Sick 'em onto the army!

really? what do you think is too Gestapo?

Well, I'm a big believer in the importance of principles and the danger of the slippery slope. Hence I oppose the move to longer periods of detention without charge, the removal of the automatic right to trial by jury, the imposition of identity cards etc, although I can perfectly well understand why people are in favour of such things.

So the things I would mainly consider dangerous that you suggest are:

Tougher rules for parents whose children are tearaways. (I'd consider this unfair and unworkable in the current state of the nation).

Greater powers to seize and hold or destroy proceeds of crime - even suspected in the case of persistent offenders or those with track records. I can see this being a very slippery slope, an attack on the concept of private property, and also on the principle of the presumption of innocence.

More investment in government subsidised day care for working parents. I think the increasing role of the state as a surrogate parent is a very worrying development and an assault on the concept of the family.

Compulsory education until 18. This I think would just make things worse, and would extend the disruption and ruination of the education of many children past the age of 16, which is often largely due to the compulsory attendance of pupils who really shouldn't be there. I'd actually advocate lowering the school leaving age if anything.

Like I say though, I can understand where you're coming from with your proposals.
 
Prison and the army is all short term stuff. This violent attitude is something that Britishers have every time they have a celebration about something. An example is the behaviour of football fans. There is a trouble making element about them that is a bit frightening. Overweight , painted faces, dressed in a singlet, noisy and drunk. These are, probably, the parents or elder relatives of these characters in the riots.

Sitges and these seaside towns know them only too well.
 
Most people won't believe me when I say these hooligans are challenging the state as we know it
.
Nobody knows what to do with them. The do-gooders and liberal bleeding heart politicians consistantly are unable to make the tough decisions so it will likey get worse.

I was listening to a dotty old Bishop on the radio - his remedy was to blame ourselves and kneel in prayer ! - well really !!
 
I was listening to a dotty old Bishop on the radio - his remedy was to blame ourselves and kneel in prayer ! - well really !!

:LOL:

well at least it gives them a break from abusing kids whilst they are at prayer.
 
I am looking at the Parliamentary front benches recalled to debate the riots.

Nice suntans !!
 
Most people won't believe me when I say these hooligans are challenging the state as we know it
.
Nobody knows what to do with them. The do-gooders and liberal bleeding heart politicians consistantly are unable to make the tough decisions so it will likey get worse.

I was listening to a dotty old Bishop on the radio - his remedy was to blame ourselves and kneel in prayer ! - well really !!


1. Lockem up and punish them - this is costly - £16K p/a per offender and one needs to build more prisons... How long do you lock them up for? Outcome pretty certain. They come out worse than before... Long term costs outweigh short term removal from socieity.

2. Rehabilitation - this is costly too - but not as much as locking them up. Outcome uncertain but long term benefits outweigh short term costs.


Placing them in the army is a good start as well as other suggestions. Sometimes tough love and a good kicking is all they need to knock some sense into them.

- Like to add bring back corporal punishment at schools.
 
Well, I'm a big believer in the importance of principles and the danger of the slippery slope. Hence I oppose the move to longer periods of detention without charge, the removal of the automatic right to trial by jury, the imposition of identity cards etc, although I can perfectly well understand why people are in favour of such things.

So the things I would mainly consider dangerous that you suggest are:

Tougher rules for parents whose children are tearaways. (I'd consider this unfair and unworkable in the current state of the nation).
I know it's unfair (my mum tried with me and I was a 'orrible f*cker lol) but sacrifices have to be made to sweep up after the junkie/alcoholic parents who care more about themselves than their children.
Greater powers to seize and hold or destroy proceeds of crime - even suspected in the case of persistent offenders or those with track records. I can see this being a very slippery slope, an attack on the concept of private property, and also on the principle of the presumption of innocence.
Again, agreed and maybe a bit too sweeping but I also propose that career criminals and persistent offenders should be stripped of most legislative civic benefits so it wouldn't be an issue that affected wider society.
More investment in government subsidised day care for working parents. I think the increasing role of the state as a surrogate parent is a very worrying development and an assault on the concept of the family.
Doesn't have to be the state directly it could be through incentives and grants to any number of community or commercial enterprises. My philosophy is that there's always a taker as long as there is +ve NPV

