Smart Live Markets - Spread Bet on MT4

If things carry on with SLM the way they have been I will be happy to stay with them and deposit more funds so that I can up my stakes.

Yes heatonfan I would like to see that video interview with one of SLM's directors.

Pineappleman and babyclanger thanks for your points of view on SB V Broker, I think it is relavant in this SLM thread as we can keep an eye out for suspect practices.

I would agree that SB companies have improved over the years (9 years ago I used spreadex and finspreads) with tighter spreads but I think babyclanger is referring more to the ability of SB companies to stop hunt, make their own prices, spike prices, requotes, invalid prices, change leveraqge momentarily closing trades etc.
Loads of info out there on that, how prevalent it is I don't know.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIuTCavyrVo&feature=related

There was a spike yesterday on GB/US that took many FMT users out (I did not trade) but that same spike occured on Thinkforex, Alpari, FinFX and Oanda all a few points higher or lower though.
 
Ross Spur said:
If they're so keen for their customers to make money, why did they introduce variable (wider) spreads?:?:
Click to expand...

Because then it's realistic! Be wary of too good to be true spreads that are loss-making for a bookie, they have to be doing underhand tactics to balance books.

With SLM, they moved to variable spreads (which are only slightly higher than the too good to be true 1pip fixed nonsense, let's be fair and realistic about this) so that they can genuinely hedge easier in the underlying which is a GREAT thing for a spreadbet bookie to do because it shows transparency and honesty.

What they're saying is "look we cannot make a living on 1pip fixed EURUSD so it needs to be slightly wider so we can genuinely hedge it" - it's still small, it's still well tradable, it's still tax free in UK, it's still a bargain and we should be grateful for these modern-day opportunities to trade tight spreads tax free.

Do you realise what the spreads are like with "real" brokers??? Open a few "real" accounts in spot FX and see how good we actually have it with tax free SLM!!!!! EDIT: not to mention the overnight financing costs with "real" brokers - with SLM you even get a greater deal with this often-overlooked cost!

I would trust a bookie who needs to have "very slightly" wider spreads for the sake of honesty and true hedging ability over a too good to be true bookie offering unsustainable (from their perspective) spreads any day of the week.

Would you?

The longevity of doing business is with the honest, real guys not with the cowboys who offer the impossible.

1 pip fixed spread does NOT exist in the real world of FX, it's an illusion the bookies have thrown out to the (largely) dumb spreadbetting public who come into this game thinking it's all too easy.
 
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To me, the point is that having a fixed spread is one of the main advantages SB has over trading a 'real' market. You can still get fixed spreads elsewhere, and I think SLM will have lost plenty of business by changing. As you say, the difference isn't that great most of the time, but they can now widen it when they please. Although I don't think it has anything to do with making it easier for them to hedge, maybe it would have been possible to keep fixed spreads on lower stakes (the majority of customers), then reject or delay large trades if someone wants to open big positions over news.
 
Tenapenny said:
Not sure if this is what you meant. http://trading-gurus.com/dealing-desk-or-no-dealing-desk-that-is-the-question/

It is an interesting read though, with regards to dealing desks.
Click to expand...

That was what I meant - well spotted.

If SLM have switched to variable spreads then the interview is a little embarrassing. I imagine they found news trading made absolute fixed spreads uneconomic, which is not entirely surprising. As I don't trade news, it makes no difference to me.

One little thing does interest me - do SLM advertise anywhere or do they just get trade through word of mouth? I only know of them through a particular discussion group on this site, from which a good few have signed up. A web search shows the company does bingo, TV roulette, sports gambling etc.
 
SLM also have android App now that allows you to see MT4 client on the phone, edit, place orders, stops, see charts etc. very handy !
 
Hi I have Metatrader version 4 build 226, on my SLM account. I believe there is later builds, does anyone know how or if I can get them?
 
Ross Spur said:
If they're so keen for their customers to make money, why did they introduce variable (wider) spreads?:?:
Click to expand...

