Spreadbetting : Let's make some money

stevespray

Experienced member
Messages
1,289
Likes
156
Morning People….

I thought that it might be interesting to try and post a series of ‘live’ trades online to show folk how it is possible to make money from spreadbetting. I’ll try and demonstrate as best I can a series of trades, which I do most months, that produces a nice little income flow from spreadbetting. I must stress that this isn’t and invitation for others to follow but purely a practical demonstration of a generally successful strategy. As always people should conduct their own research as to whether a particular methodology of trading is suitable for them.

We will start the trade by opening a series of options position. These are as follows…..

I have sold the following…..

FTSE October Options

4375 Put @ 16.4 for £20
4400 Put @ 19.6 for £20
4625 Call @ 28.0 for £20
4650 Call @ 20.0 for £20

Total points sold = 89.4

Dax October Options

4000 Call @ 24.7 for £34
4050 Call @ 13.4 for £34
3700 Put @ 26.6 for £34
3650 Put @ 19.1 for £34

Total points sold = 83.8

Dow October Options

10550 Call @ 31.3 for £28
9750 Put @ 27.5 for £28

Total points sold = 58.8

S&P 500 Cash Options for October

1145 Call @ 4.8 for £56
1070 Puts @ 5.6 for £56

Total points sold = 10.4

Those are the initial positions that we will take. These are known as ‘option strangles’. Basically what we will do is just watch. The only time we may need to act further is when the market approaches or passes outside one of our ranges on any of the strangles. Personally I like to place a number of ‘crash stops’ in the market just below the base of each strangle. This is just in case something horrid occurs while I am away from the screens. You can in fact place just one stop in say the ES’s or the YM’s but make sure that the number of contracts is large enough to roughly hedge the entire number of Puts that you will have exposed if something did happen.

Even though the basis of these trades will be to make money using spreadbetting, I personally use a direct access platform to place any hedges which maybe required if one of the traded markets looks like it might be too strong or too weak. This fact needs to be kept in mind. It is possible to use spreadbetting to hedge as required, but if you need to jump in and out several times to effect the hedge, you may find the spreads prohibitive – direct access is excellent for this.

I use a psychology for these trades. I just say to myself that the spreadbet companies are paying me to take these positions. The number of points and the stakes they are paying me are shown. Should the need arise I will have this cash available to defend my position in the market. This will obviously be done buy purchasing a number of futures in the underlying to offset our Put or Call exposure.

Obviously, in an ideal world, all the Puts and Calls will expire worthless and we’ll pocket the lot. The stakes are priced as they are so that we can hedge directly into the underlying using the relevant future which is in a currency different to GBP.

Feel free to fire in any questions,
Steve.
 
Hi Steve,

Sorry if I'm posting a stupid question here but how have you decided to take these positions?

Have you based your positions on Support/Resistance levels or something more complex?

For example: (DAX)
4050 Call @ 13.4 for £34
3700 Put @ 26.6 for £34

I take it that these options are similar to the "No Touch" bets sold at betonmarkets.co.uk and are subject to time decay but, should the DAX reach (and pass) 4050, before coming back down to 3800, would your 4050 Call still be worth anything?

Thanks,

Ben
 
Morning Ben....

Selling an option is different to 'No touch'. It's more like 'expiry range' however, in the case of options, the further it is out of ther range, the more it will cost you at expiry. Obviously, if you look at the range that you asked about, Dax 3700 - 4050, you will see that it pays exactly 40 points. This means that, come expiry, the market will have to be more that 40 above or below our range for us to lose money.

To fully understand options you will need to revise the subject. There is a section on T2W regarding options. Roger is excellent. Take a look.

I establish the positions for a number of reasons.

1) I look for strangles that pay a certain number of points. This gives us some nice ammo to defend should the need occur.

2) In the last 50 years, the first 6 trading days of the month (on average) have produced more gains than the overall market has produced if you stayed fully invested for the whole month. This means that the rest of the month is likely to be net negative and so I find that quite often the Calls are paying extra premium for rises which are statistically less likely to show up. This also means that we can take Puts slightly lower than we otherwise would. Not sure if I explained that so well.

Steve.
 
Hi Steve
What SB company do you use to write options and how do the quotes compare to those quoted by the market (LIFFE).
Regards Alan
 
Cantors / IG Index / City Index.

