trading courses

Mr Chill

Active member
Hello every1

Can anyone recomend any good courses to go on for a new trader ,any comments or recomendations will be much appreciated
also prices value for money etc ,etc ,Thanks :cool:
 

Zenda

Well-known member
Read the seminar reviews for a start on the front page - depends what you are looking for - clickevents have many on CD which may be a good starting point. -Z
 

stevet

Established member
there are no good trading courses - but some might do less damage than others

unless of course you are trained on a course in a trading company, where they focus on teaching you how not to lose as much as how to win
 

iq200

Well-known member
stevet : did you learn from a trading company? I would be interested. Can you pls pm me which company?

Regards,

Imran
 

stevet

Established member
Mr Chill

the problem is that trading is not about learning in the same way that other jobs are

trading is about realising that you need to find an edge that allows to trade profitably

but because anyone can get a trading account and get charting software, there is for some reason a belief that by pressing button A and spending time learning, you can then be a succesful trader

but if you wanted to get a job as a brain surgeon, how would you go about it and how long would it take to learn?

are there forums on the internet like this with people wanting to be brain surgeons and discussing the cheapest scalpel to buy, or the best book to learn from, or how you can go on a one day training course with a brain surgeon for a few hundred pound - and the brain surgeon trainer says he is a successful brain surgeon - offers no proof of this - but will train you to be a brain surgeon with a days training - and anytime after that - you can call him up for a bit of advice!

can you sit at home, work you own hours and make millions as a brain surgeon, or a lawyer, or whatever? trading is one of the most difficult professions, and carries the most financial rewards - yet every day, already successful and unsuccesful people decide they are not happy with what they are doing already, so they will become a trader - now what do i have to do so i can start making money everyday!

i have been trading for a long long time - but that does not mean i have used to same methodology and i suspect i will need a new methodology from the next year - they type of trading i did when i started would not work now and the type of trading i do now did not exist when i started out

i have never assumed it was my right to make money trading, i always assumed it was difficult, and everyday i wonder if this is the last day i can make money

so i make sure i just learn everything i can, everyday, about how markets are changing and evolving and i study and query everything from books, newspapers, magazines, trying to find out what every little facet of trading is about, and what all the professionals in trading do and are doing and who is making money and who is not

you need to find that edge and trade it - so if your are just starting out - why not get a job as a trader with a company - and if you cant get a job trading - ask yourself why you assume you can be a trader

when people say they want to learn about trading - what they mean is - i want to learn how to make money, a lot of money and the faster the better - but that is a way different thing to learning about trading and how to trade - all the people working at spreadbetting companies and brokers know an awful lot about trading and they dont become traders

to become a successful trader - it has to be the only thing you want to do in life - it has to be all consuming and your main interest and totaly fulfilling for you 24 hours a day - not just when you have a few minutes to spare

that doesn't mean that it has to be your only interest in life, but dont mix the other interests with it, i either trade full time 24/7, or not at all - i have given up trading for years at a time - and then come back - still with all the knowledge - but i had to spend time finding a new edge as opportunities change all the time
 
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mully

Established member
Stevet,
I fully second your strong message. There are no free lunches in this world, especially in the financial world.

I should know having spent 23 years in the heart of the city at very well known firm, latterly as a partner.

The most striking observation was the remarkably few instances of wealth made from trading. (And these were people on the inside.) Yes there is wealth in the city, but it is principally from extraordinary earnings/bonuses.

More recently, trading wealth can be found in the Hedge Fund world.

Certaintly, a quick fix of a course here or there, can be the worst of all worlds. As they say a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing.
 

stevet

Established member
mully

yep - and what most dont get is that the people who make the big bucks in the city might work for a big bank or whatever - but they have the contacts that bring in the investment monies and get the deals done - and the bank is almost just a credibility front and provide the infranstructure for deal making

thats why these people earn a big chunk of the profit - and a lot of deals might only make fractions of percent - but the monies involved are so large that those fractions add up to big big amounts relative to an individuals earnings
 
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Finlayson

Well-known member
Guy's

some relevant & good points, but I have to say this...........are u saying it is an absolute necessity to be a current or 'ex' 'city boy' to make any money in the markets ... if it is why r u here?.......fannying about with us minions??

I guess most here dont work in 'the city'?????

no offence intended.......unless u r reading the meta language & if u r professional u wont be ...........just a direct question ?

Jay
 

stevet

Established member
Finlayson

sorry, obviously my little rant was misunderstood if you directed your point to me

i did not mention about being ex-city and i thought mully was saying that hardly any money, proportionally, in his experience was made in the city from trading

if anything the point i am making and suspect mully was making is the opposite and that is that knowing about finance or the trading business, and having tons of money and infrastructure sitll does not mean that someone is gonna make money from trading - its easier to make .1% (point one percent) off $100 (when you have access to the $100) than 1% (one percent) off $10 - and working in the city is about learning to make very very small percentages off very very large amounts of capital

thats why the avergage person thinks that property is a great investment - but all that is happening is that people get to trade with a large amount of money through buying their homes and then they trade between each other figuring they have a one way bet - and the capital appreciation can look substantial because the base capital amount is large - unfortunatly all they are doing is playing the interest rate curve - and property is a very illiquid investment supported by amateurs - so when the bubble bursts - it bursts big time and property will return to its historic median after a trip below

my reason for being on the forum is just like anyone else - i am here to learn and to find any possible edges that someone else might have a feel for, but not have found a way to implement it or might just need the last bit of the jigsaw that i might be able to provide, or might just want to work with someone to achieve

and as a bit of learning for me - what does "meta language" mean?
 
