brutusdog
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yep and who gives a flying fcuk anyway. either way the dude is a wepon.
yep and who gives a flying fcuk anyway. either way the dude is a wepon.
arabianights
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£92k to him... what is our loss if we believe him? Absolutely nothing... if I was afraid of looking silly on the internet I wouldn't make half of my posts...
And no, it's not looking brilliant for him. I think the case against him is watertight actually!
And no, it's not looking brilliant for him. I think the case against him is watertight actually!
I still don't accept this story on the value of the information (none of it evidence of course) we have seen here.
But with regards liability and the £92k of unrequested credit, when you fill your car at the garage, this is on credit. The garage owner doesn't know how much you want, but for a few minutes, they offer you unlimited credit. Unlimited by them that is, there is probably a limit on your credit card and you have a limit on the amount of cash you have in your pocket, but they have no way of knowing their liability when you drive in. But if you turn the pump on and leave it running and spilling out of your tank and all over the forecourt, and they charge you with the £500 worth of spilled petrol, don't expect to tell the garage owner that you won't pay for it because you didn't ask for it.
But with regards liability and the £92k of unrequested credit, when you fill your car at the garage, this is on credit. The garage owner doesn't know how much you want, but for a few minutes, they offer you unlimited credit. Unlimited by them that is, there is probably a limit on your credit card and you have a limit on the amount of cash you have in your pocket, but they have no way of knowing their liability when you drive in. But if you turn the pump on and leave it running and spilling out of your tank and all over the forecourt, and they charge you with the £500 worth of spilled petrol, don't expect to tell the garage owner that you won't pay for it because you didn't ask for it.
tar
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Our time
fifty2aces
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Enough said?
megamuel
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fibonelli
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Complete and utter bull$hit nonsense.
If you want to be a successful trader/bettor, you risk no more than 2% (ideally below 1%) on any one trade/bet with a system stop loss.
What you did is purely gambling. You spunked your initial deposit and some and lost heavily
You now expect your counterparty to reimburse you. FFS, wake up.
Im on your side here Hoggs ,
Pluss what was the risk managers soing when this supost to be happening at IG ehh ?
In the past some of my trades on more than one occasion have been liquidated and the particular account was in a defficit, a few hundred quid yes, occasionally a few thousand when playing high stakes ( yes the other side was hedged ) however I can not imagine how such a small account in proportion to the loss could get to this stage of a 92k loss.
I question what was this guy doing at the time when the trade was moving against him ?
new_trader
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Yes, but the difference is that everyone here believes you look silly on the internet, you don't need to post any proof. As far as trust in a forum is concerned there is a difference between plausible and implausible. I find it impossible to believe that anyone would put on a £200 per point trade and not monitor the position closely. His whole defence rests upon “I thought”.
Typical story of greed - If he had made millions he’d be bragging about that one great trade for years and probably even end up writing a trading book. His famous line would be “You won’t get rich unless you take some risks in life”. But when it all goes awry (like now) he refuses to take the blame because he thought...he thought....he thought....
People...
tar
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Simcom here is an example of GSL benefits , at friday night b4 close i wanted to prepare myself for the Opec meeting on Sat so i bought Jan oil with GSL and sold Daily oil with GSL also , in this case i will be prepared for any gap in oil over the weekend , and i was right , one of them got stopped out at the exact point ( GSL ) and the other one i closed it at 53 $ b4 10 min , good gains with little risk ...
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tar
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Typical story of greed - If he had made millions he’d be bragging about that one great trade for years and probably even end up writing a trading book. His famous line would be “You won’t get rich unless you take some risks in life”. But when it all goes awry (like now) he refuses to take the blame because he thought...he thought....he thought....
People...
To be fair, from my point of view, to confess to losing that amount of money takes a bit of courage.
Whether to believe it, or not, is the decision that we have to take. I can't believe that a person could be so daft as to get into that position, myself, but it is possible and, at least, it does sound alarm bells to anyone who has more money than sense.
If the mistake was his and I think that he must know this, without posting for opinions, then he must know that IG will go for it legally, if necessary. It's far too large an amount to let pass.
