50% tax

[Technically Fundamental]

I don't see why everyone is moaning about tax. You pay tax to live in a country with stupid laws that favour the rich, can join an illegal war with no repercussion from the int'l community, rapes third world raw produce for benefit. Plus you get to say you're British which supposedly makes you better than anyone else anywhere... what more do you want?

Why not go to Zimbabwe and start trading through their exchange with their currency.

Now NI I can understand but that is another story for another day...

 

[arabianights]

Nonsense, I live in a country because I'm born there and then some jumped up twat in a suit thinks I owe them money!

 

[neil]

elsewhere.....

Nonsense, I live in a country because I'm born there and then some jumped up twat in a suit thinks I owe them money!

And Dante will not like having to pay 50% tax:whistling

 

[Gumping]

As Phil mentioned earlier....Denmark is worse.

I lived there a few years back and was on a favourable tax rate. I took home 50% more than what the Danes were taking home. But then again I worked at least 50% more hours

Their basic rate was 40%. NI or equivalent was about 9%, then the next bracket was 60%. My colleagues were all on about 26K and were paying a fair chunk of that at 60% tax - for an overall 69% tax rate. And from what they told me it carried on like that so higher earners payed even more. The net effect was that everyone took home fairly similar amounts of money regardless of what they earnt.

Free healthcare, free uni (With free accomodation and grants on top), free childcare, free libraries (including CD's, DVD's - it was all free), cheap public transport (that works!)..... very high unemployment but no worse off for being unemployed. Some of my former colleagues have still not found work in the 5 years since I was there. Although being as they aren't much better off by actually working it's very difficult to motivate your staff by making them do anything. So my boss recruited foreigners. That seemed to be the only way to get things done in that country....

 

[wasp]

Srsly though, what is the problem? Its just spin for votes as no one with the brains to earn this much, will pay even a third of that, and if you do, well.... a fool and his money....

 

[chump]

Can I just correct this, the majority of "wealth" is not earned or created by an individual it has arrived through asset inflation as a direct result of inflation in a given economy which has (as its bi-product) the 'advantage' of eroding relative debt.

I'd agree that IT needs re-modelling but the notion that a, for example, four bed detached in the SE rising from 5K to 1.5mil over a 30 year period has been "worked for" is nonsense.

Quite agree.
Basically ,we buy votes promising a degree of 'wealth' either in money or services beyond what we can actually afford.We have done this generation upon generation since at least post WW2 .To fulfill the illusion of meeting those promises we apply an inflationary approach to monetary policy because if we did not we would have absolutely no way of mitigating our future failure of being able to meet those financial promises. A by product of that as been that the value of bricks and mortar tended in the longrun to reflect the inflationary policy we applied.That is the price rose albeit how much varied considerably across the longrun cycles. It didn't have to of course ,but unless you radically alter the supply side criteria for housing to meet and even exceed demand then it always will rise with inflation. Ergo , the comment about property wealth and inheritance tax and unearned wealth is quite correct. The whole damn concept is built upon an illusion surrounding future revenues and matching them to prior incurred financial obligations.

 

[Hotch]

As Phil mentioned earlier....Denmark is worse.

I lived there a few years back and was on a favourable tax rate. I took home 50% more than what the Danes were taking home. But then again I worked at least 50% more hours

Their basic rate was 40%. NI or equivalent was about 9%, then the next bracket was 60%. My colleagues were all on about 26K and were paying a fair chunk of that at 60% tax - for an overall 69% tax rate. And from what they told me it carried on like that so higher earners payed even more. The net effect was that everyone took home fairly similar amounts of money regardless of what they earnt.

Free healthcare, free uni (With free accomodation and grants on top), free childcare, free libraries (including CD's, DVD's - it was all free), cheap public transport (that works!)..... very high unemployment but no worse off for being unemployed. Some of my former colleagues have still not found work in the 5 years since I was there. Although being as they aren't much better off by actually working it's very difficult to motivate your staff by making them do anything. So my boss recruited foreigners. That seemed to be the only way to get things done in that country....

Denmark has a higher tax rate, but, you know, they get decent healthcare etc.also everyone there is happy (last time I looked). Maybe it's just the people there.

