Are all my spread bet profits tax free?

[Forexmospherian]

Hi FoMo,

................................


What I am calling into question is the lack of verifiable hard evidence from the sources that matter: HMRC, FCA, Trading Standards and Advertising Standards etc.

.......................................

Aha, finally! Credit where credit is due - this is the first piece of factual evidence to support your case. It's not much, but it's a start. Can you build your case from here by providing more solid evidence that actually supports your claim that not all SB profits are tax free?


I'm happy to accept your argument that SB firms cover their backs in terms of tax laws being subject to change and that their clients are advised to seek professional advice regarding their tax liabilities etc. As others have pointed out - if someone is running a business providing tips and education etc., then they might be liable to pay tax. My guess is that the riders you've highlighted from the SB firms are primarily aimed at people like this, not at the individual retail trader who is consistently profitable. It's this latter category that we're focusing on here, so now I want to see one or more of the following . . .
1. A SB firm that has been sued and/or reported to the regulatory bodies for miss selling their products, i.e. by someone who opened an account and traded with them on the grounds that it was tax free and has then had to pay tax.
2. A directive from Trading Standards or Advertising Standards clearly stating that SB firms can not claim to offer tax free trading.
3. A case where the FCA have been involved following a complaint about SB firms offering tax free trading.
4. Examples where rival brokers (who lose business to SB firms or, alternatively, stand to gain hugely if it can be proven that SB profits are not tax free) call into question the right / ability for SB firms to be allowed to offer tax free trading.
5. Policy documents or letters from HMRC clearing stating that profits made from SB are not tax free. Or, if they are tax free in some cases but not in others, a clear explanation as to who will have to pay tax and under what circumstances etc.

You're out of the starting blocks FoMo, but you've still got a long way to go!
Tim.

Hi Tim

OK - I will spend a bit of time coming up with more info you require - or as I might call it - the "real devil in the detail"

I have already found out only ETX spreadbetting company don't seem to have on their website in the small print with the asterisk - advising you to check your own individual circumstances etc - they are just saying spreadbetting is tax free in the UK - interesting ?

I believe it is not a "black or white" -" yes or no" subject - simply because it suits the government and its bodies to NOT be and to be a "grey area subject" so it can be individually applied according to the circumstances of the spread better.

It will take me a bit of time to source all the info you require - but I will do my best.

Next bit of clarity - any spreadbetter who is employed for more than 21 hrs a week in a separate business ( ie teacher / plumber / accounts clerk etc ) ( thats even a grey area - it can be just 16 hrs a week in some Tax areas ) and pays tax and NI - whether it be just a few thousand pound a year or over £7 / 10K per annum from higher then average earners - and spread bets - whether just 1 hr a week or 40 hrs a week can claim tax free returns off all their wins during the year. It would not matter if it totals £5k per annum or less - or even £50k p a + its still then tax free.

However according to my own personal accountant from a small Midlands company with just 3 offices in and around Birmingham and Sutton Coldfield - who engaged a tax expert from KPMG on my own investigation - If you are a only working part time and under the £10k tax threshold and spend all your time spread betting and make profits that take you above the £10k tax threshold - to say just £15k per annum or even £50k + per annum - then that can be subject to tax at the normal rates - purely because the tax authorities are saying you do not meet their requirements to have your spread bet winning tax free.

You will be in the exception - maybe less than 5% of all spreadbetters - purely because the majority lose and the rest fall in the first category I mentioned - ie pay tax already from their proper employment.

There are then other associated spread betting "grey" tax areas - ie trying to do what I had planned - ie declare some of my profits from FX trading via a proper broker and then try and make the majority via a spread betting company - so paying minimum tax whilst trying save £15 -30K off an annual tax bill ( this was when I was on over £100 + per pip with GFT UK).

Also if you are selling courses and dvd's etc on trading - then that is associated to your spreadbetting and profits made cannot go tax free .

When you think about it - the government have to have ways of dealing with the minority and I have been surprised to find out that in the UK last year 30% of all income tax collected - came from just the top 1 % earners of the working population.