Split
Whether to believe it, or not, is the decision that we have to take. I can't believe that a person could be so daft as to get into that position, myself, but it is possible and, at least, it does sound alarm bells to anyone who has more money than sense.
If the mistake was his and I think that he must know this, without posting for opinions, then he must know that IG will go for it legally, if necessary. It's far too large an amount to let pass.
Split
Firstly I do not think it is responsible or acceptable for a SB to just say ".. are leveraged products and you can lose more than your initial deposit " or whatever. If a stockbroker allowed a client to lose enough money that he couldn't really afford, i.e if the type of trading allowed was not consistent with the client's financial status, as per his application, (even if it was Execution only) the broker would/could be in trouble. I know I seem to be switching sides here as regards the initial post, but unless we know ALL the facts you cannot really make a judgement.
new_trader
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Allowed a client to lose enough money !?
You can't be serious
Should a client be 'allowed' to make as much money as they can or should that be at the stockbrokers discretion as well?
This is why we need to have labels on packs of rat poison like “Do not use as a substitute for sugar”
I think everyone should have a general disclaimer on the inside of their front door that says “Life is dangerous”
People
I think there are two points which mitigate any actions by the SB here. Firstly, this was the day the DJ rallied 300 points in 3 minutes, and it is this rally which caused the loss. Secondly, the OP was trading without any stops. Realistically, what should IG have done? Do they have a duty to monitor all their clients accounts real time, and close out if a loss get bigger than some undefined amount? This is a different scenario to someone who has lost a similar amount over the course of six months or a year. The OP was trading in large size with no stops, not paying any attention to the market. One position took him out. As you say unless we know all the facts, it's difficult to judge. However, as far as I can see here there's little IG could physically have done given the OPs astonishing lack of care of his own position.
advfntrader
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don't know about 92k but IG didn't close me out a while back and I lost more than double than I had in account. a valuable lesson on risk management. goodness knows when they would have closed it for me though. I do feel they let it run too much whereas other companies close you out sooner
Yes, I agree with that. Any broker would close an account if margin was called. An SB, in this day and age, should be able to do the same. But this does not happen in real life, does it? Didn't responsible bankers overlend to willing borrowers and create this financial crisis, to the extent that 5,000 houses a week are being forclosed?
Margins being overlooked are all part of the easy credit facilities that were, until now, being extended to everyone. That is the problem with the capitalist system.
So my advice is----don't get into trouble with debt from anyone, especially bookies. They have more than enough money to go to court.
new_trader
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Brokers can't win either way can they? I recall someone in another thread being furious about a losing position being closed. The complaint was that they were not given enough time to deposit the margin requirement. Now we have someone complaining that a losing position wasn't closed sooner.
I would like to see these two people in court...at the same time...it would be hilarious
Maybe I didn't explain that properly.Or maybe I did and it's just you took part of my quote out of context! If a client asks to effect a trade that will expose that client to an unacceptable level of risk, according to the client's profile, then the broker must reject the trade. i.e if the trade is not suitable for the particular client. It is allvery well talking about margin but that doesn't establish the level of risk. If you buy shares at 100p each with a margin of 10-20% you are probably asking for trouble. Maybe the client is lulled into a false sense of security thinking that the margin has been calculated to cover him. If the product is geared then it gets even more ridiculous. Presumably the SBs and other OTC markets were/are aggresively trying to attract business away from traditional stockbrokers and were/are requiring much too little margin.Allowed a client to lose enough money !?
You can't be serious
Should a client be 'allowed' to make as much money as they can or should that be at the stockbrokers discretion as well?
This is why we need to have labels on packs of rat poison like “Do not use as a substitute for sugar”
I think everyone should have a general disclaimer on the inside of their front door that says “Life is dangerous”
People
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Phil Mibbutz
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It's easy for a computer to monitor accounts realtime and then close a bet automatically. When I left a demo account running to see what happened, all my positions were closed when the margin reached zero, and that was with virtual money.
Perhaps the problem in this case was slippage? In my experience, IG seemed to have a policy of closing bets at the worst possible level (for the customer) on sudden spikes.
