I tend to show people what I do if they work in the same place as I do. But no doubt the Liffe guy was talking about the same thing. It is not something that can easilly be explained via e-mail the only way, as with most things, is practical application. It is necessary to be hands on. We start new people off on a trainer for about 4-6 weeks then just get them into the real market. Success rates are pretty good.