That's pretty simple. They hedge the trades in the market and the market doesn't have fixed spreads, they just widen it around the market. If the market is 20points wide, they go 21 points wide. Makes sense to me. Why would they have spreads better than the market if they wanted you to win? Look at Worldspreads. They dont have zero spreads because they want you to win.
 
I thought I had finally found a good broker that uses MT4 with slm but they don't allow US residences! Any one know of a good broker that allows US... It seems like there is no such thing.
 
SLM is a spreadbetting firm and I do not think US residents are allowed to spreadbet.
I would have thought there are loads of good Brokers your side of the pond?

On another note, I am not enjoying the swap charges on some pairs with SLM but I guess it's the same with other spreadbetting firms and brokers too.
 
stiltskin said:
SLM is a spreadbetting firm and I do not think US residents are allowed to spreadbet.
I would have thought there are loads of good Brokers your side of the pond?

On another note, I am not enjoying the swap charges on some pairs with SLM but I guess it's the same with other spreadbetting firms and brokers too.
Click to expand...

just to add.... the only spreadbetter firm that uses MT4 to automate... unless anyone knows any one else???
 
stiltskin said:
SLM is a spreadbetting firm and I do not think US residents are allowed to spreadbet.
I would have thought there are loads of good Brokers your side of the pond?

On another note, I am not enjoying the swap charges on some pairs with SLM but I guess it's the same with other spreadbetting firms and brokers too.
Click to expand...

Hello

Unfortunately the USA is a little protectionist when it comes to global trade.
They do not mind non US residents or nationalities using their services, but do not allow it the other way around.
The only way for us to permit US residents or nationals to open accounts is for us to open an office in North America and place at least $20mio with the Fed.
At this time it is simply not worth us doing that I am afraid.

With regards to the swap charges can you please email in with a query if you have one.
Our swap rates should be some of the most competitive available as we give market rates.
If you have a particular query then please let us know.

Regards

SLM
 
heatonfan said:
That was what I meant - well spotted.

If SLM have switched to variable spreads then the interview is a little embarrassing. I imagine they found news trading made absolute fixed spreads uneconomic, which is not entirely surprising. As I don't trade news, it makes no difference to me.

One little thing does interest me - do SLM advertise anywhere or do they just get trade through word of mouth? I only know of them through a particular discussion group on this site, from which a good few have signed up. A web search shows the company does bingo, TV roulette, sports gambling etc.
Click to expand...

Hello

We do not do bingo, roulette or anythying else. You are refering to a totally seperate company.

We are Smart Live Financial Services Ltd who trade under the name of Smart Live Markets.

We have a sister company called Smart Live Gaming, who are owned by the same parent company, but are totally seperate and nothing to do with us.

I hope that clears that up.

Regards

SLM
 
busfarehome said:
Baby clanger that was a very informative post, thanks.

It makes me sick to think a SB firm can move the goal posts on the profitable traders.

So far I have noticed no difference on my SLM demo and live account but will be wary.

It begs the question which broker do you use and do they use MT4? PM if you prefer.

ThinkForex have fast ECN/STP execution and no dealing desk, 200:1 margin, good spreads and are not a SB firm so they could be a good choice of broker.

This was a reply to a query I put ot them.

"We do not hedge/trade against our clients. We have multiple account types that do and do not charge commission. On the non commission account there is a small markup. The demo platform represents our MT4 Standard non-commission account."

Oanda also seem pretty on (on demo anyway) and have better spreads but both are outside the UK which could be a problem if needing to telephone them in an emergency.
Click to expand...

Hello

There seems to be a lot of scaremongering going on by some people.
Any spread betting company, or any financial trading company, that is regulated by the FSA also is bound by MiFID (look it up on Google). This means that they would be breaking the law and would be fined if they carried out the practises you are suggesting.
I can assure you that this does not go on here and certainly never has wherever I have worked including City Index and ODL.

Regards

Paul
SLM
 
Thanks for that SLM - interesting reading. How on earth would the FSA detect that you are not conforming to MiFID?

Deep in a consultation paper
(Implementing MiFID’s best execution requirements)...