So taking that point into spreadbetting - you could get a few hundred very smart profession multi millionaires (or even the odd few billionaire) investors paying more to spreadbet - because it would work out overall cheaper than via there normal brokers and paying full tax

I have a contact at the Trading standards office and will see what I can find out there - along with a barrister friend at Birmingham's law chambers ( St Philips ) to see if they can point me in the right direction on the rest of the info you require

Please give me a few days to a week or so

Regards


F

 

[NVP]

jees I cant leave you guys alone for even 1 minute can I ..........play nicely

I remember from my accountancy training days (1834-1872) that its also all about badges of trade ........and what constitutes running a business vs a few non taxable profits here and there on 1 off activities that require no taxation (eg a car boot sale once a year) .........lots of components/rules and all stacked in the taxmans favour .....he wants your money make no mistake

in truth there are loads of ways around this but no one is going to start disclosing here ....lets be honest !!!

If you are afraid of that doorbell in the night .....one could simply be open and approach the nice men from the tax office and show them what you are doing and how much you have made using what brokers etc etc..........they will decide what constitutes business activity etc etc ...........

but beware ..............as my dad used to say :-

never ask a barber if you need a haircut ........


hahahahah

N

 

[SpreadBeta]

Following on from NVPs post above, on the badges of trade, and if/how HMRC may look at you to see if you are "trading" in there opinion, please find below a copy of a post I put into a similar thread last year where HMRC we're arguing that the individual was NOT actually trading (and the criteria they used in their arguments)

forexmospherian, if you don't mind me asking, how many of the (9) points below that HMRC used to determine the individual in this case was NOT trading (as they didn't show/have the badges of trade) would describe your situation when HMRC came after you ?

(More recently there's this case : http://esrg-taxation.co.uk/poker-pr...ns-hakki-v-secretary-state-work-pensions-2014. - As the article author states...This was not directly a tax case (it was regarding Child Maintenance), but does add to the knowledge base on whether a ‘professional gambler’ can, or indeed cannot, be taxable on his winnings.)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I found the following link/tribunal case (DR K M A MANZUR vs HMRC) which is interesting in that it was the taxpayer that was arguing that they were TRADING (in shares in this case) and the arguments that HRMC successfully put forward to say that they were not.

I assume that some of HMRC own arguments could therefore be useful if challenged by HMRC where they claim you are trading (if they ignore the obvious I'm betting so it's not taxable in the first place argument)

http://www.financeandtaxtribunals.gov.uk/judgmentfiles/j5199/TC00830.doc

HMRCs main arguments in the case, were that the taxpayer was NOT undertaking a trade because:

(1)​ a trader would have customers or clients
(2)​ the transactions would be of high volume (more than the taxpayers 300 trades /year)
(3)​ a trader would Limit risk exposure using hedging and derivative instruments
(4)​ a trader would Operate within strict rules on risk;
(5)​ a trader would not trade on their own account (I'm not sure about this one?)
(6) a trader would have formal relevant financial qualifications in support of a trading business, and is they are we're regulated by the FSA
(7) a trader would spend more than the 2 hours a day on their endeavour as this taxpayer did.
(8) a trader would not be dependent on market movements alone to make a profit.

9) Also, although not part of this case, I believe that that if you are trading CFDs/forex and ALSO spreadbetting in similar instruments at the same time, then HMRC may try to argue that your spreadbetting is simply an extension of your CFD taxable trading and therefore should be taxed accordingly.

It is also point number (6) above that may mean that if you have formal qualifications in a relevant financial trading area (say in you old day job) or we're previously considered a trader by HMRC and have now switched even 100% to spreadbetting they become more interested in looking at what you are doing in your spreadbetting and may look to tax you. (As having a trade of "professional gambler")

Bottom line from my perspective is that the further you are from the what HMRC considers to be a "trader", the less chance you have ever even being looked at by HMRC for tax on your "successful" spreadbetting, even if they are just chancing their arm..

 

[tomorton]

Most of us are afraid HMRC will try to find a way to tax SB profits if they can. As per the Manzur case and others, they are more likely to fear the trader who is trying to be taxed, by arguing they are a "sole trader". "Sole trader" status brings a package of advantages.

 

[Forexmospherian]

Following on from NVPs post above, on the badges of trade, and if/how HMRC may look at you to see if you are "trading" in there opinion, please find below a copy of a post I put into a similar thread last year where HMRC we're arguing that the individual was NOT actually trading (and the criteria they used in their arguments)

forexmospherian, if you don't mind me asking, how many of the (9) points below that HMRC used to determine the individual in this case was NOT trading (as they didn't show/have the badges of trade) would describe your situation when HMRC came after you ?


Bottom line from my perspective is that the further you are from the what HMRC considers to be a "trader", the less chance you have ever even being looked at by HMRC for tax on your "successful" spreadbetting, even if they are just chancing their arm..

