Everybody hurts...sometimes...

[new_trader]

Your 10p is safe for today then CV Splash out and buy a lollipop

 

[Scotty2Cues]

Wht about a T2w competition using a £10k demo account for next year who can make the most. Forex, Stocks, day traders, scalpers, position, anything goes?

 

[counter_violent]

Just sent out for additional popcorn.

 

[new_trader]

Wht about a T2w competition using a £10k demo account for next year who can make the most. Forex, Stocks, day traders, scalpers, position, anything goes?

Pointless. Real money or nothing. Too many 'expert' paper (or 10p) traders here. The challenge was already set and BSD declined, like I knew he would.

 

[Scotty2Cues]

Pointless. Real money or nothing. Too many 'expert' paper (or 10p) traders here. The challenge was already set and BSD declined, like I knew he would.

Bit harsh, doncha play games? What if we put in some cash or gifts as a prize...

 

[BSD]

Back from a walk and I see the nonsense squad are still out in force.

The reason why what common sense, people walking the talk like Dan Zanger, GammaJammer etc all say is perfectly obvious is by looking at end results, scalpers and daytraders can make 50% per month on small accounts, but despite that the fact simply is that no one has managed to compound an intraday trading method into a billion dollar or hundreds of millions fortune entirely speaks for itself, and is why Marty Schwartz was a great daytrader, but failed at trading size when he started a hedge fund and had to close it.

The larger you get the more slippage you incur as liquidity is finite and the longer term time frames you have to trade.

Show me a daytrader worth billions haha.

You can't, because he / she doesn't exist.

What does exist, is verifiable and proven, is this from Dan Zanger (who turned 10 k into 42 million in two years) holds over days, because anything below that and he can't enter positions large enough to make it worth his while:

"Dan Zanger: I mostly use daily charts. You just can't buy 70000 shares off of a 5 minute chart. Most institutions don't use 5 minute charts, they are using 30 or 60 minute and certainly daily charts."

http://www.chartpattern.com/cf/image...world-2010.pdf

Our very own bank head of fx trading desk trader GammaJammer is saying the exact same thing:

Don't trade 1 min or 5 min charts,
Thats my advice
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/first-steps/53414-hi-everyone.html#post662450

but rest assured far more serious traders trading serious money use 4h charts than 15 min ones. Fact! (as David Brent would say).
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/forex-discussion/17652-anyone-trading-4hr-charts-6.html#post255697

Now, where is that billionaire daytrader again ?

Exactly, he doesn't exist.

Nothing wrong with daytrading whatsoever, it just won't take you to the top floor, but that's fine too.

 

[new_trader]

Bit harsh, doncha play games? What if we put in some cash or gifts as a prize...

Scotty,

This isn't about a which system, timeframe or pretty coloured line is best. That is typical T2W mentality. "1min is better than 5min"...etc People who understand trading and know what is what don't argue about this sort of newbie drivel. BSD claims I talk crap, That SOCRATES talks crap, that DT talks crap and then runs away like a frightened little schoolgirl when his assertion was challenged with real money...go figure...

 

[new_trader]

Back from a walk and I see the nonsense squad are still out in force.

The reason why what common sense, people walking the talk like Dan Zanger, GammaJammer etc all say is perfectly obvious by looking at end results, scalpers and daytraders can make 50% per month on small accounts, the fact that no one has managed to compound an intraday trading method into a billion dollar or hundreds of millions fortune entirely speaks for itself, and is why Marty Schwartz was a great daytrader, but failed at trading size when he started a hedge fund and had to close it.

The larger you get the more slippage you incur as liquidity is finite and the longer term time frames you have to trade.

Show me a daytrader worth billions haha.

You can't, because he / she doesn't exist.

What does exist, is verifiable and proven, is this from Dan Zanger (who turned 10 k into 42 million in two years) holds over days, because anything below that and he can't enter positions large enough to make it worth his while:

"Dan Zanger: I mostly use daily charts. You just can't buy 70000 shares off of a 5 minute chart. Most institutions don't use 5 minute charts, they are using 30 or 60 minute and certainly daily charts."

http://www.chartpattern.com/cf/image...world-2010.pdf
Our very own bank trader GammaJammer is saying the exact same thing:

Don't trade 1 min or 5 min charts,
Thats my advice
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/first-steps/53414-hi-everyone.html#post662450

but rest assured far more serious traders trading serious money use 4h charts than 15 min ones. Fact! (as David Brent would say).
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/forex-discussion/17652-anyone-trading-4hr-charts-6.html#post255697

Now, where is that billionaire daytrader again ?

haha.

Where would you be without copy and paste?

 

[Scotty2Cues]

How did Dan Zanger do that? Did he use extremely risky money management?

Ive read a few times that brokers say most scalpers are losers and that the the majority of the winners are traders that hold positions longer although I have no idea if its true

 

[new_trader]

BSD, this isn't about daytrading and you know it. You are manufacturing a straw man argument.

 

[Scotty2Cues]

Scotty,

This isn't about a which system, timeframe or pretty coloured line is best. That is typical T2W mentality. "1min is better than 5min"...etc People who understand trading and know what is what don't argue about this sort of newbie drivel. BSD claims I talk crap, That SOCRATES talks crap, that DT talks crap and then runs away like a frightened little schoolgirl when his assertion was challenged with real money...go figure...

so that's a yes to the competition then? :cheesy:

 

[BSD]

It's called presenting hard, verifiable facts from the public realm unlike Socrates smoke and mirrors, and that from him who was a guy who did nothing but lose money when he had this trading challenge he entered.

