you?

If you never intend to work for Tom's business again, then I accept your explanation and stand corrected. Thanks for clearing this up.

JO

 

[nine]

Actually, JO, even if he might do a seminar or two for them again I think you should still accept his information. The possibility of a future seminar (vs fulltime employment) wouldn't make VSATrader anything other than an enthusiastic user (IMHO )

No offence meant but I can be very enthusiastic in my advocacy of things I find useful so I accept that VSAT could be too.

 

[VSATrader]

You again overlook the significance of the OBVIOUS.

The obvious is that the avatar you are using is the logo of my software program, which you concede is my property, in your very first post on this thread.

This can be misinterpreted to imply that you are actually promoting VSA 4, which is not the case.

You may be discussing the concept of volume and price spread and using any program you like.

But you are not displaying my program, promoting it or selling or leasing it.

Tradeguider is not my program, and in any case it has a different logo.

So please remove my logo as it does not apply. Thank you Sebastian.

Kind Regards.

Hello Albert,


I am very sorry to disappoint you, but the logo is taken from VSA5, not v4. The reason it was taken from v5 is that v4 which you sell is not year 2000 compliant, yet you still sell it.

So I will never take it down.

Sebastian