The quotes are slightly wider but obviously you can do much smaller sizes with regards stakes.

Steve.
 
stevespray said:
In the last 50 years, the first 6 trading days of the month (on average) have produced more gains than the overall market has produced if you stayed fully invested for the whole month.

Steve.

Hi Steve
An interesting statistic.
May I ask where you got it from ?
And does the month refer to the beginning of the option contract or the calendar month ?
Glenn
 
hi steve
thank you for what seems to be a good example
could you explain how many contracts involved in the first example of the ftse oct
4375 [email protected] for 20 pounds and explain how it comes about
thanks again
best wishes
tom
 
Good thread -but I feel a lot of people keep away from options and hence will need a lot of guidance on trading them. I hope u will be able to provide and educate them.
rgds
zarif
 
Steve,

Whilst your example is fairly straightforward, textbook stuff regarding the strategy of selling strangles, you fail to mention anything about volatility and the "smile" which is extremely important when trading such a way.

If for example, volatilities were to explode, so would your wallet!
 
Blairlogie…..

You do make a valid point and I acknowledge that fact. Obviously if volatility increases then the value of the options which we have sold will also increase in value and our account will go under water. However, having said that, we are not really interested in the value of our options between now and expiry. This is a psychological distraction. Our task is purely to defend our positions (ie the ends of each of the ranges + the premium). So long as we manage to do this we should stay profitable. I’m not saying this is a full proof method of trading. It may not be suited to all tastes and people need to asses the risks involved (and there clearly are some as markets are not open 24/7 and hence a gap down / up is always possible). Of course people are free to scale the stakes up and down but, in order to be able to hedge in the underlying using a futures contract, they need to be aware of the minimum size of such a contract.

Zarif…..

Good point also. I would suggest that people not familiar with options don’t get directly involved with trading them in any way, shape or form until they have learned sufficient that they feel entirely comfortable with them. I have already point folk towards the options section of the board which contains a high number of quality posts on the issue.

Glenn…..

I got the statistic from a guy in the US who is an active options trader. The statistic refers to the start of a calendar month and not expiry. Another statistic that maybe useful. Over an extended period of time going back many decades it has become apparent that 40% of all stock market gains are made, between the few days running into Thanksgiving and, the first few sessions of the new year.

Tcksee….

One FTSE Futures contract is valued at £10 per point. Therefore in order to hedge our example position against an upside break we would need to buy 4 contracts. Likewise, if the market started to decline I we would sell 4 contracts to effectively lock our exposure we have from the Puts that we sold.

Hope this helps,
Steve.
 
Hi Steve,
What sort of margin would you need to put on your FTSE trade,I realise you are selling options so receive cash.Are you selling @ £20per point.
Regards Alan
 
newboy.....

Yes, all the option sells are in pounds per point. So I have sold £20 per point for each of the FTSE options.

The margin varies from place to place. To do all the trades that are listed above you would need about £20,000 although I wouldnt recomend doing those kind of sizes unless you had a minimum of around £60,000 to play with.

Steve
 
hi steve
thanks for your quick reply
is it correct to say that your income from the example was about 6000 plus
which futures do you use and can you leave screen with piece of mind
best wishes
tom
 
the classic strategy that makes money 4 times out of 5 and then loses 8 times the amount in one go.

Blairlogie only mentions the volatility risk. The major risk is that you are sitting on a position for a six weeks 'hoping' that nothing happens you actually have to watch this position every minute of every day. When the position goes against you steve... you say you 'delta' hedge .. but then the market bounce back....you are now losing on your hedge.....you cut the hedge.....the market goes against you again...you hedge...etc...etc

9 out of ten SB options clients sell... this year they have had a great time....next year 'who knows'

There are no 'stops' as most people would recognise them in options all you can do is leave delta
hedging stops which can themselves become your risk.

The 'real' professionals use options (buy and sell) to create complex low risk positions or buy them to hedge their outright position risk. Never follow a trader who says he can make you money by just selling options.

I would have been more impressed if steve had said "I sell these strangles and then buy further out of the money strikes and longer dated Strangles ie in the FTSE buy the Dec 4250 puts and the Dec 4800 calls to act as my hedge" then when the oct expires you can sell the Nov and then the Dec using the original two option purchases as your ultimate hedge in all three cases.