Byebyebye

 

[BSD]

How did Dan Zanger do that? Did he use extremely risky money management?

Ive read a few times that brokers say most scalpers are losers and that the the majority of the winners are traders that hold positions longer although I have no idea if its true

Not really, Dan just compounded very aggressively as his equity kept growing, and by holding on for as long as his trades trended in his direction, kinda like Darvas, I've contacted Dan a couple of times, he is very accessible.

And yes, re winning percentages Paul Tudor Jones who started out as a broker said the same thing, 95% of daytraders are losers which simply stands to reason as you piiting the odds against yourself by cutting winning trades short arbitrarily by exiting end of day at the latest.

 

[new_trader]

 

[new_trader]

Not really, Dan just compounded very aggressively, I've contacted him a couple of times, he is very accessible.

And yes, re winning percentages Paul Tudor Jones who started out as a broker said the same thing, 95% of daytraders are losers which simply stands to reason as you are cutting winning trades short by exiting end of day at the latest.

What is your point? This proves what exactly? That you are a successful trader? That you trade at all? This proves nothing BSD other than the fact that what I say is right. YOU know nothing about trading at any level and as a result you are in no position to judge what others write about trading.

Someone let me know when BSD agrees to put his money where his mouth is.

Merry Christmas

 

[BSD]

I really think newtrader should be banned for posting nothing but incessant BS that provides zero value added.

Guys like him working shifts or Toast who not long ago paid for a daytrading course or Socrates, all in denial about undeniable facts such as that of course simple technical analysis can and does work as eg a Dan Zanger and oh so many more are ample proof of contribute nothing to a trading site and are without doubt one of the reasons why so many quality posters working at banks or hedge funds or trading successfully for themselves have stopped contributing here because the noise ratio is simply getting out of hand.

People who know me here know I trade for a living but thats totally, completely and utterly beside the point, which is why I always back up what I say with verifiable facts freely available from the public realm instead of inventing friends or stories no one can verify anyway.

This ain't religion and about beliefs, trading is about hard facts that are available in abundance if one isn't in denial about what one can see if one opens ones eyes.

TA don't work ?

Tell that to Dan Zanger.

You can compound daytrading methods ?

Tell that to teh guys at prop firms and ask them why they aren't compounding then, why hedge funds cannot emulate the returns of pro traders, because in real life the bigger you get the more your returns will diminish.

twi, another guy who stopped posting, was at a prop firm and is at ahedge fund now, stating the perfectly obvious to anyone with a brain:

Many people think if you make 20-30% a year that you are doing brilliantly well. Many here will make 50-100% per month. It is not a methodology you could apply to large amounts of capital such as fund trading but for individuals accounts it cannot be bettered.

 

[Splitlink]

What is your point? This proves what exactly? That you are a successful trader? That you trade at all? This proves nothing BSD other than the fact that what I say is right. YOU know nothing about trading at any level and as a result you are in no position to judge what others write about trading.

Someone let me know when BSD agrees to put his money where his mouth is.

Merry Christmas

BSD goes away periodically and I have not been in contact for months. I like the guy and I like DT, too. Probabably, I would like you, as well, if you were not so cosy with Socrates and talked to us about trading.

Anyway, this was a good thread until you three started to throw buns at each other. Now, it is degenerating, which is a pity.

Merry Christmas to everyone.

 

[BSD]

Merry Xmas Split

I just go away and more because the number of real traders here just keeps getting lower and lower, while a bunch of loonies are rampaging around here posting misleading nonsense.

Honestly, a trading site where goons run around claiming TA doesn't work ???

That liquidity is not an issue when considering a strategy to compound to the max ???

What's the point of posting on a site where such complete, utter and total BS is considered acceptable and is tolerated ?

And what's best all that nonsense from guys doing shift work to make a living or deluded to think that taking a daytrading course when all the info is freely available all over is a great idea ???

 

[Hilarymannah]

BSD,....These forums have many dimensions (they're not all about teaching newbies)
A varied perspective is always expediant in this journey we call "life",.......

 

[DionysusToast]

Originally Posted by BSD
Socrates who lost money in the trading challenge he entered, newtrader and Toast haha, all of the same ilk, losers posting nothing but smoke, mirrors and BS, because they don't grasp the success relevant factors, that trading is simply a probability game where the only ways of making money directionally are buying low, selling high, or buying high, selling higher, that's it, no rocket science involved there anywhere as Dan Zanger amply proves.

Anyway, I am definitely not gonna waste time on this ludicrous joke of a "chalenge" as it's completely irrelevant, my point, corroborated by common sense, people who verifiably trade size like Dan Zanger or GammaJammer or also exbanker meanreversion or other hedge fund managers here is that A: the big money is made in the big moves, B: you cannot trade size off of short term time frames because of liquidity issues.

5000 bucks is supposed to be size ???

Jesus I really feel I am talking with complete, utter and total loonies.

Unbelievable.

Not sure where this post went - seems to have disappeared.

BSD - are you saying here that the $5k amount is too low? Would you prefer $50k? We could escrow the cash and have a formal contract written up by a lawyer if you like. That way we could define the rules of this bet. Say we both throw in $1k right now for the lawyers fees & then bring this bet up to your level a little.

You can put your $50k to charity if you win - personally, my plan would be to bank it.

Also - as this is turning into a cut & paste converstation - you might want to consider Paul Rotter too http://www.trading-naked.com/library/paul-rotter-trader-monthly.pdf

I'll take a bet on him not being imaginary too if you like. Still - I don't know Paul - I just know of what he's supposed to be doing - but like all these guys - you never really know.

These articles (as with the ones you post) could all just be part of a push to bring more people to the markets.