xpertstocktrader
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Evening trading US shares
- Thread starter Mr. Charts
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TheBramble
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Iraj, while I have always appreciated the insights you provide into the markets and your obvious stats bias, I don't see what the purpose of these posts are.
When we were playing around with VWAP (how many years ago was that?) there was a clear and identifiable purpose and mechanism and your position sizing strats and risk calculations offered then I still use in concept form today.
However, these posts and screen shots offer nothing of interest other than an opportunity to enjoy another member’s trading successes. While a good crow is always in order now and again, these posts are similar in utility to those offered at one time by another member on this thread – the ‘look what I did but I’m not saying how’ posts - a practise I believe we both abhorred.
Absolutely no offence intended and perhaps this is of more use to those who have personally seen you trade and understand the mechanics behind it, but I suspect for the majority, there’s little of interest or use.
When we were playing around with VWAP (how many years ago was that?) there was a clear and identifiable purpose and mechanism and your position sizing strats and risk calculations offered then I still use in concept form today.
However, these posts and screen shots offer nothing of interest other than an opportunity to enjoy another member’s trading successes. While a good crow is always in order now and again, these posts are similar in utility to those offered at one time by another member on this thread – the ‘look what I did but I’m not saying how’ posts - a practise I believe we both abhorred.
Absolutely no offence intended and perhaps this is of more use to those who have personally seen you trade and understand the mechanics behind it, but I suspect for the majority, there’s little of interest or use.
Grey1
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Tony
These posts are in support of my VWap engine and the strageies i have been advocating for last past few years in cluding the importance of the risk managment. Strategy developers need to support their models with real time proof other wise it is of no value.
The cycle analysis, Darvas break out and strategy 3 and how to combine them for a profitable out put is the foundation of the above screen shot and I hope traders take more notice of more advanced side of Technical analysis. ..
Hope this clears the issue ,,,
Grey1
timsk
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Tony,
It'll come as no surprise to you that I disagree with your comments - especially the first one which, I suspect strongly, is a thinly veiled reference to Mr. Charts. Mr. C's posts were almost always accompanied by a chart clearly showing the instrument traded, time of day and timeframe, entry and exit. As you well know, he didn't offer detailed explanations of his trades as that information is reserved for his students. Even so, given that most traders here have some grasp of T.A., his charts are a great visual resource for all wannabe U.S. day traders to study and learn from. A lot can be learned from simple questions like " why did he enter / exit there?" and "oh look, he entered at a similar place on all 5 charts - I wonder what they've got in common". Traders then look hard and start to see things for themselves which, arguably, is of greater value in the long run than having something handed to one on a plate.
By the same token, most of the above also applies to Grey 1's trades. Personally, I struggle to relate to his highly technical approach, but I accept fully that it works well and that he is a consistently profitable trader. There aren't any charts, but anyone interested enough in his approach can create one and mark up the entry and exit. As a resource for T2W members, would you not agree that it's much better to have Richard's and Iraj's trades even with their minimal notation, than it is to have the likes of me posting trades with mountains of waffle explaining and justifying my actions.
Tim.
TheBramble
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There's an awful lot of c!rap talked about working it out for yourself v. being handed to you on a plate. As if there's some inherent merit in taking the tough route. And as if it could ever be handed to you on a plate. It’s tough enough without taking the puritanical route, unless you’re looking for ‘reasons’ for failure.
Look, I know how to trade and I do so. I also know how long it took me to get to here and how much it cost. If I give you my trades so far today, it tells you nothing, other than I’m up on the day. If I tell you why I took those trades and why I exited when I did – that’s different. It’s not being handed to you on a plate. I get it wrong too. You get to work with something that mostly works and make it your own and make it better. Something wrong with that?
Look at the stocks in Grey1’s screenshot – KLAC, AKAM, COST, EBAY, AAPL, EXPD…And then look at his entries and exits. Pretty good. But did he pick the best entry and exit? No, of course not! But here’s the thing, Iraj is trading this largely automated (fully?) and he’s making money. Which is great. And of absolutely no use to anyone who doesn’t know what he’s basing that on.
No disrespect to anyone, especially Iraj whose contributions I appreciate massively. But unless you’re doing what Iraj is doing and know what Iraj knows, those suggestions you make as to ‘working out’ what it is he is doing are not only futile, they are counter-productive as they take you away from what it is you can be usefully researching and analysing for yourself.
With respect Tim, you see what you want to see in me and my posts and you don’t seem to recognise that people change. You’re still filtering all my stuff through your own, old perceptual filters and protecting that which is no longer being attacked. You’re wasting your energies.
Look, I know how to trade and I do so. I also know how long it took me to get to here and how much it cost. If I give you my trades so far today, it tells you nothing, other than I’m up on the day. If I tell you why I took those trades and why I exited when I did – that’s different. It’s not being handed to you on a plate. I get it wrong too. You get to work with something that mostly works and make it your own and make it better. Something wrong with that?
