Kicked out by Schneider Trading Associates, my feed back

Hi guys,

I have some questions

Where would I be studying the professional trader programme? What is the days and hours for the 4 week professional trader programme? What would I be studying?

In the email I got from them, they wrote that I would have to fund 6-9 months after the 4 week professional trader programme. What are the hours for working for 6-9 months? I understand that I won't earn a salary for 6-9 months after the programme? What happens after 6-9 months? Do you work for Schneider and earn a salary, or do you apply for jobs elsewhere?

I don't think the trader programme is attractive, I believe you would earn no salary for 6-9 months and 4 weeks. You have to pay for travel, I assume I would spend 6-9 months working in Moorgate?

Thanks for any replies
 
- Study in Moorgate.
- Hours: They're about 9-5 for first 2 weeks then it goes to 8-5 (they might have changed this since I was there) but they prefer you to get in before the time it starts to do some market research.
- Studying basics, how to read a ladder, some risk/reward, basics of calendar spread and some lingo. If you get past the first 2 weeks then they'll teach you more such as flys and about picking direction etc. But it depends on your class and how fast they learn.
- You have to fund your living expenses; you work with no wage. So if you need money in a few months then be prepared to not make it there.
- I guess hours depend on the market you trade but they expect you to be in every day without fail, in at first thing and out at the end of day.
- Progression depends on your success, if you can't cover desk fees and aren't making money they'll kick you out. If you're breaking even with desk fees they'll probably let you stay but you'll get fed up not making money. If you're profitable every month you're free to stay as long as you like.
 
Thanks for your reply, very much appreciated

Do you eventually earn a salary after 6-9 months of working for no salary?
 
For my group the hours for the second two weeks were 6.30am to 4pm and the working hours are those times as well as I trade european fixed income.

The four weeks is mainly learn how execute a spread trade and learn the TT/CQG platform. Some other stuff like psychology to trading and how to profit from news were good.

Most new traders don't make any money for the first 6-9 months so why the need to have savings. And from what I heard I would say 6-9 months might be considered generous..

Trying to make it as a prop trader is risky and most don't make it. But if you do the rewards are considered attractive so why people try.

You'll not get a salary 'cos Prop trading is self employed. Consider it like running your own business. Basically, Schneider provide you with the money to trade and you have to make money for yourself. Whatever you earn minus cost you get to keep 70%. There is no salary and you earn what you make.
 
you never earn a "salary" just to make it clear to Rob, its not like they say "well done you've been here for 6 months here's 30k basic". You only get paid a percentage of what you make. Most people make nothing. Profitable traders earn 60-70% of what they make. Some guys only earn 25-30k a year from this, others in the millions. But there is nothing steady or guaranteed about your earnings

EDIT: sorry just saw last paragraph above me
 
Hi guys,
It seems you have some inside information about Schneider.
Do you know how much trading capital is provided for new traders? And to what upside limit it can extend over some period? Thanks
 
Ajax86 said:
Hi guys,
It seems you have some inside information about Schneider.
Do you know how much trading capital is provided for new traders? And to what upside limit it can extend over some period? Thanks
Click to expand...

You are given one clip to start with then two clips in about two weeks if you show you know what you are doing and then four clips. At least that is what RichieE said in the other thread and I expect at some point how many clips you are given would be tied in with how much you have in your trading account.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/tra...g-associates-graduate-training-program-2.html

By my rough calculation you do basically need about four clips to make a basic living.

As to upside limit over a time period, a lot would depend on how quickly you get additional clips and the volatility of the spread you are assigned to trade. I personally don't think you can make big money until you have £10k in your trading account so you can trade other instruments and I think outright as well.

oh it also depends on whether you are assigned to the teams on the fourth floor or with the rest on the 5th floor. 4th floor things works a bit differently but 5th floor it is about grinding that one spread.
 
Chuck Bada$$ Norris said:
Those mooks did you a favour. You were wasting your time there, and the longer you stayed, the uglier you would have got. Most of them are so ugly they have to hang a pork chop round their necks to get the dog to play with them.

Move on and be grateful you didn't stay too long.
Click to expand...