Much safer.... but of course it would cut back on your profit if 'nothing' happened.
But who wants to bet on nothing happening for the next six weeks ??

smallpotatos
 
tcksee.....

Yes, total income if those options all expiry worthless would be just over £6.5

With regard to leaving screens etc. It's not a problem for me. I actually spend alot of time in front of the screens when I am at home. I do however run this strategy even when I'm on holiday. It is not that labour intensive. What you find, as you get more experienced, is that you will get a better feel for where the markets are and what the general level of sentiment is. I personally always have a good idea in my head of where my exposure is. I also know roughtly how much. This is again experience. If I am away from the screens I can just slip orders into the market to cover any potential problems. It's not always an exact science but as long as you are covering atleast 80% - 90% of your possible exposure then you should be okay. The key is always to remain relaxed and focused. It is amazing, when focused you will find that you make far far less mistakes and bad trades.

Hope this helps,
Steve.
 
small potatoes.......

Obviously there is always a risk. With careful thought that risk can be reduced. You have suggested a way of doing that and I would agree that what you suggest would insure you. I'm not sure I would buy the upside call though. I'm not sure that too much would move the market drastically to the upside. Obviously another terrorist outrage could move us drastically lower and therefore some 'insurance' maybe worth taking. As I have said before, people need to understand and calculate their own risk.

With regard to the whip that you mention on the hedge. I generally use direct access and therefore the prospect of jumping in and out of the market in order to facilitate a hedge does not worry me. Obviously if it was all done on a spreadbet then the costs would be much larger.

Steve.
 
hi steve
thanks for your replyit is a good point you say about being relaxed and focused
my option trades have always been covered calls but you are limited by the amount of stock
i have been caught with naked puts but you have given me some food for thought
best wishes
tom
 
Steve
How are your trades going, have you adjusted or hedged any of your positions.
Regards Alan
 
Okay, as requested, an update…..

Here are the current levels for our open positions……

FTSE…
4375P = 3
4400P = 3.5
4625C = 26.5
4650C = 17.2

Total = 50.2

We sold 89.4 for £20 per point so, 89.4 – 50.2 = 39.2 x £20 = £784.00 profit to date.

DAX….
4000C = 23
4050C = 10.8
3700P = 4.7
3650P = 2.6

Total = 41.1

We sold 83.8 for £34 per point so, 83.8 – 41.1 = 42.7 x £34 = £1,451.80 profit to date.

Dow…..
10,550C = 2.5
9750P = 13.5

Total = 16

We sold 58.8 for £28 per point so, 58.8 – 16 = 42.8 x £28 = £1,198.40

S&P500 Cash……
1145C = 0.6
1070P = 2.2

Total = 2.8

We sold 10.4 for £56 per point so, 10.4 – 2.8 = 7.6 x £56 = £425.60

Therefore our current positions are showing us a profit of around £3,859.80 at the time of writing (4.50pm on Wednesday 29th Sept 04).

Comments…..

All pretty relaxed at present. No hedges are in place. I did attempt a hedge on FTSE during the strength of early last week. This ended up resulting in a scalp trade which made 16.5 points on 4 contracts (£40 per point). As it was the FTSE stalled and retraced quite a lot which meant that we stood back again. To be honest the FTSE doesn't worry me that much. For this market to rally strongly from here the price of oil would have to drop back a good way. This would be a downside pressure to the FTSE as oil companies have a good size weighting within the FTSE Index as a whole.

In the scenario laid out we have exposure in 4 markets. There is obviously a link between them as equity markets do, in general, move in similar directions. What you will however notice is that most of the markets are pretty much central in our strangles apart from the FTSE which is showing a slight upside bias. This is not a worry. FTSE would still have to move a good distance before it actually started costing us on that leg of the bet. Even if it did move that far, we would still have 3 other legs which we hope will give us more than adequate returns.

Hope this all helps,
Steve.
 
Cheers Steve
I very nearly opened a position to yours albeit at smaller stake but then was a bit wary.I understand how a strangle works but not to sure how to hedge,I would have rolled up or down using options.You seem to have a very relaxed trading style and thought I would follow you through a trade before I trade.Thank you for your help.
Regards Alan
 
Top