Hi SpreadBeta.

My case was a totally unusual situation - and in a sense the investigation on my tax affairs actually did me a favour - as it clarified a "grey area" and saved me having a bigger headache further down the road - ie like now or in another 3 years.

For a start - I was already on the old IR hit list from the late 1980's. So that went against me as I was always going to be having regular tax investigations every 4 -6 years all the while until I fully retired.

I had owned a vending company in the 80's which basically took £4-5 million a year in revenue - with 70% of it all in £1 coins. So a cash business - and a red flag on the tax authorities hit list. On 2 occasions I was charged with under declaring income and claiming certain business tax relief - and so the penalty and the fines were more than the small amount of tax that had not been paid.

The fact that I had sold that particular business on by the mid 2000's and was no longer was involved with any cash business - did not stop the HMRC wanting to investigate me again - and I am sure they will do it again within the next 2 years.

I fell foul on some of the 9 points mentioned ( mainly point 9 ) - but mainly because I had been declaring an income from monies invested abroad via a couple of companies - including FXCM. The fact that I had made profits from currency trading and paid tax on it - and then went over to spreadbetting with CMC and GFTUK - and was not paying any other income tax for a couple of years meant I was a not in the proper category for being able to claim tax free status on all my spread betting profits.

Now this is where the Tax offices are so clever - they can then change the ballgame and go after you on penalties and fines - never mind just saying you need to pay the tax on those spread betting profits - ie dress it up differently.

In my previous cases - it was all down to negotiation and how strong a case you felt you had - as with the HMRC - you are guilty until you prove you are totally innocent - not like in law - ie you are innocent until proved guilty.

Its possible to get anything from 10 to 70% off your new Tax calculation all based on your negotiation power along with being able to pay quickly - say within 7 days

So for example they want £9024 38 p off you and then you prove they are wrong and you offer £750 within 7 days . Somewhere in between will be the final result.

If anyone suffers the humiliation of having to swear on oath and being intimidated whilst they pull you apart - its not nice - but its sure great way to strengthen your mindset again - and so good for currency trading ;-)

You really don't have to worry if you have a job and up to date with your tax affairs and already pay income tax, - your spread betting gains are tax free

But - If you only pay say £4k a year in income tax and live in an expensive property or two with a lavish life style and all the trimmings thinking that the £100k - £300k of spread betting profits are all tax free - then think again - more than likely one day you will receive a nice letter from you local Tax Office

Regards

F

 

[Forexmospherian]

jees I cant leave you guys alone for even 1 minute can I ..........play nicely

I remember from my accountancy training days (1834-1872) that its also all about badges of trade ........................


hahahahah

N

Hi N

Gosh - did not know you were that old - even 1964 to 72 makes you ancient lol

Yes you can sell what 6 cars a year and pay no tax on any gains - but 7 or 8 cars a year and then you are classified as a "car dealer" is another one

Its when you have the Tax office on speed dial and they call you by your first name you have too worry lol

See you trading in the morning N and GL

Regards

F

 

[timsk]

. . . Please give me a few days to a week or so

Hi FoMo,
I'm not going to address each of your points as I've done previously as, hopefully, you get the general picture by now and know what it is that I and others want to see in order to be persuaded by your argument.

Suffice to say, along with the 5 points of factual evidence in my last post, it would help your case enormously if you avoided the following . . .
1. Avoid repeating the same points you've already made. Their strength isn't reinforced with each mention - it's diluted.
2. Avoid hearsay, opinion, conjecture and anecdotes that are unsupported by official documentation from regulatory bodies or HMRC etc. By way of example, you say: However according to my own personal accountant from a small Midlands company with just 3 offices in and around Birmingham and Sutton Coldfield - who engaged a tax expert from KPMG on my own investigation - If you are a only working part time and under the £10k tax threshold and spend all your time spread betting and make profits that take you above the £10k tax threshold - to say just £15k per annum or even £50k + per annum - then that can be subject to tax at the normal rates - purely because the tax authorities are saying you do not meet their requirements to have your spread bet winning tax free. This only has value if you can support it with a letter from HMRC or a policy document to back it up. At the very least, get it in writing from your accountant on headed notepaper. Otherwise, I'm afraid it counts for nothing in my book.
3. Avoid reference to your own personal opinion and circumstances at all times - unless you are prepared to back up what you say with official documentation.
4. Avoid going off-topic and be as concise as possible. Please stay focused on the subject in hand. Look at Spreadbeta's post above: he backs up his points with evidence in the form of official links. That's what you need to do.