Actually, I would say if you can try stay till week three. If you only do the first two weeks, you'll probably come away learning nothing. All the maths tests and messing around on the platform you probably won't figure their use and how it all comes together.

Week three is when you get on the sims and learn how to spread trade.

If this doesn't work out for me, at least I did learn how to spread trade and can use it at home.
 
You just pay double the commission for a much less riskier trade. Maybe times when you don't have a particularly strong market view so would be good to have something else to trade on the side.
 
CQG+Bloomberg+TT+the comms at home are going to make it very challenging to make money if you're trading your own money on a small account. You really have to do it at a prop place if you want to trade the way STA wants you to unless you got a lot of dough.
 
TimYoung said:
oh why not?
Click to expand...

Sorry Tim, wasn't being provocative, I just can't see trading the spread with lightening reactions (human and techno) working from home, IMHO yo,d be better swing trading and as Tom mog fascinatingly pointed out recently if you can prove results at that other prop firms may want you
 
TimYoung said:
Actually, I would say if you can try stay till week three. If you only do the first two weeks, you'll probably come away learning nothing. All the maths tests and messing around on the platform you probably won't figure their use and how it all comes together.

Week three is when you get on the sims and learn how to spread trade.

If this doesn't work out for me, at least I did learn how to spread trade and can use it at home.
Click to expand...

Sorry dude, I don't agree with your last comment,


In week 3 ,4. they teach you concept(fly , box) and just allow you to sim by yourself,they are not really care about you. ( at that period, they pay attention in trading floor's traders who are make real money and lose real.They won't teach you any technology to earn money. I don't think this kind of spread trade skills will work at home.

Actually, I believe that the tutor speak in the class, they are not good at trading. Maybe they are losers or don't have confidence to trade any more. They can teach you basic concept and knowledge. They are good speakers not traders.
The excellent traders in Schneider are very busy to make money. They don't care and won't give you any words during the trading time.
 
Masquerade said:
CQG+Bloomberg+TT+the comms at home are going to make it very challenging to make money if you're trading your own money on a small account.
Click to expand...

Actually, it is the opposite. If you have a small account, it would prob be cheaper to trade from home because you don't have to pay for desk fees or at least you can use a much reduce one.
 
financening said:
Sorry dude, I don't agree with your last comment,

In week 3 ,4. they teach you concept(fly , box) and just allow you to sim by yourself,they are not really care about you. ( at that period, they pay attention in trading floor's traders who are make real money and lose real.They won't teach you any technology to earn money. I don't think this kind of spread trade skills will work at home.

Actually, I believe that the tutor speak in the class, they are not good at trading. Maybe they are losers or don't have confidence to trade any more. They can teach you basic concept and knowledge. They are good speakers not traders.
The excellent traders in Schneider are very busy to make money. They don't care and won't give you any words during the trading time.
Click to expand...

I was taught spreads instead of fly and box so can't really comment. I can't figure out the purpose of doing two spreads when just playing one spread you are already hedged against market shocks.

Also, going into it, I never had the expectation of been taught strategies to make money but just how to trade. At the end of the day, if there were any profitable strategies that were been taught, they would become unprofitable asap. There were though quite a few things I thought I could use to profit that were not taught directly but picked up along the way.

I thought the course was useful. Maybe a bit stretched out and probably everything could have been done within two weeks but it was worth doing.
 
TimYoung said:
Actually, it is the opposite. If you have a small account, it would prob be cheaper to trade from home because you don't have to pay for desk fees or at least you can use a much reduce one.
Click to expand...

It depends what your desk fees cover.....If you get a bloomberg terminal, CQG, TT, lower comms, bigger clip size, fast internet connection, computers+screens then it's worth more than the £1500 or whatever STA charge for the above if you compare it to having the same setup at home. Bloomberg terminal alone is ~£900/month.
 
Oh a Bloomberg terminal. Sorry, totally missed that. Well, if you are trading on a small account, I can't see how you can justify paying for a Bloomberg terminal. Yea, it would be very difficult to make money if you have to clear £900 extra a month. You don't really need one tho and in any case I don't have a Bloomberg terminal at STA either or at least nobody has told me about it. How do you profit from having one? Thought CQG and Squawk would cover everything I need.
 
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