Best Thread Capital Spreads

[cecja]

Hi Simon,

Thank you for replying to my previous post.

I saw you on NCBC today and i really liked your comments. (please i have one question) do they pay you to be there, or you pay them to get on the CNBC?

Thank you kindly
Cecja

 

[Manningjd]

Is spread-trading tax free, as spread-betting is?

 

[McStay]

Is spread-trading tax free, as spread-betting is?

You are right, Its not tax free .. IMHO there is no use having a tax free system that ensures you have a very limited life as a trader. I want to have a long trading life, and be as successful as I can be. spread-betting does not present that opportunity for me ..

This is not a blanket recommendation , as I am sure there may be folks to whom spread-betting represents an ideal trading style .. I am just a newby, so I don't qualify to make such recommendations. However, looking at the situation logically/practically, its my opinion that the way spread-betting is setup in the UK is just a mug's game ..

 

[capitalspreads]

Cecja

no we do not pay CNBC nor do they pay me... it is a symbiotic relationship ..they need commentators and we alsways like to have the exposure.

Manningjd

depends what you mean by spreadtrading ... but if it doesnt have the word betting in there somewhere it will not be tax free.

Steve

I cannot comment to this guy as he has absolutely no comprehension of trading or how 'our quotes' are made. No matter how many times we explainded it. His every comment shows how little he actually understands about financial market trading.

I would be interested to see a direct access platform that allowed you to buy June FTSE contracts and then sell them without closing the position (!!) or do the same with a share or FX contract. (I would imagine that your margin costs would be enormous!)

In general on our platform we charge no extra 'spread' no matter how far out you trade in futures related markets so you could theoretically buy the June FTSE and Sell the Sept and thus create two equal and opposite positions. (of course longer dated share trades have a wider total price spread but this is due to interest rate costs not Capital Spreads' spread)

His comment about double the spread is to do with the fact that stops get hit on an 'our quote' basis and he reckons that as he has already paid the spread in getting into the position so the stop should only be activated if the entire spread quote goes through his stop level.

So that if his stop was to sell GBP/USD at 1.8310 he would only be hit when the price went to 1.8307-10 not when the price went to 1.8310-13

One wonders how he thinks we could hedge his trades if we lost three pips on every stop exit!!

As I say you cannot please all the people all the time and we have done well to have this thread going for so long before attracting a losing ranter.

In anticipation of a futher comment from mr McStay ..
please open an account with a direct access broker and see when your stops are activated. You will put your stop in the computer and as soon as the level is reached the computer will activate it and stop you out. In FX you may find a platform with tighter spreads than us. I believe there is one out there ! But I have yet to receive any positive comments from clients who are using it.

Ah well ... it would be nice if every client was happy but... we all live in the real world.

good luck

Simon

 

[al-motor]

manning- i think u maybe referring to Spread trading in the futures-

That normally will not be tax free

Al

 

[al-motor]

Simon,

Could u send us an email ( i have an account with u) when/if u do forex trading...........

thanks
Al

 

[stevespray]

In a regular futures contract or spread-contract, this is possible. One contract is a distinct entity which can stand by itself, and should not prevent you from buying another contract which represents taking an opposite position. Of course, one can also choose to adjust their initial position by closing out part of the initial contract. Please, tell me why this should be impossible, as long as you have the funds to take that position.

thx.

Whilst I can not pass any meaningful comments on 'spread-trading' I happen to know that you are incorrect / misinformed with regard the electronic futures contracts which most people trade. If you personally trade 'open outcry' in the pit then I am prepared to be corrected. However, in the case of electronic futures dealing, I am certain that you can not hold two opposing positions in the same market. Even if you could there would little point. Your exposure to market movement is simply your net position and therefore that is the position you deem to hold.

You still didn answer my question - Why would you need to hold opposing positions in the same market?

Steve.

 

[McStay]

I cannot comment to this guy as he has absolutely no comprehension of trading or how 'our quotes' are made. No matter how many times we explainded it. His every comment shows how little he actually understands about financial market trading.

You are right I could not comprehend such a loaded setup .. I do realise you are obligated to say what you can to make the mugs to keep coming .. good luck to you, but it should not be at other peoples' expense.

I would be interested to see a direct access platform that allowed you to buy June FTSE contracts and then sell them without closing the position (!!) or do the same with a share or FX contract. (I would imagine that your margin costs would be enormous!)

Well they do exist, and I wonder why this should be unknown to a guru like yourself .. and pls, I did not claim they were direct access platforms.

His comment about double the spread is to do with the fact that stops get hit on an 'our quote' basis and he reckons that as he has already paid the spread in getting into the position so the stop should only be activated if the entire spread quote goes through his stop level.

So that if his stop was to sell GBP/USD at 1.8310 he would only be hit when the price went to 1.8307-10 not when the price went to 1.8310-13

One wonders how he thinks we could hedge his trades if we lost three pips on every stop exit!!