Compulsory education until 18. This I think would just make things worse, and would extend the disruption and ruination of the education of many children past the age of 16, which is often largely due to the compulsory attendance of pupils who really shouldn't be there. I'd actually advocate lowering the school leaving age if anything.
I'd have to overhaul the education system and syllabus delivery too. Why did the school down the road teach different things to my school? Why was I not allowed to sit higher level papers for some of my subjects at GCSE level? F*cking box ticking and teachers/governers/committee members afraid to risk their own skin is the reason that schools are sh*t. Example, I was speaking to my brother the other week and talking to him about negative skewness in a log-normal distribution P chart (of my trading results lol!) and he didn't know what I was talking about. He's studying maths and further maths at A level at a local community college? WTF is that about? How can a maths syllabus change so much in 8 years?
As for the little horrible little f*ckers I'd have them out of the main classrooms and into places that are more tailed to their needs. I've seen it work sometimes at my school and any success rate at all with kids like those is an unforeseen win. the rest I'm afraid would have to be another set of victims of the initial culling unless they were willing to get their act together.

I reckon my school and local area (and other like it that I know) would be better off in 25 years given the above measures.
 
I'm surprised that Dashriprock isn't on here holding up his trophies - but we may not wait in vain ?
 
- Like to add bring back corporal punishment at schools.

Now you are talking sense At

Headmaster: Stand by the wall and drop your trousers
Boy: Can I keep my pants on sir ?
Headmaster: Of course not boy
Boy: Sorry Sirrrrrrrrrrrr
Headmaster: Legs apart boy
Boy: Yessssirrrrrr
Headmaster: ooooooooooooooooooh aaaaaaaaah

:LOL:
 
1. Lockem up and punish them - this is costly - £16K p/a per offender and one needs to build more prisons... How long do you lock them up for? Outcome pretty certain. They come out worse than before... Long term costs outweigh short term removal from socieity.

2. Rehabilitation - this is costly too - but not as much as locking them up. Outcome uncertain but long term benefits outweigh short term costs.


Placing them in the army is a good start as well as other suggestions. Sometimes tough love and a good kicking is all they need to knock some sense into them.

- Like to add bring back corporal punishment at schools.

It won't work, you mark my words.

The army does not want this problem and the government will electioneer by saying that they have decided to increase the army by x recruits.

The old Southern Rednecks had a good idea. Chain gangs. That way they can't run away and can be put to work repairing damage or digging roads. Let them be seen by the public. In fact, the more I think of it, the more I like it. :)
 
It won't work, you mark my words.

The army does not want this problem and the government will electioneer by saying that they have decided to increase the army by x recruits.

The old Southern Rednecks had a good idea. Chain gangs. That way they can't run away and can be put to work repairing damage or digging roads. Let them be seen by the public. In fact, the more I think of it, the more I like it. :)


But as been commented before these youngsters have no system no discipline no boundaries.

Objective is not to make them fighting fit. Simply add discipline and routine into there lives starting by some personal respect. Smart uniform, buttons done up, polished shoes and a bit of drill would go a long way. Bonding with fellow soldiers should help too.

They may not be fit for army but it will help. As it stands they have little or no structure in their miserable lives - no one to look up to and no one to administer that regimental discipline.


As you have rightly pointed out there is something about the pscyhie of our youngsters that are different to those on the continent. It may well be neglect and rejection. In the army even when one is receiving a bollocking you know someone out there is trying to make you better.

Worth a shot. (y)
 
Not read all this thread but from my experience the Army provides its fair share of self aware, unscrupulous, irritatingly blunt, pseudo racist, chauvanistic characters. With self discipline when required and the clear ability to formulate a plan and follow it some of them can turn into quite successful traders.
PS they know how to enjoy their money as well.
 
How about parachuting the feral lot into Afghanistan after declaring it to be a free fire zone.
Armies could practice their battle tactics with live ammo. Big game hunters could bag a few.
Could include:-
perverts
professional criminals
dole scroungers

Problem solved.

Except the "do-gooders" would insist they have a comfy bed and en suite bathrooms, recreation, health and safety standards in jug etc

:)
 
How about parachuting the feral lot into Afghanistan after declaring it to be a free fire zone.
Armies could practice their battle tactics with live ammo. Big game hunters could bag a few.
Could include:-
perverts
professional criminals
dole scroungers

Problem solved.

Except the "do-gooders" would insist they have a comfy bed and en suite bathrooms, recreation, health and safety standards in jug etc

:)

And don't forget to include the bankers and politicians who looted the country rotten.
 
Not enough people give a toss anymore and the number that do is probably dwindling.

It took 900 years to get the UK up and running. It won't take long to ruin it.

Anarchy for all I suppose

Not much come-back on useless politicians/bankers etc - could throw them in the Tower but
 
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