Trading the US the Naz/Mr. Charts Way
- Thread starter Mr. Charts
- Start date
- Watchers 59
- Status
timcannell
Member
- Messages
- 88
- Likes
- 1
SOCRATES said:
SOCRATES
If anyone cares to review the chain of posts constituting this 'sub-thread' you will clearly see that everything I have said is substantiated and reasonable - your wild allegations above I totally refute...
I stand by my comments regarding your post 984.
Regards
Tim Cannell
Last edited:
guys,
is any of this back and forth bullsh*t really worth it? Socrates, how old are you? I thought you were in control of your emotions? to suggest that someone will crap themselves when they receive one of your posts is, well, ambitous to say the least.
Frugi, you are the mod here, if they must carry on can I ask that they do it off this thread? We are supposed to be talking about US stocks.
This all playground stuff.
D
is any of this back and forth bullsh*t really worth it? Socrates, how old are you? I thought you were in control of your emotions? to suggest that someone will crap themselves when they receive one of your posts is, well, ambitous to say the least.
Frugi, you are the mod here, if they must carry on can I ask that they do it off this thread? We are supposed to be talking about US stocks.
This all playground stuff.
D
timcannell
Member
- Messages
- 88
- Likes
- 1
DDIN said:
I agree - I should have just really asked Socrates what is 'crystal clear' about the KOSP short entry - apologies
Last edited:
tradesmart
Experienced member
- Messages
- 1,286
- Likes
- 22
Leave the poor cat alone...........
Whoops.........
"Does the full stop appear after or before the quotation marks, I often wonder? I must consult Fowler, who is often obsolete."
Frugi. Without wishing to get off topic thread. The answer is both!
In American English it is placed before the end quote mark.
In British English it is placed outside the end quote mark.
Please do not start a discussion on the application of grammar and punctuation. The English language has been so *******ised over the years (the Sun newspaper being such a shining example to our youth). Is it any wonder no one can spell or punctuate anymore.
Frugi. Without wishing to get off topic thread. The answer is both!
In American English it is placed before the end quote mark.
In British English it is placed outside the end quote mark.
Please do not start a discussion on the application of grammar and punctuation. The English language has been so *******ised over the years (the Sun newspaper being such a shining example to our youth). Is it any wonder no one can spell or punctuate anymore.
SOCRATES
Veteren member
- Messages
- 4,966
- Likes
- 136
Re: Richard's post number 970 and your cheeky comments, below..
First of all ~ the charts that Richard posted. These are two sets showing before and after with his entry points ; is that not correct ?
Next ~ the volume. You say there is NO volume. That is not correct. There is no volume shown on the first chart.This is probably due to a technical obstacle in presenting it as a thumbnail and probably due to the colours of the volume bars that were not captured correctly. But charts numbers 2 to 4 inclusive clearly show all the volume bars, is that not correct ?
If chart number two is a continuation of chart number one and chart number four is a continuation of chart number three, then the volume displayed in each of these pairs would be valid would it not ? Or are you trying to appear "clever" at my expense, so you think ?
Nobody has to swallow anything except you, because what you will have to swallow is your own words as the proofs that follow will show how inept and inappropriate your comments really are.
Whether I am a long term investor does not enter the argument, neither does whether I use level 2 or time and sales or whatever. That is not your concern at all. In the most remote and unlikely event of needing your help you would be told but not otherwise.
As for your guess and your laughing icon all this is going to be put in its proper place right away, as follows:~
The first chart on the left has an empty volume box, this is correct. But the second chart that follows it, which is a continuation of the first shows all the volume for the period. You can all see that right up to the price explosion the volume is regular. After the price explosion at the top of the move the volume increases. This is mixing volume.The price does not go significantly higher because there is both buying and selling going on. This is obvious.
In the last phases of this chart, in the second last curl over, (where the red line is) the price drops but the volume increases. This is supply entering the market, absorption volume, This supply is unwanted because effort is subsequently made to get rid of that supply. Note that there is increased volume but nearly all of the bars have shadows on the tops only. This is weakness coming in and not strength at those price levels. Again this is obvious, This leads me to the bar before the second last bar.It opens, lifts and collapseson the open and has a shaven bottom. It is being supported at the shaven bottom level, the volume is insignificant.
This is obvious again. This signifies a condition of no demand, imminent weakness.
