Anyone shorting the Dow Jones? pt 2

Messing around with the stop was the biggest cause of me losing money, I never move to breakeven anymore. Psychologically a breakeven stop felt good but ended up costing me a lot of winning trades. We are all different though and you need to test and find what works for you.

I guess you are either in a loss now or out at breakeven?
 
I am out at my stop level. Thinking about selling again but not sure.

You are right. I just think having adequate capital to play with so that your stop is enough to cope with at least the 52week high is prudent.

Maybe then establishing a level where with time that point has not been breached is a good idea.
 
Look at it this way - If you had gone long instead of short you would have been stopped out for -200 points. You went short, had 200 points profit but instead got out for absolutely nothing. How are you ever going to make money when you're either being stopped out at a full loss or being taken out for breakeven? This was one of the biggest things I struggled with.

Where was your target?
 
ONLY short below certain EMAs
and price is not under yet

please study the charts and experiment
spend a weekend - maybe a few wks

make strict plans and stick to them - otherwise its gamble trading and just a waste of time (and money)

also diversify, there are tons of trades a month so no need to be always wanting to short the Dow or FTSE
learn FX if you have nt already - and maybe Oil and Gold as they can all be traded nr the same
(just slight variations)

and Good luck
 
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Well today was pretty white knuckle for me... It could have very easily gone either way. The second I got the jobs statistics I lowered my stops but still took pretty substantial losses. Very surprised the report hit the consensus targets, I was in the group that thought it would follow the ADP employment report earlier this week.

I luckily made a snap decision to switch long just before trading opened, so at least I managed to regain a reasonable chunk of my losses. Hopefully next week we'll see the DOW and other indices (FTSE) regain some lost ground and return to profit.

Until October or December then, then we'll be back here all over again.
 
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ONLY short below certain EMAs
and price is not under yet

please study the charts and experiment
spend a weekend - maybe a few wks

make strict plans and stick to them - otherwise its gamble trading and just a waste of time (and money)

also diversify, there are tons of trades a month so no need to be always wanting to short the Dow or FTSE
learn FX if you have nt already - and maybe Oil and Gold as they can all be traded nr the same
(just slight variations)

and Good luck

Not sure I agree with the point about only shorting under certain EMAs. Technical analysis is useful for getting the best entry/exits as long as the underlying environment isn't changing. If the jobs report had come out worse than expected (which was fairly likely) or too much better it could have very easily caused an avalanche today and no amount of technical analysis would pick that up.

In times where there is a lot of volatility do you stick to mainly technical analysis or do you opt out until it calms down?

Definitely agree with everything else you're saying though.
 
just caught your post through email

i can promise you - the majority will NOT be able to consistently short the last few wks downtrend - i wont say exactly how or why as bots look at all posts - here on twitter and all over the place and are reported to somewhere...

but the safest and most consistent method is only to short under the EMAs as thats where the bigger falls have to occur

stick a bunch of equally spaced EMAs on the charts 1hr - Wkly charts and see when the bigger falls occur
im not saying use the 1hr but you will be able to see whats happening

the big falls have nt even started yet - when they do price will have to be below certain EMAs
and big money can be made shorting, and at least much easier than since the last bigger downtrend

excuse the bad grammer and spelling its been a long wk....
 
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Not sure I agree with the point about only shorting under certain EMAs. Technical analysis is useful for getting the best entry/exits as long as the underlying environment isn't changing. If the jobs report had come out worse than expected (which was fairly likely) or too much better it could have very easily caused an avalanche today and no amount of technical analysis would pick that up.

In times where there is a lot of volatility do you stick to mainly technical analysis or do you opt out until it calms down?

Definitely agree with everything else you're saying though.

apologies i did nt really answer your question properly

i use technical analysis - but not always so conventional - and unfortunately cant really say exactly how (as im alittle paranoid after putting in so much time the analysis then somehow then fails)

but i have studied the Dow and any instrument i trade in great length
overall i use technical indicators - many of them, some might say to many - but only ones proved useful and if not useful they are dumped
and alittle P.A, but mostly for P.A its S/R that really counts the most

i tired the P.A thing properly for a yr, some few yrs ago and proved overall to be useless - i had some great trades, especailly in the summer months and then when the big falls came my long strategy was exposed and took some big losses - mostly on Oil

so changed my strategy and system in order to find the trends much quicker
esp the end of trends - where often great support then just fails

we don't really want opt out of too much as volatility is where all the good trades are - although standing aside sometimes is beneficial
which is why i strongly advocate studying the charts and only picking the best trades and when all the conditions are met
as they are met much more often than you would think, so biding our time really makes no difference and gives us much more time to plan the trades and see them coming

and as long as moneys not too tight there's plenty of time to trade in the future as history constantly repeats - and then take the time to learn how to trade the market properly

my best advice is to study the Daily / Wkly and 4hr charts and then think outside the box - because if everyone is doing the same, invariably it wont work consistently

as for shorting the Dow - luckily i managed to short nr the last top after a sell signal - but only to certain support
although did loose abit trying to quess the top a few wks before
so now wont be shorting until below the EMAs
 
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Thanks for the response, I'll give what you have said some thought.

A lot of my trading is speculative so naturally I'm exposed to quite a lot of risk. I do use a bit of technical analysis for entry but probably do need to ramp it up a bit more.

Do you have any recommendations for some reading materials etc.?
 
SamIP

apologies for not replying earlier - but have been run off my feet and not posting much on forums lately

the best advise i can give (again) is to build your own systems
and round up and test as many indicators as possible, for the most accurate buy / sell signals for the main trends - there are quite a few pretty good indicators out there - especially for MT4
and best if they compliment each other, and are from different groups

there are a few books possibly worth a read - but not sure they really have the real answers and could take nearly a life time to read some of them
there are a couple of fairly heavy technical analysis books that are recommended
although can't remember the names off hand, ill see if i can find them on my HD sometime

and then the general ones mentioned around most boards - come into my trading room etc
but strategy testing in MT4 and a few other similar platforms is possibly the quickest way to test and find a good system

thought id post today anyway as my system has finally give the bear signal for the continued falls
and price has just crossed under the EMAs

some are saying a 10% correction - so should possibly be 1000pips on offer (if history repeats itself)
and is not as though the FED did n't really want a selloff

but be careful as price is already at very strong Daily support - so can bounce reasonably well sometimes, before the next legs down

lets hope the bugger keeps going down this time
 
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Been a week and no reply, I'll take that as a no.

I predict Dow 30000, I'll be back in a few years to boast about how I was right!
 
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