is 100% return each year realistic?

[4xpipcounter]

Shanghai, you're making the wrong comparison in using Warren Buffet. He has billions in his account. His margining is micrscopic. He has trades go against him 500 pips and more, but he doesn't care. The dollar backup is so small even at that large of a negative pip count. When it does turn in his favor, he pulls out at 100--200-pips gain and makes millions. He doesn't care about % of gains. 20% per year is puny. He jusy has more money than we have.
The answer is "yes". Anyone that is a decent trader should be bale to make 20% per month. I doubt no one on this whole site will make 5 times the money he makes in one year.
I use 10% margining. 20% gains is only 200 pips. You're telling people they can't make 200 pips in one year? C'mon!!
Let me be perfectly blunt. There are two major differences between me and Warren Buffet. In oder to describe our net worth, you just have to add a few more zeros on his. As far as trading is concerned, I'm much better than he is. He makes a ton more money trading. But at 20% per year? Regardless, if you believe it or not, I do better than that most weeks.
There are 2 big reasons for that. He uses <> .2% (That is largely conjecture, along with an educated guess.) margining. I use 10%. That is 50 times as much. So, on a Percentage basis, each pip is worth 50 times as much as his. The other reason is I sit in front of the charts all day. This is my only job. He just throws large sums of money at the market. I will get into more trades than him. I'm still a student of the markets, even though this is all I do. He uses his mad money (A few billion.) to trade with.
As an investor, he'll whip us all. As a trader, most good ones will whip him.
Let me also add something to Rossini's comment. If all you are doing is breaking even, you need to stay out of the markets, and demo trade. There is no need to risk your money and only break even. Breaking even leaves no margin of error.

If you could consistently make 100% a year with relatively small drawdowns you will literally be offered tens of millions of pounds to manage if not more in a short time. Warren Buffet makes in the order of 20% per year historically. Do you imagine that you can do five times as well as him on a regular basis?

As a beginner you should be looking to break even in your first year. That will put you well ahead of the majorty of traders. As other have said, look to manage your risk first.

 

[Shanghai]

The answer is "yes". Anyone that is a decent trader should be bale to make 20% per month.

So effectively you are saying that a decent trader should be able to return something above 100-120% a year,year after year with limited drawdowns. If you are doing that on a market with high liquidity and your strategy is scaleable then I stand by my point that there is no limit to the money you will be offered to trade. Send me a pm and I will put you in touch with financiers that would love to work with you, (seriously I will). However you show me a fund run by a trader rather than an investor that returns consistently over 100% year on year. People talk on this site like these sort of returns are commonplace because they want to believe that they are commonplace as they want part of the dream. And yes I know that a mere x% a week will give you 100% a year and to make x% is so easy, but doing it consistently every week with a smooth equity curve is much harder than most realise.

Myself, I return between 30-60% each year on a fairly large account. If I was looking for higher returns than that the risks I would have to take are too great and at some point I would take a big hit.

 

[leonarda]

Shanghai, you're making the wrong comparison in using Warren Buffet. He has billions in his account. His margining is micrscopic. He has trades go against him 500 pips and more, but he doesn't care. The dollar backup is so small even at that large of a negative pip count. When it does turn in his favor, he pulls out at 100--200-pips gain and makes millions. He doesn't care about % of gains. 20% per year is puny. He jusy has more money than we have.
The answer is "yes". Anyone that is a decent trader should be bale to make 20% per month. I doubt no one on this whole site will make 5 times the money he makes in one year.
I use 10% margining. 20% gains is only 200 pips. You're telling people they can't make 200 pips in one year? C'mon!!
Let me be perfectly blunt. There are two major differences between me and Warren Buffet. In oder to describe our net worth, you just have to add a few more zeros on his. As far as trading is concerned, I'm much better than he is. He makes a ton more money trading. But at 20% per year? Regardless, if you believe it or not, I do better than that most weeks.
There are 2 big reasons for that. He uses <> .2% (That is largely conjecture, along with an educated guess.) margining. I use 10%. That is 50 times as much. So, on a Percentage basis, each pip is worth 50 times as much as his. The other reason is I sit in front of the charts all day. This is my only job. He just throws large sums of money at the market. I will get into more trades than him. I'm still a student of the markets, even though this is all I do. He uses his mad money (A few billion.) to trade with.
As an investor, he'll whip us all. As a trader, most good ones will whip him.
Let me also add something to Rossini's comment. If all you are doing is breaking even, you need to stay out of the markets, and demo trade. There is no need to risk your money and only break even. Breaking even leaves no margin of error.