Lastly, you say: I believe it is not a "black or white" -" yes or no" subject - simply because it suits the government and its bodies to NOT be and to be a "grey area subject" so it can be individually applied according to the circumstances of the spread better. This is the crux of the issue. You need to demonstrate beyond reasonable doubt that a spread bettor who makes consistent profits will - in all probability - have to pay tax. To a greater or lesser extent, the tax free status of spread betting is the 'edge' enjoyed by SB firms and the main reason why many of their clients use them in preference to brokers with tighter spreads, better/faster trading platforms, STP, NDD etc., etc. If/when you or others are able to show this is not the case then, IMO, it will have seismic implications for retail trading as a whole in the U.K. and for the spread betting industry in particular.

Let me know when you're done!
Tim.

 

[Forexmospherian]

Hi FoMo,


..........................


Lastly, you say: I believe it is not a "black or white" -" yes or no" subject - simply because it suits the government and its bodies to NOT be and to be a "grey area subject" so it can be individually applied according to the circumstances of the spread better. This is the crux of the issue. You need to demonstrate beyond reasonable doubt that a spread bettor who makes consistent profits will - in all probability - have to pay tax. To a greater or lesser extent, the tax free status of spread betting is the 'edge' enjoyed by SB firms and the main reason why many of their clients use them in preference to brokers with tighter spreads, better/faster trading platforms, STP, NDD etc., etc. If/when you or others are able to show this is not the case then, IMO, it will have seismic implications for retail trading as a whole in the U.K. and for the spread betting industry in particular.

Let me know when you're done!
Tim.

Morning Tim

Yes got the message and would just like to issue a "health warning" on both of us - with reference to this highlighted point

Going back to the title of this thread - ie Are all my spread bet profits tax free ?

My aim is to say -Yes they might be today - if you fall in the correct category - ie say you are employed as a Fireman or office worker or computer sales man etc - and you pay your income tax and NI and up to date with your tax affairs.

You bet part time on the financial markets and for the last 5 years you have been profitable for say 4 years and made a total say £15k or even £40k

Then as of today - all that spread bet profit from just £1 to even lets say £200k + is TAX FREE for you,

Now - lets say you are so delighted with your success and you inherit say £30k and decide to drop the job and go full time spread betting the markets.

You were earning from your job say £35k per annum and you reckon now full time as you own boss - you can earn £50 - 70k + per annum - at home - just for say 20 -30 hrs a week etc.

Now - everything changes.

If you over the next 3 yrs only spread bet and are successful and you make say in total £150k or more over the period - then - it will NOT be tax free once the Tax office know about it.

They will not tax you on your past spread bets before you went full time and stopped paying your normal income tax etc. BUT - your financial and your Tax situation as changed - and you will not get away with saying - its tax free still

This is the main crux of what I am trying to back up with hard fact and indisputable evidence.

If however you stay in your job - never fall foul of the tax system - pay all your taxes and then stay spread betting part time for the next 5 or 10 years - and make more profits - all those bet profits are tax free still

I hope I have clarified my "point" but as you quite rightly say - back it up with hard factual evidence etc - which of course I plan to do

Regards


F

 

[leemo]

Hi FoMo, Your patience is amazing

 

[barjon]

fxmo

You can save yourself a lot of time by going to HMRC Search web page and searching for spreadbetting.

When you've done that look particularly at:


Meaning of trade: exceptions and alternatives: betting and gambling - spread betting
The profits of Spread betting are only taxable if they arise from the carrying on of a trade


Meaning of trade: exceptions and alternatives: betting and gambling - introduction
An introdution to the guidance on the taxation of betting, gambling and related activities


Meaning of trade: exceptions and alternatives: contents
Table of contents for trade: exceptions & alternatives section of the Business Income Manual

You will see that the "old hat" references I posted earlier are still the primary guidance and legal precedent.

You can ferret around as much as you like but the fact remains that it is all tax free at the moment whether or not it is your sole source of income. The only caveat is whether it is associated with a related activity - such as selling trading tips, for example - when the spread betting may be deemed to be part of an overall business activity and thus taxable.

 

[Forexmospherian]

fxmo

You can save yourself a lot of time by going to HMRC Search web page and searching for spreadbetting.