To the trained eye this is an ideal opportunity to take a short position. The next bar, (second last) opens, gapped down, lifts and then collapses closing on the low. The volume is high.
The price does not fall significantly further at this point. This is arresting volume not buying volume, but it stops the fall in its tracks.This is confirmed by the last bar, which is narrow and the voluime is light. This is because the herd is undecided as to how to react next.
(Although further weakness is not discounted) It presents a snap opportunity to close the trade at a profit. This is again obvious. All of this is what Richard did, all of it is obvious, at least to him and me if not to you.
Now all of you look at chart number three, the weakness I identified earlier has not been resolved. As a consequence the price falls again, and is supported at 48. Look at the volume again.the volumetric sequence is buying, short covering, selling and buying and new selling at 48 or thereabouts. Firm support at 47.50, this is obvious, now look to your left - there is a gap in the price explosion that preceded all this. The price is firmly sustained at 47.50 and is not allowed to sag. Again this is obvious. This is because notwithstanding three attempts the gap is not broken to the downside but drifts off level....there is a snap opportunity to the skilled trader to take a quick long position here for a short ride, with an eye to taking a quick exit as soon as it begins to move up and reach a point of culmination. This is exacltly what Richard spotted and what Richard did and was the correct thing to do, but only for an expert, in an obviously weak market and contrary to herd expectancy.
All of it is obvious, all of it. Incidentally, the long green bar in each of the charts has no significance whatsoever, it is just rogue data.
I hope and expect that the next time you criticise any comment that I make you had better have grounds to do so, otherwise my advice to you is twofold, firstly, if you do not understand any of this, you ought not to be trading or even passing silly comments.
Secondly, you ought to abstain from posting nonsense for the sake of posting and showing off, until such time as you gain sufficient knowledge in these matters to be able to do so constructively.
That is all.
This is your original post is it not ? And in this post you imply all sorts of things I am going to sort out now, to my satisfaction and for the benefit of all members, as there is too much nonsense bandied about for my liking.timcannell said:I have just taken a look at Richard's example chart for his short entry at 48.60 in KOSP - this is shown on a candlestick chart with NO Volume, accompanying Level 2 screen or Time and Sales, decision tools which Richard uses - the only thing that is mystefying Socrates is your belief that people will swallow your above comment about the transparency, from his post, of Richards reading of the situation. As a 'long term investor' do you use Level 2 and/or Time and Sales ? That is all I guess
First of all ~ the charts that Richard posted. These are two sets showing before and after with his entry points ; is that not correct ?
Next ~ the volume. You say there is NO volume. That is not correct. There is no volume shown on the first chart.This is probably due to a technical obstacle in presenting it as a thumbnail and probably due to the colours of the volume bars that were not captured correctly. But charts numbers 2 to 4 inclusive clearly show all the volume bars, is that not correct ?
If chart number two is a continuation of chart number one and chart number four is a continuation of chart number three, then the volume displayed in each of these pairs would be valid would it not ? Or are you trying to appear "clever" at my expense, so you think ?
Nobody has to swallow anything except you, because what you will have to swallow is your own words as the proofs that follow will show how inept and inappropriate your comments really are.
Whether I am a long term investor does not enter the argument, neither does whether I use level 2 or time and sales or whatever. That is not your concern at all. In the most remote and unlikely event of needing your help you would be told but not otherwise.
As for your guess and your laughing icon all this is going to be put in its proper place right away, as follows:~
The first chart on the left has an empty volume box, this is correct. But the second chart that follows it, which is a continuation of the first shows all the volume for the period. You can all see that right up to the price explosion the volume is regular. After the price explosion at the top of the move the volume increases. This is mixing volume.The price does not go significantly higher because there is both buying and selling going on. This is obvious.
In the last phases of this chart, in the second last curl over, (where the red line is) the price drops but the volume increases. This is supply entering the market, absorption volume, This supply is unwanted because effort is subsequently made to get rid of that supply. Note that there is increased volume but nearly all of the bars have shadows on the tops only. This is weakness coming in and not strength at those price levels. Again this is obvious, This leads me to the bar before the second last bar.It opens, lifts and collapseson the open and has a shaven bottom. It is being supported at the shaven bottom level, the volume is insignificant.
This is obvious again. This signifies a condition of no demand, imminent weakness.
To the trained eye this is an ideal opportunity to take a short position. The next bar, (second last) opens, gapped down, lifts and then collapses closing on the low. The volume is high.