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mully

Established member
Finlayson,
I place no restriction on who can make it as a trader (city or non-city). My only concern is the quality of the commitment to achieve the goal of a trader.
Quoting form Terry Orlick's Sporting book "In pursuit of Excellence" there are seven critical elements of excellence:
Commitment
Focus
Confidence
Positive Images
Mental readiness
Distraction control
Ongoing learning

The problem lies in the hidden objective behind seeking "trading courses". I suspect the hope is that courses prove a quick-fix to achieving that goal. If it is just part of an overall process to achieving competence, then that is ok. As long as you realise that trading, if it is to be successful, has to be seen as a full time occupation, not to be undertaken lightly, and not something that can be learnt by a course here or a course there.
But I wish everyone success in their own pursuit of trading success.
 

stevet

Established member
mully

i think you need those critical elements to find an edge in the markets and to keep finding edges in the market

but the actual trading when you have an edge is kinda the easy cruise bit
 

Mr Chill

Active member
Thank you all for your comments ,i understand what your saying but i was not seeking a quick fix i know that in trading one never stops leaning ,but the way you are speaking sounds like i should give up and go home,everyone has to start somewhere,stevet and mull you did'nt just wake up one day and start trading now did you . :mad:
 

philto37

Junior member
Stevet
Your posting is certainly not "ranting" - in fact I consider it about the nearest description of how trading is (should be?) conducted by a trader working his/her own account from a PC.
I have only been trading a couple of years, & only now am just getting profitable, using a strategy that i'm totally comfortable with. like yourself, I have changed strategies many times. I did a course that included live trading, this is not the strategy I use now, but, if any newcomer wants to do a course I would suggest they look for one that does live trading. I had not a clue how fast the Mkt. can move, or all the hassles one can have with an SB company, or any other computer/internet related problem that can throw a spanner in the works. I could easily show a student how wonderful my strategy is on a historical chart - learning any trading live is a totally different matter!
i would love to teach newcomers the basics of trading as thre are so many useless courses on the market that it devalues the whole idea of trading - perhaps, in time to come, someone will devise a course for less than the price of a trading book just to demonstrate this profession in its true light.
Regards Phil
 

mully

Established member
Mr Chill,

Commitment and focus are key essentials to excellence. If you have those, I do not fear for your eventual success. Everyone has to start somewhere, but if you understand the commitment then there should be few disappointments. As someone once said every journey starts with the very first step.
 

Finlayson

Well-known member
Stevet & Mully

Fair play...wasnt so much directed at yourselves but the posts.........good & fair answers

meta language..... when somebody says something &means the opposite....as it is slow & I have a new scanner here's a funny example from the book ''talk language''by Allen Pease

Jay
 

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SallyT

Member
Well, I hardly dare put my name under these big hitters, after all, I'm only a retired school teacher who was looking for a way to earn some money. But for the benefit of Mr Chill and the question he asked, I'm going to tell you what I found.......

I'd always been interested in finance and money, I never seem to have enough of it, money that is! So, a few years ago I started to investigate financial trading. I read books, I went to the free seminars (Winters) decided that wasn't for me, went to CMC free open night, liked the software, shame about the staff, and I searched the net for someone who was training. I came up with various names/organisations and asked them all for info. Eventually I chose one that suited me, mainly because I liked the guy (that's important to me when I'm learning). He was prepared to talk to me at my level, he explained what he did and didn't try to push me in to a decision there and then, in fact it took me a few weeks before I decided to attend his training course. I have to say, I'm rather glad I did, because for the first time I began to understand what trading is all about and just how much I had to/am learning and how much work I have to put in if I want to become a reasonably successful trader. I don't want to be a millionaire (it would be nice but not very likely), what I do want to do is to prove to myself that I can do it. I'm getting there after lots of paper trading. Since October I have had 5 trades 2 wins 3 losses but my gains far outweigh my losses (beginners luck). I don't think that I would have traded the way I have been shown if I hadn't attended his course. By the way, just 3 people on my course, (never more than 10) not the 100s you might find elsewhere! I now know that this was merely the beginning of my learning, not the end.


So I have no regrets about paying someone to show me how to trade, everyone has to start somewhere.


If Mr Chill or anyone else wants details of the course I attended, feel free to PM me - I'll send you the details.

My comments are not meant to be an advert for anyone to attend a course, I just wanted to let Mr Chill know that he's not on his own when it comes to learning. Yes, trading is hard work (it must be, otherwise every man and his dog would try it). No, you won't know what methodology to adopt when you start, you'll just have to go through the process and decide what suits you and your lifestyle best.

Mr Chill, hope this helps.

Good Luck.

Sally.
 
 
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