I probably wouldn't mind paying more so much if it wasn't wasted so much.

 

[Technically Fundamental]

alter the supply side criteria for housing to meet and even exceed demand then it always will rise with inflation

ageing population, better standard of living, "social status" associated with owning own home, Kevin Mcleod, Home DIY shows, Relocaton Relocation and other various programmes showing people making thousands (before stamp, legal/ professional bills and capital gains tax of course)

Demand is here to stay as long as there are jobs... :whistling

 

[Technically Fundamental]

Denmark has a higher tax rate, but, you know, they get decent healthcare etc.also everyone there is happy (last time I looked). Maybe it's just the people there.

I probably wouldn't mind paying more so much if it wasn't wasted so much.

British people like moaning mate. Thats a fact.

Another fact is all public services are now tied up with too much red tape. Police/gestappo, hospitals, right down to complaining to you're local authority. Ridiculous amount of bureaucracy involved. Stupid admin. My guesstimate is that 80-odd % off all people in government are inept.

 

[arabianights]

Srsly though, what is the problem? Its just spin for votes as no one with the brains to earn this much, will pay even a third of that, and if you do, well.... a fool and his money....

It's easy enough for gentlemen like yourself and I good sir because we have a lot of flexibility, but the majority of people in this country are on PAYE and they're going to be stuffed if their earnings are up there...

Mind you probably a lot of them are management consultants, for whom I propose a 200% tax.

 

[chump]

ageing population, better standard of living, "social status" associated with owning own home, Kevin Mcleod, Home DIY shows, Relocaton Relocation and other various programmes showing people making thousands (before stamp, legal/ professional bills and capital gains tax of course)

Demand is here to stay as long as there are jobs... :whistling

Wrong ,this as never been about demand . It's always been about supply and before you argue with me until 2007 I have been buying and selling property for about 30+ yrs. So ,you go away and find the data that tells me I am wrong. It isn't there. Every cycle we get this argument and every cycle we get the same crap from polis' about what they will do to address the property market needs. Translating that from political spin to actual action has simply never happened because the interest groups have always been too strong. Let's see if that has changed ,but don't hold your breath waiting for it.


Wasp,
you'll get a tax rebate won't you ..low income earner

 

[Black Swan]

It's easy enough for gentlemen like yourself and I good sir because we have a lot of flexibility, but the majority of people in this country are on PAYE and they're going to be stuffed if their earnings are up there...

Mind you probably a lot of them are management consultants, for whom I propose a 200% tax.

As soon as Darling announced it yesterday I knew the meeja types were going to go postal. Listening to/watching BBC employees on that upper bracket going over and over the details yesterday and this morning has been one of the more 'enjoyable' aspects of the tax rise.

Similarly high up journos in the main titles have done him over in the press this morning, is the rise on an individual earning 151K approx 6K take home? That's one kids school fees in a poor-average independent school for a year. Unlucky...

 

[Technically Fundamental]

Wrong ,this as never been about demand . It's always been about supply and before you argue with me until 2007 I have been buying and selling property for about 30+ yrs. So ,you go away and find the data that tells me I am wrong. It isn't there. Every cycle we get this argument and every cycle we get the same crap from polis' about what they will do to address the property market needs. Translating that from political spin to actual action has simply never happened because the interest groups have always been too strong. Let's see if that has changed ,but don't hold your breath waiting for it.


Wasp,
you'll get a tax rebate won't you ..low income earner

You're saying this property boom wasnt about demand? I don't care how long you've been selling properties mate you're off you're rocker. It's about people trying to turn a quick pound and estate agents over-valuing properties, and banks fuelled it by giving 100+ mortgages to people who wouldnt have been o the property ladder 15 years ago.

 

[Black Swan]

Wrong ,this as never been about demand . It's always been about supply and before you argue with me until 2007 I have been buying and selling property for about 30+ yrs. So ,you go away and find the data that tells me I am wrong. It isn't there. Every cycle we get this argument and every cycle we get the same crap from polis' about what they will do to address the property market needs. Translating that from political spin to actual action has simply never happened because the interest groups have always been too strong. Let's see if that has changed ,but don't hold your breath waiting for it.