exactly... 4xpip you seem to know your stuff!

 

[4xpipcounter]

Shanghai, I know it sounds like a lot of useless rhetoric when I say that. I've had one losing week in 3 years. No losing months in 3 years. Triple-digit pips almost every week. I do not consider that to be a big deal
Having said that, I have an insane methodology, but it is still extremely effective for me, and it is backed up, as I put my thread in my signature.
As far as coming in contact with financiers and trading for them, I sincerely appreciate the offer. I have no desire to trade for others, because I don't like the stress level, and I got it made in just trading for Me. I got a good life. I don't need to trade for others, which in part, is why I don't want to trade for others.
BTW, you seem to be doing real well in your trading, and so I did not want my initial post, as per our dialogue, to look like I was trying to show you up. But, I did tell you like it is. Triple-digit pips per week happens almost every week for me. At 10% margining, which I do consistently, means 10% per week.

So effectively you are saying that a decent trader should be able to return something above 100-120% a year,year after year with limited drawdowns. If you are doing that on a market with high liquidity and your strategy is scaleable then I stand by my point that there is no limit to the money you will be offered to trade. Send me a pm and I will put you in touch with financiers that would love to work with you, (seriously I will). However you show me a fund run by a trader rather than an investor that returns consistently over 100% year on year. People talk on this site like these sort of returns are commonplace because they want to believe that they are commonplace as they want part of the dream. And yes I know that a mere x% a week will give you 100% a year and to make x% is so easy, but doing it consistently every week with a smooth equity curve is much harder than most realise.

Myself, I return between 30-60% each year on a fairly large account. If I was looking for higher returns than that the risks I would have to take are too great and at some point I would take a big hit.

 

[Shanghai]

4xpipcounter, fair enough. You are obviously making decent money and so am I and that's what matters at the end of the day. We have different approaches to the markets of course. I tend to be more cautious. Agree about not wanting to trade money for others. I've turned down a recent offer to manage a fund as I don't want the hastle. Maybe in the future, who knows.

 

[4xpipcounter]

Thanks Leonarda. IMO, it's misleading to use Warren Buffet as an example for traders, because of the reasons I mentioned. We are not comapring apples for apples. It's 2 complete different ballgames.

exactly... 4xpip you seem to know your stuff!

 

[4xpipcounter]

Shanghai, one of the things I do is keep at least the the quantity in liquid assets that I have in my account. It is another comfort factor. If I do draw down far enough (I use no stops.), and I see a hot pair to trade, I can still do that because of what is backing me up. I hardly ever have had to do that, but it is always there.
I agree we do have diffeent approaches to the markets. The only thing that matters is that our individual methodologies breeds the success we are looking for.

4xpipcounter, fair enough. You are obviously making decent money and so am I and that's what matters at the end of the day. We have different approaches to the markets of course. I tend to be more cautious. Agree about not wanting to trade money for others. I've turned down a recent offer to manage a fund as I don't want the hastle. Maybe in the future, who knows.

 

[davidh1819]

If you could consistently make 100% a year with relatively small drawdowns you will literally be offered tens of millions of pounds to manage if not more in a short time. Warren Buffet makes in the order of 20% per year historically. Do you imagine that you can do five times as well as him on a regular basis?