"Under MiFID Article 21, a firm must take all reasonable steps to obtain the
best possible result, taking into account price, costs, speed, likelihood of
execution and settlement, size, nature or any other consideration relevant to
the execution of the order."

I would be interested in everyones views regarding the meaning of "likelihood of execution". Surely, if the client
tries to set (for example) SL to BE when his trade is in profit by 20 pips, not allowing him to do this would break this rule.
However - freezing the price so the clients trade never reaches 20 pips profit would not break the rule - therefore SLM
can simply freeze the price and there is no rule breach - right?

P.S. Not saying that SLM would do this deliberately - just working out if they could do it under the MiFID rules.
 
magicdogsbrain said:
Thanks for that SLM - interesting reading. How on earth would the FSA detect that you are not conforming to MiFID?

Deep in a consultation paper
(Implementing MiFID’s best execution requirements)...

"Under MiFID Article 21, a firm must take all reasonable steps to obtain the
best possible result, taking into account price, costs, speed, likelihood of
execution and settlement, size, nature or any other consideration relevant to
the execution of the order."

I would be interested in everyones views regarding the meaning of "likelihood of execution". Surely, if the client
tries to set (for example) SL to BE when his trade is in profit by 20 pips, not allowing him to do this would break this rule.
However - freezing the price so the clients trade never reaches 20 pips profit would not break the rule - therefore SLM
can simply freeze the price and there is no rule breach - right?

P.S. Not saying that SLM would do this deliberately - just working out if they could do it under the MiFID rules.
Click to expand...



.... and here we go again.
Did you ring up to move an order and were told no, go away.
No funny enough that was not the case.

We, like every trading company in the world, have in our terms of business a section that outlines what happens in case of the trading platform failing.
You must call in. You did not.

"(m) We are an internet based trading company and as such you accept that there are risks with your internet connection to our website failing and that our Internet Trading Platform (ITP) could fail. In such circumstances you accept all liabilities for any trading losses that you may occur as a result of this, and you must contact SLM immediately for us to try and help. If you do experience problems then it is imperative that you contact the trading desk immediately."

If you find this unacceptable then you should not trade online at all with any one as you clearly do not understand the associated risks.

Regards
SLM
 
With great respect SLM you have proved my point better than I ever could. Whatever goes wrong you have a ton of things you can use to defend yourself (as you did very well in the above post).

>Did you ring up to move an order and were told no, go away.

Since you ask, no because there was nothing to move - the GU prices were frozen (although I did email at 7:39 AM asking if there was a problem with your server because the prices had not moved). It was only after spending time comparing the chart with other brokers that I realized the server error at SLM had been pretty cruel to me.


And this is the point I am attempting to make - MiFID is irrelevant for Forex instruments in a MM environment because your pricing is your own. They have nothing to use as a benchmark.
 
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magicdogsbrain said:
With great respect SLM you have proved my point better than I ever could. Whatever goes wrong you have a ton of things you can use to defend yourself (as you did very well in the above post).

>Did you ring up to move an order and were told no, go away.

Since you ask, no because there was nothing to move - the GU prices were frozen (although I did email at 7:39 AM asking if there was a problem with your server because the prices had not moved)


And this is the point I am attempting to make - MiFID is irrelevant for Forex instruments in a MM environment because your pricing is your own. They have nothing to use as a benchmark.
Click to expand...


I have done and said all I can.
You are wrong and you are misleading everyone else.
MiFID covers all areas of financial markets, including, which is why I brought it up in the first place, price manipulation.
So companies cannot co stop hunting to trigger orders as was suggested.
But you clearly know better than me, so good luck.
 
Perhaps one lesson from this is - if in any doubt - call SLM - do not email. I have now saved SLM number on my cell phone so I will call as soon as I think there is an issue.

Another lesson is to always run some kind of broker/account monitoring EA (for example the on that MT4i provide) and set it up to email or SMS you if the EA fails to publish after 10 minutes (this may indicate a broker price issue or an internet issue).
 
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