Wasp,
you'll get a tax rebate won't you ..low income earner

I'd echo this, there are 850,000 empty homes which can be occupied with little or no upgrades, currently Rightmove have approx 1mil listings for sale and a similar amount for rental. The shortage argument is a vested interest myth.

Having said that a mass home building programme, were recently unemployed or about to be unemployed folk could take a hands on approach to literary building their own way out of the recession/depression wouldn't be a bad call, could ensure that house price inflation doesn't occur for another thirty years...

 

[Technically Fundamental]

there are 850,000 empty homes which can be occupied with little or no upgrades, currently Rightmove have approx 1mil listings for sale

and how many were built by redrow, bellway etc in the last 5 years? the companies who almost went t*ts up less than a year ago...

buying new doesnt appeal to most people because there is no way to add value.

 

[Black Swan]

You're saying this property boom wasnt about demand? I don't care how long you've been selling properties mate you're off you're rocker. It's about people trying to turn a quick pound and estate agents over-valuing properties, and banks fuelled it by giving 100+ mortgages to people who wouldnt have been o the property ladder 15 years ago.

Good God Aaron, this boom in house prices was caused by the ready availability of loose and cheap credit. The artificial demand (underpinned by emotional greed and or the irrational fears of 'missing out') came as a symptom not the cause.

 

[chump]

You're saying this property boom wasnt about demand? I don't care how long you've been selling properties mate you're off you're rocker. It's about people trying to turn a quick pound and estate agents over-valuing properties, and banks fuelled it by giving 100+ mortgages to people who wouldnt have been o the property ladder 15 years ago.

Are you intentionally dense ,or were you born that way !?

Christ, the boom you berk was nothing more than decades of undersupply teamed up with a decade and a half of loose monetary policy ..period ..Had supply not been so scarce the ability of credit fuelled demand to move price with such ease would have been much more moderate. For gods sake go away and learn about the market before you insist on telling us about your opinion. Why do you think in % terms the effect on price across different countries was so variable ? The monetary policy was fairly consistent .What was not consistent was the supply side.Dear me, go to the back of the class.

 

[Technically Fundamental]

Good God Aaron, this boom in house prices was caused by the ready availability of loose and cheap credit

Not that big a problem here. In America maybe.
I've already been through why it's in the interests of the government to have high house prices in another thread... problem is it didnt sustain itself for as log as they thought it would.

The artificial demand (underpinned by emotional greed and or the irrational fears of 'missing out') came as a symptom not the cause.

Main culprit in my opinion.

 

[Technically Fundamental]

Are you intentionally dense ,or were you born that way !?

Christ, the boom you berk was nothing more than decades of undersupply teamed up with a decade and a half of loose monetary policy ..period ..Had supply not been so scarce the ability of credit fuelled demand to move price with such ease would have been much more moderate. For gods sake go away and learn about the market before you insist on telling us about your opinion. Why do you think in % terms the effect on price across different countries was so variable ? The monetary policy was fairly consistent .What was not consistent was the supply side.Dear me, go to the back of the class.

Undersupply? What about right to buy you mong? Why dont you have a look at average house price against average salary going back 20 years.

House prices have been inflated way above market value because banks allowed cheap credit to sell on debt securities. Have you heard of the credit crunch? It's this big thing that the banks caused.

I don't need you to teach me anthing mate. The people who tell me about the housing market have net portfolios worth millions. I think they know what they're talking about.

Stop reading the telegraph.

 

[chump]

Undersupply? What about right to buy you mong? Why dont you have a look at average house price against average salary going back 20 years.

House prices have been inflated way above market value because banks allowed cheap credit to sell on debt securities. Have you heard of the credit crunch? It's this big thing that the banks caused.

I don't need you to teach me anthing mate. The people who tell me about the housing market have net portfolios worth millions. I think they know what they're talking about.

Stop reading the telegraph.

"The people who tell me about the housing market have net portfolios worth millions."

I wasn't actually inviting a discussion. I was telling you what has driven the market for the last half a century and my net portfolio is nearly zero so obviously i don't know what I am talking about. BUT ,wait ,is that because my debt is zero and the profits are already out ?
You do need teaching ,but you won't have it because you think you already know what it's all about don't you ?.and i dare say so do your chumps with their net portfolios ..LOL