The price does not fall significantly further at this point. This is arresting volume not buying volume, but it stops the fall in its tracks.This is confirmed by the last bar, which is narrow and the voluime is light. This is because the herd is undecided as to how to react next.
(Although further weakness is not discounted) It presents a snap opportunity to close the trade at a profit. This is again obvious. All of this is what Richard did, all of it is obvious, at least to him and me if not to you.
Now all of you look at chart number three, the weakness I identified earlier has not been resolved. As a consequence the price falls again, and is supported at 48. Look at the volume again.the volumetric sequence is buying, short covering, selling and buying and new selling at 48 or thereabouts. Firm support at 47.50, this is obvious, now look to your left - there is a gap in the price explosion that preceded all this. The price is firmly sustained at 47.50 and is not allowed to sag. Again this is obvious. This is because notwithstanding three attempts the gap is not broken to the downside but drifts off level....there is a snap opportunity to the skilled trader to take a quick long position here for a short ride, with an eye to taking a quick exit as soon as it begins to move up and reach a point of culmination. This is exacltly what Richard spotted and what Richard did and was the correct thing to do, but only for an expert, in an obviously weak market and contrary to herd expectancy.
All of it is obvious, all of it. Incidentally, the long green bar in each of the charts has no significance whatsoever, it is just rogue data.
I hope and expect that the next time you criticise any comment that I make you had better have grounds to do so, otherwise my advice to you is twofold, firstly, if you do not understand any of this, you ought not to be trading or even passing silly comments.
Secondly, you ought to abstain from posting nonsense for the sake of posting and showing off, until such time as you gain sufficient knowledge in these matters to be able to do so constructively.
That is all.
Last edited:
Socrates, thank you very much for that explanation, it has indeed helped me. In addition I would like to add that I didn't critise you and I don't think I posted nonsense, I am guessing that these comments were directed to other users.
I use these boards to share ideas, ask questions and learn from people with more experience and wisdom than me and I am very grateful to anyone who provides that wisdom.
I use these boards to share ideas, ask questions and learn from people with more experience and wisdom than me and I am very grateful to anyone who provides that wisdom.
SOCRATES
Veteren member
- Messages
- 4,966
- Likes
- 136
Well, he asked for it, now he's got it. And all of it is crystal clear and explained in simple mechanical charting terms. It is not that I do not like discussion but I cannot abide that kind of behaviour, and for this reason, I joined last year on the 24th April, allowing myself one year to devote to helping people on this website. The year expires in 9 days. You must understand one gets bored with persistent nonsense and patent ignorance and rudeness.
Kind Regards, I am pleased it is of interest and benefit to you personally.
Kind Regards, I am pleased it is of interest and benefit to you personally.
I would add Socrates that timing an entry and then doing a screen capture all at the same time deserves respect. Mr Charts particularly provides "real time" screen shots which are tremendously informative - how he does it whilst managing his trades as well..............
Nice post by the way - esp your views on volume - not sure I got it all but I am about to print off the charts and your post and see if I can work it all out.
Nice post by the way - esp your views on volume - not sure I got it all but I am about to print off the charts and your post and see if I can work it all out.
TheBramble
Legendary member
- Messages
- 8,394
- Likes
- 1,170
Another flurry of posts when I'm not looking...you little chimps are going to be the death of me, I do swear!
Socrates' 'explanation' of Richard's trades in nothing of the sort. Or rather, it may well be or may not be. We simply don't know because Richard hasn't told us on what specific basis he took the trade and managed it. And is unlikely to it would seem.
Although Socco has done a half decent job of explaining what may have been the situation, as with all chart analysis in retrospect, it's always blindingly obvious and you can say whatever you like to justify precisely what has already happened.
TC (and others') comments that they didn't find it 'blindingly obvious' rather underscores the genuine intent of the post of mine to which this recent spurt of activity is related. It wasn't in any way a criticism of Richard or his trading ability, just attempting to understand the purpose of posting such 'here's one I made earlier' type trade scenarios. That's all.
Socco - you are a tease. And on such a special day as today too...
Socrates' 'explanation' of Richard's trades in nothing of the sort. Or rather, it may well be or may not be. We simply don't know because Richard hasn't told us on what specific basis he took the trade and managed it. And is unlikely to it would seem.