When you've done that look particularly at:


Meaning of trade: exceptions and alternatives: betting and gambling - spread betting
The profits of Spread betting are only taxable if they arise from the carrying on of a trade


Meaning of trade: exceptions and alternatives: betting and gambling - introduction
An introdution to the guidance on the taxation of betting, gambling and related activities


Meaning of trade: exceptions and alternatives: contents
Table of contents for trade: exceptions & alternatives section of the Business Income Manual

You will see that the "old hat" references I posted earlier are still the primary guidance and legal precedent.

You can ferret around as much as you like but the fact remains that it is all tax free at the moment whether or not it is your sole source of income. The only caveat is whether it is associated with a related activity - such as selling trading tips, for example - when the spread betting may be deemed to be part of an overall business activity and thus taxable.

I am sorry Barjon - but according to my accountant and the guys he uses - who all worked at the HMRC in the past - the HMRC have the power to over ride all previous cases - and treat each new case on an individual basis

They win over 80% of the time - so previous case law as no guarantee it will work again as each case will have slightly different circumstances - including now if you are spread betting and using robots - rather than manual entries.

It is so complex - please ignore anything more than 1 year old .

I would be delighted if I could "reclaim " my penalties etc I suffered etc but the odds on thet happening would be over 100 to 1

Can I repeat - forget previous case laws

The HMRC have powers that allow them to treat everyone and every case on a "ad hoc" basis.

That could mean you have 2 identical traders both professional and full time - with no other employment - both spread betting - both profitable - and one would end up paying tax and even penalties - and the other one would be allowed to maintain his winnings free of tax

Please - don't just believe me - believe the proper experts - Tax guys at the top accountancy firms - ie in my case KPMG and also specialist employment barristers from st Phillips Law chambers in Birmingham.

Now you can keep saying I am wrong as much as you like - but it's not black and white - and I will be providing information to confirm this.

I do have some now from 2 other accountancy firms and a Employment lawyer confirming how the HMRC actually bend the rules to suit them - using their special powers I have already mentioned - but did not want to show them yet - would prefer to wait to hear more from the HMRC technical department - but get the feeling they might not return my latest call

Regards


F

 

[timsk]

. . . I would be delighted if I could "reclaim " my penalties etc I suffered etc but the odds on thet happening would be over 100 to 1. . .

FoMo - it sounds to me as if you need to take HMRC to the small claims court for falsely taking monies from you without any legal precedent. I've done that 3 times in the past and have won every time - although the cases had nothing to with tax. Even so, I'll happily be your legal advisor in return for a percentage of any monies reclaimed!

 

[barjon]

I am sorry Barjon - but according to my accountant and the guys he uses - who all worked at the HMRC in the past - the HMRC have the power to over ride all previous cases - and treat each new case on an individual basis

They win over 80% of the time - so previous case law as no guarantee it will work again as each case will have slightly different circumstances - including now if you are spread betting and using robots - rather than manual entries.

It is so complex - please ignore anything more than 1 year old .

I would be delighted if I could "reclaim " my penalties etc I suffered etc but the odds on thet happening would be over 100 to 1

Can I repeat - forget previous case laws

The HMRC have powers that allow them to treat everyone and every case on a "ad hoc" basis.

That could mean you have 2 identical traders both professional and full time - with no other employment - both spread betting - both profitable - and one would end up paying tax and even penalties - and the other one would be allowed to maintain his winnings free of tax

Please - don't just believe me - believe the proper experts - Tax guys at the top accountancy firms - ie in my case KPMG and also specialist employment barristers from st Phillips Law chambers in Birmingham.

Now you can keep saying I am wrong as much as you like - but it's not black and white - and I will be providing information to confirm this.

I do have some now from 2 other accountancy firms and a Employment lawyer confirming how the HMRC actually bend the rules to suit them - using their special powers I have already mentioned - but did not want to show them yet - would prefer to wait to hear more from the HMRC technical department - but get the feeling they might not return my latest call

Regards


F

For Goodness sake, FXMO, this isn't what I'm saying, it's what HMRC themselves are saying. If you really think they are in the business of issuing guidance only to play ducks and drakes with it when they choose, thereby leaving it worthless, then you really do live in cloud cuckoo land.

 

[morgan_edge]

lol

 

[Forexmospherian]

For Goodness sake, FXMO, this isn't what I'm saying, it's what HMRC themselves are saying. If you really think they are in the business of issuing guidance only to play ducks and drakes with it when they choose, thereby leaving it worthless, then you really do live in cloud cuckoo land.