Look at the stocks in Grey1’s screenshot – KLAC, AKAM, COST, EBAY, AAPL, EXPD…And then look at his entries and exits. Pretty good. But did he pick the best entry and exit? No, of course not! But here’s the thing, Iraj is trading this largely automated (fully?) and he’s making money. Which is great. And of absolutely no use to anyone who doesn’t know what he’s basing that on.
No disrespect to anyone, especially Iraj whose contributions I appreciate massively. But unless you’re doing what Iraj is doing and know what Iraj knows, those suggestions you make as to ‘working out’ what it is he is doing are not only futile, they are counter-productive as they take you away from what it is you can be usefully researching and analysing for yourself.
With respect Tim, you see what you want to see in me and my posts and you don’t seem to recognise that people change. You’re still filtering all my stuff through your own, old perceptual filters and protecting that which is no longer being attacked. You’re wasting your energies.
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Grey1
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All above entries was when 10 min INDU MACCI's cycle came to the end ,,
This is how you basket trade.. You choose a leading indicator , you trade a basket of stocks all executed at the same time as soon as there is a technical Turn around in the indicator.. IB allows this to be done and is free,,
These are the advantages:--
1) Technical inefficiencies can be exploited fast across a broad spectrum of stocks hence more $$$
2) No liquidity issue.. in another word if you was to execute 10 000 Stock X @ market then you might not get a fill and you might even flood the market as well as letting other program trades to trade against you .. By basket trading they wont be able to see you coming ,,, IN and out fast
3) By basket trading you are actually spreading the risk and this is a MUST have strategy .
4) you can trade any consolidation period as there is no long term trends .. so you can trade and close at the end of the 1 MIN time frame for a quick scalp giving you any thing up to 20C in fast moving stocks
5) you can make more money .
nearly all programTrades use the above principal
Look at the enclosed chart ,,,, the line shows all stocks turned around @ the vertical line shown ,,, Does it matter in what stock you was in at the time ? NOPE,,, why ? because of the market turn around ,, so next time some one told you choose this or that stock because of this or that chart pattern is bearish or bullish tell him WHAT IF MARKET TURNED AROUND AND WENT AGAINST ME...
Chart traders trading the market soley by looking at bullish or bearsh patterns are wasting their time . MARKET FIRST STOCK SECOND
grey1
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TheBramble
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Now, that is the sort of detail that makes all the difference.
How many have been prepared to step up to the plate and lay it down to that level of detail? Very few.
I think, based on my own experience on these boards, that the trouble taken to spell it out is never, ever reciprocated or acknowledged. It’s not that the kudos is required or anything like that, it’s the simple need for recognition of a job well done and the lack of any sort of feedback to indicate the message has hit home – it is so rarely explicated…
I can understand why the few who do have what it takes decide to not continue to take the trouble.
How many have been prepared to step up to the plate and lay it down to that level of detail? Very few.
I think, based on my own experience on these boards, that the trouble taken to spell it out is never, ever reciprocated or acknowledged. It’s not that the kudos is required or anything like that, it’s the simple need for recognition of a job well done and the lack of any sort of feedback to indicate the message has hit home – it is so rarely explicated…
I can understand why the few who do have what it takes decide to not continue to take the trouble.
Trader333
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Iraj,
Why not just short the INDU index ? If the trigger to determine to short a number of stocks is the turn of Macci on INDU then what is the difference unless you are specifically referring to your approach to spread the risk across a number of different instruments.
Paul
Why not just short the INDU index ? If the trigger to determine to short a number of stocks is the turn of Macci on INDU then what is the difference unless you are specifically referring to your approach to spread the risk across a number of different instruments.
Paul
more stocks spreads the overall position size and probably achieves better fills/less slippage which becomes extremely important for a quick in and out. The range exploited I imagine is relatively small so you can't afford to miss price levels ,or move them yourself.
Grey1
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paul,
The intra day technical move on INDU is not enough to justify the trade where as with INDU just moving 5 points a gain of a 20C in hundreds of stock is possible resulting in much gain across the boarder sector
Some program trades also take position on their market indicator too but their position size must be rather small.
However ,The most important aspect of basket trading as said by chump is the risk element. The distribution of the risk is a MUST have strategy in ALL and i mean ALL program Trading .
grey1
Grey1
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Ofcourse not ,, you look for these stocks on their merit on the DAILY chart . You choose them a night before... Other program Trades choose other criterias such as 60 min intra day .. This is one of the areas some program trades differ.. other areas they differ is in the risk managment side of the execution
Grey1
Grey1
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TheBramble
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Does this indicate your exits are manual, but your entries automated or are they both manual?