Thats an interesting comment coming from a 'guru' .. well, with all the trading I have done so far , the market price action determines when stops are triggered. When you buy a contract, you buy at a spread adjusted price, and when u sell, u sell at a spread-adjusted price.

As I say you cannot please all the people all the time and we have done well to have this thread going for so long before attracting a losing ranter.

In anticipation of a futher comment from mr McStay ..
please open an account with a direct access broker and see when your stops are activated.

Well, I have already opened an account and been actively trading it .. and the system is working as a fair system should work. I am gone now, and you have lost one mug .. wonder how long before you will go the way of E*Trade, and look to get out of this setup. The mugs are getting wiser !!!

 

[mburdge]

McStay,

Don't give up on spread betting. I know nothing about capital spreads, but I have used D4F for over 2 years without a hitch.
Their spreads are a tight as anyone's, they have now (finally) got excellent charts and the system is totally robust.

I have never had any issues with the legitimacy of stops that get hit etc.

I have searched the market for direct access brokers that can add any value to me, such as tighter spreads, lower margin requirements, stable and reliable platform; but not found anything better.

Add in the tax free element and I can't see me changing until have I have made enough money to go offshore!

I'm not the greatest trader yet, but I know I can't blame the tools provided!

happy trading

 

[McStay]

mburdge,

A million thanks for the encouraging post .. maybe I will give deal4free a try .. At least, I now know what to check about their system before committing funds to them. Yes, on paper, the tax-free nature does sound attractive .. and all one is asking for is a fair trading system ..

cheers & thx.

 

[neil]

You Jest

McStay,

Don't give up on spread betting. I know nothing about capital spreads, but I have used D4F for over 2 years without a hitch.
Their spreads are a tight as anyone's, they have now (finally) got excellent charts and the system is totally robust.

I have never had any issues with the legitimacy of stops that get hit etc.

I have searched the market for direct access brokers that can add any value to me, such as tighter spreads, lower margin requirements, stable and reliable platform; but not found anything better.

Add in the tax free element and I can't see me changing until have I have made enough money to go offshore!

I'm not the greatest trader yet, but I know I can't blame the tools provided!

happy trading

Interactive Brokers -spreads are tighter than any spread bettor. It is misleading to say you cannot find tighter spreads in the Direct Market Access arena.

 

[mburdge]

Neil,

Agreed, you may get slightly tighter spreads than 3 pts from some brokers, but for most smallish traders, a good spreadbet platform is fine. (and tha tax advantage is a bit advantage)

I'll tell you what though: If most traders concentrated on their trading skills, discipline and money management instead of worrying about brokers, the odd pip per trade would become irrelevant!!

 

[neil]

Yep

Neil,

Agreed, you may get slightly tighter spreads than 3 pts from some brokers, but for most smallish traders, a good spreadbet platform is fine. (and tha tax advantage is a bit advantage)

I'll tell you what though: If most traders concentrated on their trading skills, discipline and money management instead of worrying about brokers, the odd pip per trade would become irrelevant!!

Valid point

 

[capitalspreads]

mburge

I could not agree with you more... too many clients think that trading (spread..direct access or whatever) is an instant route to riches and are not willing to do the 'real' analytical work on their trades before executing them.

Just making a bet/trade because it 'felt like the right thing to do at the time' is a sure fire route (eventually) to losing your money.

Every bet must have a legitimate reason behind it .... every bet should have a predetermined point at which the dealer realises he/she is wrong and gets out.

Whatever charting/analysis system you use (and there are literally hundreds of them out there) remember ......a good trader is one who knows when to take a loss !!

Any fool can take a profit.

Good Luck

Simon

 

[alf25]

Example

Example how could auto quote window looks like:

all in one window what about this ????

 

[BroadSword]

...In FX you may find a platform with tighter spreads than us. I believe there is one out there ! But I have yet to receive any positive comments from clients who are using it

Simon

Hi Simon, this caught my eye!

Do you mean Oanda? 1.5 pip spread on eur/usd, and a fantastic package - so that's a positive comment....

I'm almost as equally positive about CS btw...!

 

[capitalspreads]

broadsword

actually I must apologise, when I reread my comment it seemed to imply that I had received bad feedback about oanda.

What I meant to say was that I had not actually received any comments about them. Sorry

alf

I do see your point about this and we may look at this in a while. I think that it would have to be placed in a specific trade area as I can imagine with some of our less sophisicated clients a deal ticket as described may prove confusing (!?)

Simon

 

[Jyde]

Acutally... less confusing than the current...

 

[bobmick]

Hi,
I may sound a bit thick but how come the prices / spreads seem to go all to buggery as soon as the markets close? This seems to give a totally false position on open trades overnight.
I'm sure someone can clear this up for me!

 

[robert bincroft]

Are you talking REAL CASH or simulated?