Although Socco has done a half decent job of explaining what may have been the situation, as with all chart analysis in retrospect, it's always blindingly obvious and you can say whatever you like to justify precisely what has already happened.
TC (and others') comments that they didn't find it 'blindingly obvious' rather underscores the genuine intent of the post of mine to which this recent spurt of activity is related. It wasn't in any way a criticism of Richard or his trading ability, just attempting to understand the purpose of posting such 'here's one I made earlier' type trade scenarios. That's all.
Socco - you are a tease. And on such a special day as today too...
TheBramble
Legendary member
- Messages
- 8,394
- Likes
- 1,170
Russell, don't puzzle over it in isolation. You live virtually next door to Albert. Pop round. I'm sure he wont mind!rdstagg said:
timcannell
Member
- Messages
- 88
- Likes
- 1
SOCRATES said:
Socrates
Your verbose explanation is a plausible but 'curve-fitted' answer - how could it be anything else ? ...and not of any specific interest to me - I dont believe you could have drawn those conclusions in real time.
I stand by my original remarks since I know Richard uses Level II and Time and Sales in his decision making process.
As for behaviour - telling fellow member that one of your responses would make him 'crap' himself as you did in post #1001 reveals you own extreme ignorance and rudeness so you'll have to excuse me if I dont accept you kind regards.
Anyway happy retirement from these boards nevertheless
Tim
TheBramble
Legendary member
- Messages
- 8,394
- Likes
- 1,170
Socrates did give an almost perfect explanation - that's true.
But invert price or volume or both - and you can still come up with a satisfying explanation in retrospect for why they did what they did. On the very simple basis that they did what they did!
But the real issue isn't whether Socco can analyse historic charts and provide a plausible enough explanation for the price action.
The real issue is that Richard only had the information he had to act on at the time he acted. Print off the charts he provided and slide a piece of paper right-to-left along the Time axis until the bar before Richard entered his trade. That's ALL he had to go on - at that time.
Do the same thing with the bar prior to his exit.
Forget the basis for why the price/volume did what they did - all we need to know is that 'this is what they were doing at this point in time' - and 'what might they do next?'.
When viewed this way, the basis for Richard's trade is really the meat of what most people want to know. Unless you've been a student (as you indicate you have JT) this is quite meaningless. (Well, apart from Salty who has had tuition from an even higher authority!).
I accept and understand the point made that Richard is unlikely to divulge secrets his students have had to pay for. Quite right. But then, and again the original and now quite tired question, what is the point of posting these trades if they're only for the tutored few?
Indeed, it may well back-fire on Richard's generosity in that he becomes inundated with requests for tuition from hopeful students. And when he's clearly capable of doing trades like this - that's the last thing he needs I'm sure.
But invert price or volume or both - and you can still come up with a satisfying explanation in retrospect for why they did what they did. On the very simple basis that they did what they did!
But the real issue isn't whether Socco can analyse historic charts and provide a plausible enough explanation for the price action.
The real issue is that Richard only had the information he had to act on at the time he acted. Print off the charts he provided and slide a piece of paper right-to-left along the Time axis until the bar before Richard entered his trade. That's ALL he had to go on - at that time.
Do the same thing with the bar prior to his exit.
Forget the basis for why the price/volume did what they did - all we need to know is that 'this is what they were doing at this point in time' - and 'what might they do next?'.
When viewed this way, the basis for Richard's trade is really the meat of what most people want to know. Unless you've been a student (as you indicate you have JT) this is quite meaningless. (Well, apart from Salty who has had tuition from an even higher authority!).
I accept and understand the point made that Richard is unlikely to divulge secrets his students have had to pay for. Quite right. But then, and again the original and now quite tired question, what is the point of posting these trades if they're only for the tutored few?
Indeed, it may well back-fire on Richard's generosity in that he becomes inundated with requests for tuition from hopeful students. And when he's clearly capable of doing trades like this - that's the last thing he needs I'm sure.
Salty Gibbon
Experienced member
- Messages
- 1,535
- Likes
- 6
I'm sure he could.
TheBramble
Legendary member
- Messages
- 8,394
- Likes
- 1,170
Salty Gibbon
Experienced member
- Messages
- 1,535
- Likes
- 6
God only knows, Tony.
TheBramble
Legendary member
- Messages
- 8,394
- Likes
- 1,170
Aaaarrrggghhhhhhh...............!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
- Status