Your are not following what I am saying Jon

This is not ME living in cloud cuckoo land - this is fact and as quoted from an my accountants own employer - who is ex HMRC -

The BIMs that the HMRC puts out is actually bias because they don't actually display the other cases that could work against them. The definitions of "trade", "investment" and "gambling" is not the definitions a normal layman would define them and this is why it is sneaky of the HMRC to continually tax them. This is not a simple black and white issue but with the right line of argument, majority of day traders depending on how they trade would get tax free. This is because HMRC believes if they don't do this, they will have to provide relief on losses which is not what they want to do. -


Forget what you see on the HMRC website -

If you honestly think KPMG and other top 3 accountancy group Tax experts dont know what they are on about - might you be living in cloud cuckoo land ?

Tell me Jon - what experience have you had personally with the HMRC ??

If you have gone through a proper investigation yourself - then you would not be just thinking all this is clean and "black and white"

Start thinking - why do the spread betting companies now - ie in the last 2 years start advising their clients to get individual advise from the HMRC or a tax accountant if it was anything like you think it is - ie 100% black or white??

Also TIm- the HMRC have already fell foul of the trading standards offices - simply because of what they have been able to get away with at certain District Offices.

Please just wait until I have more confirmed information to show you.

The main purpose of the HMRC is to obtain taxation from citizens via various methods - the main one in the form of income tax on the persons main form of income or earnings

Spread betters who are already being taxed separately - have no problem in most cases - their winnings are Tax Free

Spreadbetters who's main earnings and time spent on only trading - are looked as having a business and therefore their spread betting profits are NOT Tax Free.

The HMRC now in the last 12 months have new ways around the cases won prior to 2013 / 2014, They have kept them quiet and although they will not win in 100% of investigations - a success rate so far of over 80% is surely a major concern for all full time spread betters not paying any form of income tax via other revenue stream

I am sure all of this will come out and surface during this next 12 months.

If you think I and my sources are totally wrong and living in "cloud cuckoo land" - please confirm again so we have it prior to when everything is eventually disclosed by myself

Looking forward to your response

Regards


F

 

[barjon]

.................Tell me Jon - what experience have you had personally with the HMRC ??.............

As it happens I used to run quite a sizeable chunk of it.

 

[malaguti]

As it happens I used to run quite a sizeable chunk of it.

And I was a consultant there for a while back, amazing place to work (this is in Russell Square when they were lovingly known as the Inland Revenue)..that aside
"forget case law" is quite simply utter bollox
and as for their "special powers" i could almost be watching a movie, one starring Ben Stiller; Walter something or other

ho hum

 

[Forexmospherian]

FoMo - it sounds to me as if you need to take HMRC to the small claims court for falsely taking monies from you without any legal precedent. I've done that 3 times in the past and have won every time - although the cases had nothing to with tax. Even so, I'll happily be your legal advisor in return for a percentage of any monies reclaimed!

You might not know this TIm - the HMRC are already in a lot of trouble for not informing many Tax Payers that they have made over payments in previous years and with many of the cases already closed and gone over 6 years - then tax payers have no chance of any claim

HMRC are not like Banks or even other businesses in most cases they are above the Law and it many wealthy individuals have been reluctant to take their cases further - as concerned with regards to future investigations etc etc.

HMRC have had some ex city traders and bigger players get away with them winning and keeping their profits tax free on spread betting over the last 5 years . In fact several cases lasted over 18 and 22 months before it was agreed and cases were settled without going to court -- as it would not have been in the HMRC's interest for all this to come out.

But meanwhile - others have suffered - including little old me ;-)

Maybe you can help me sue KPMG and St Philips Laws chambers - lol

Regards

F

That's why they have had to now get tough ( also part of the Governments own initiative on tax evasion and avoidance ) to start clawing back.

 

[Forexmospherian]

As it happens I used to run quite a sizeable chunk of it.

What at District level and within last 10 years ???

If so - you are either covering or not mentioning their "black arts " ;-))

Regards


F

 

[Forexmospherian]

Its amazing how many "tax experts" we have on T2W

Shame Random 12345 is not still here to laugh at you - because on this matter he would be agreeing with me - He even admitted he declared his own spread betting profits due to other conflicts of interest etc

Looking forward to the T2W tax experts getting their own hard evidence straight from the HMRC's own technical department and in writing as of now - not as of 3 or 5+ years ago.

Anyway - why are you worried - Surely you have other jobs - and so no worry - its tax free - or you use proper brokers and pay your tax ?

Regards

F