As a beginner you should be looking to break even in your first year. That will put you well ahead of the majorty of traders. As other have said, look to manage your risk first.

another reason not to compare waren buffet is that he does not spread bet so he has no advantage of leverage and markets going down but i am a newbie so what i just said could be totaly wrong

 

[oildaytrader]

I don't recall anyone apart from spammers making these claims, 10% a day or a week yes, 100% no way.

Mechanical systems can easily make between 20 to 60 % a year,these mechanical systems have constraints and rules to work by,discretionary traders have no such constraints and limits.Discretionary traders have a far greater advantage called the brain, it can process current and future price direction information i.e news flow and expected market behaviour, information which is not available to mechanical systems.Good sharp discretionary traders easily make 100% a month using compounding .Great mercenary traders make 100% a month without compounding,and 15,000 % a year with compounding.

 

[gooseman]

Mechanical systems can easily make between 20 to 60 % a year,these mechanical systems have constraints and rules to work by,discretionary traders have no such constraints and limits.Discretionary traders have a far greater advantage called the brain, it can process current and future price direction information i.e news flow and expected market behaviour, information which is not available to mechanical systems.Good sharp discretionary traders easily make 100% a month using compounding .Great mercenary traders make 100% a month without compounding,and 15,000 % a year with compounding.

what is a discretionary trader and mercenary trader?

 

[meanreversion]

.Great mercenary traders make 100% a month without compounding,and 15,000 % a year with compounding.

Anyone who doesn't double their money every week is a pussy.

 

[oildaytrader]

what is a discretionary trader and mercenary trader?

A discretionary trader works on a set of rules and uses multiple systems and set ups,he will override all or any of the rules at his discretion based on information.

A mercenary trader has rules, he will over ride the rules and take on trades and risks which most traders would avoid. His set of rules,systems,methods and set ups are beyond the ordinary and discretionary traders.

 

[oildaytrader]

Anyone who doesn't double their money every week is a pussy.

This is an insult to all members and specifically the moderators.

 

[Jaydee]

Anyone who doesn't double their money every week is a pussy.

And those who do double their money every week get plenty of it!

 

[meanreversion]

A discretionary trader works on a set of rules and uses multiple systems and set ups,he will override all or any of the rules at his discretion based on information.

A mercenary trader has rules, he will over ride the rules and take on trades and risks which most traders would avoid. His set of rules,systems,methods and set ups are beyond the ordinary and discretionary traders.

You are officially a registered pillock. In fact, you are the founding member of the Official Pillock List.

 

[gooseman]

a discretionary trader works on a set of rules and uses multiple systems and set ups,he will override all or any of the rules at his discretion based on information.

A mercenary trader has rules, he will over ride the rules and take on trades and risks which most traders would avoid. His set of rules,systems,methods and set ups are beyond the ordinary and discretionary traders.

best post ever. Fact!






*shark tank rules. what a grade-a cnut

 

[meanreversion]

Oh man, there are others like ODT out there already

http://mercenarytrader.com/

 

[StephenMcCreedy]

bet £1pp for every £1,000 in your trading account on the ftse 100 and bag 4 points net per day. that doubles your money. 4 points net per day isn't difficult and the swings of £1pp per £1,000 in your account are very easy to take. i trade with a stop of 6 and target of 12 and 4 points a day is pretty easy to achieve.

personally if you're doing more than £10pp i'd move to liffe with interactive brokers and kill the spread all together. 4 point per day of the ftse fut on liffe isn't too hard and you should be done by 9am.

the hard part is sticking to it for 12 months

 

[meanreversion]

This implies you never have a losing day?

 

[advfntrader]

£4 a day profit ! lol

bet £1pp for every £1,000 in your trading account on the ftse 100 and bag 4 points net per day. that doubles your money. 4 points net per day isn't difficult and the swings of £1pp per £1,000 in your account are very easy to take. i trade with a stop of 6 and target of 12 and 4 points a day is pretty easy to achieve.

personally if you're doing more than £10pp i'd move to liffe with interactive brokers and kill the spread all together. 4 point per day of the ftse fut on liffe isn't too hard and you should be done by 9am.

the hard part is sticking to it for 12 months