Brexit - in or out

We are pack animals like dogs. Being out on one's own is not a safe place to be really, especially if you have a premier who likes to strut the world stage and make objectionable remarks.
I think many will reluctantly vote to stay with the EU on the basis of - the devil you know is better than the uncertainties you don't. Plus all the upheaval and cost etc.
I doubt it will affect me too much personally. Pensioners are a soft target for whoever wins.

Not many will personally remember all the strife of the 70s. There were major strikes nearly all the time. Noone wants to go back to that, do they ? Plus all the Irish troubles are boiling away below the surface and likely to resurface.
 
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Pat494 said:
We are pack animals like dogs. Being out on one's own is not a safe place to be really, especially if you have a premier who likes to strut the world stage and make objectionable remarks.
I think many will reluctantly vote to stay with the EU on the basis of - the devil you know is better than the uncertainties you don't. Plus all the upheaval and cost etc.
I doubt it will affect me too much personally. Pensioners are a soft target for whoever wins.

Not many will personally remember all the strife of the 70s. There were major strikes nearly all the time. Noone wants to go back to that, do they ? Plus all the Irish troubles are boiling away below the surface and likely to resurface.
Click to expand...

Agree with the assessment. For me however, I simply likely to add UK is simply doing just great as we are. You've seen the stats. It's not fear. It's more desire to stay in Europe where interests, business and income resides.

If the out vote can demonstrate with some level of certainty the benefits of a Brexit I would seriously consider it.


The price oil shock in the 70s with post war baby boom was coming to an end globally and it impacted most industrialised countries. Response was effectively stagflation.


What we have playing out now with the deflation fear is almost in reverse which doesn't make sense???

Print money in both cases but one leads to inflation and the other deflation.
Pure and simple root cause was deregulation of the banks with excessive risk taking, inflating the capitalist balloon until it popped.

Nothing to do with EU or the Euro. :!:
 
The political parties aligned behind the Leave campaign are the DUP, TUV and UKIP. We live in strange times when so many people think these guys know best what's good for the UK.
 
tomorton said:
The political parties aligned behind the Leave campaign are the DUP, TUV and UKIP. We live in strange times when so many people think these guys know best what's good for the UK.
Click to expand...

Do you think that any politician knows what is best or cares for what is best for the UK?
:LOL:
 
Oscar Reed said:
https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.n...al/1457545797/website-brochure-hq-mar16-2.pdf
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People are really playing silly buggers with statistics and still not much clarity or honesty.

Page 29 - A vote to ‘remain’ means being constantly outvoted. Article states...

72 TIMES THE UK HAS ATTEMPTED TO BLOCK
MOTIONS BEFORE THE COUNCIL, WITH NO
SUCCESS


Fact! - The next most frequently “losing” governments (after UK), Germany and Austria, were only on the minority side 5.4% of the time in 2009-15.

However, one thing to note is the high level of agreement in both periods: the UK voted on the winning side 97.4% of the time in 2004-09 and 86.7% of the time in 2009-15.

Trying to make a BIG deal out of 8% difference in voting for the last 10 years is what I would call **** stirring in a happy marriage that does not deserve to be broken up. The increase in difference of opinion between 2009-15 no doubt refers to our recent crises.

In fact, the UK and German governments voted on opposite sides 16% of the time. Here is the link - http://www.theguardian.com/world/datablog/2015/nov/02/is-uk-winner-or-loser-european-council

In a NUT SHELL when ever one starts to drill down on the out vote camp's arguments, it all begins to crumble down to petty grumbles about not much. They talk of World Trade Organisation but try reaching deals on a global scale with 151 countries and see where it takes you. It's more of a talk shop than anything one can bargain / trade with. Oooh I know - let's all reduce tariffs and liberalise trade. Errrmmm ok you go first I'll follow when my economy picks up.

Moreover, I am in favour of the EU proposal for financial transaction tax which will mean governments are able to re-balance the books by paying off silly debts we've got our selves into. So I think UK should be voted against and it only makes common sense to tax the banks who have benefited from tax payers money.

Surprising how our GREAT de-regulatated UK banking system and financial expertise was not much different from the US or those in EU even though we are in no way tied to either the Dollar or the Euro... Explanations on a post-card please???


The rest of that link just continued bitching about how UK didn't get it's way 100% of the time.

Here's another link to support the argument by our House of Commons who investigated Voting Behaviour in the EU Council. In summary

Studies reveal that in general the UK votes more often than other EU Member States against EU measures, but even so, rarely votes against proposals.

 
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Boris Johnson is fast becoming unhinged imo.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/lond...ionship-after-mayor-mocks-obama-a3202626.html

So on one hand we are told we should leave EU so we can conduct our own special agreements to trade with countries like the US and India without EU permissions and on the other our partners the US and India, would like the UK to stay in so they can benefit from special relationships and deals with the UK and thus EU.

The two don't add up.

BIG question if UK steps outside of EU it'll be just another little isolated country with no particular significance. Both the US and India and China will look to form alliances with other big European countries such as Germany, France, Italy or Spain.

As the article suggests who benefits? Uncle Putin. :)



As mentioned before the UK is very good at using her position to leverage the maximum gain out of relations with countries in and outside of the EU.

Why would India, China and US ask us to stay in if they believed they/we could pursue more lucrative trade agreements with the UK outside of EU???


Think about it. :whistling
 
I must say I'm beginning to really like Boris Johnson. He actually told the president not to come to the UK. That is pretty funny, a mayor of a city in the UK telling the leader of the free world to not come to the UK.

Boris did have a point though. He said that we as Americans would vehemently oppose joining a union such as the EU. We should not be using our influence to convince Britons to stay in the EU. He said "Americans value their sovereignty above all else so why should they tell us to stay in the union". Indeed Americans value sovereignty as should the Britons.
 
EU project is falling apart from within and anything we can do to hasten it's demise will be most welcome both here and increasingly I suspect from abroad. The difference between Brits and all the Johnny foreigners is....Brits will act when required to do so whereas the rest just put up with things however flawed.

Nigel should be knighted for his tireless efforts in exposing EU folly and for bringing all the issues to the wider public, way before the rest jumped on the band waggon.
 
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counter_violent said:
EU project is falling apart from within and anything we can do to hasten it's demise will be most welcome both here and increasingly I suspect from abroad. The difference between Brits and all the Johnny foreigners is....Brits will act when required to do so whereas the rest just put up with things however flawed.

Nigel should be knighted for his tireless efforts in exposing EU folly and for bringing all the issues to the wider public, way before the rest jumped on the band waggon.
Click to expand...

Not looking good for the in-vote at the moment.

Everyone is obsessed with migrant crises.

Everything else is just simply not on peoples radar or perception.

Oh well, throw hands in the air and wave them as if you simply just don't care... :clap::clap::clap:
 
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