Hunting secrets revealed

[gooseman]

your mates must love it when you join them for a beer.

 

[virtuos0]

Sounds like me when I scalp.

Nowadays, I tend to hunt the injured wilderbeast in the open plains. With a rocket launcher. It's not subtle. It's not clever. It just works.

Amen.

But anyway, to expand on my previous point about the inexperienced hunter chasing the squirrel..

The inexperienced hunter finds that he is bad at climbing trees, and even worse at getting down from them. So what does he do? He takes a few months to learn how to climb trees, and how to get down them. Eventually he is adept at both things, and is hellbent on getting back at the squirrel that got away from him.

He spots a squirrel and goes blasting after it, the squirrel heads for the nearest tree and our intrepid hunter thinks, "ah hah I have you this time foolish squirrel!". They both head up the tree and the hunter has the squirrel cornered. At the last moment the squirrel simply leaps onto a small branch of an adjoining tree, runs down that tree and heads off to find more nuts, whilst our neophyte hunter is left to yet again find another strategy,

In the meantime, our experienced hunter is eyeing up a deer, sipping lazily at the water hole, waiting in absolute silence as it gets closer, and closer..

 

[neil]

Mates...what mates

your mates must love it when you join them for a beer.

Billy "No Mates" is his middle name

 

[virtuos0]

your mates must love it when you join them for a beer.

What are you going to do next call me a 'gaylord' or something? We're not in school anymore, remember?

 

[neil]

Wheres the PURPLE prose

This is true too, if a buffalo runs into your path you kill it, no questions asked. But all the same, the hunter needs a strategy and no strategy was ever based around opportunism. If you rely on luck, then at sooner or later your luck is going to run out and you're going to go hungry, or worse.

Yep..he is Socrates in disguise or he has nicked ol' Socs' way of alluding to things

Remember this folks - blast from the past:
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/psychology/10672-journey-basement.html

 

[gooseman]

i was merely implying that you seem to be a bucket of fun. i poke jest at your post (which i happen to think is drivel) and it's straight on the defensive.

gaylord.

i think my school was more mature than my trading floor to be brutally honest.

 

[montmorencyt2w]

Absolutely! Even the best hunters are taking enormous risks in comparison with farmers. It's a slower road because rather than going out and making a kill each day for your food, you have to wait for your calf to mature. But in time you will have a big enough stock that you can live from it. The risks are still there as your stock might be hit by disease, theft or break loose, but this is nothing in comparison to the risk you take each day in the forest.

Well, don't let's underestimate the risks with investments of course, thinking of the various stock market meltdowns and near collapse of the financial system.

Similarly a farmer can be totally wiped out by disease or adverse weather conditions or some other catastrophe.

You can also extend this away from investments and think of a 'cash' metaphor, which is effectively the same as buying your food from a farmer. There is very little risk, but your risk is that you are subservient to someone else. If the farmer decides he wants more reward in return for his stock he can change at a whim, and as food is a necessity you are forced to go along.

Or you can go to another farmer (the "efficient market" (ho ho) perhaps).

Short of being killed by a marauding animal, a hunter should be able to survive most traumas and carry on (even if he doesn't live to a ripe old age). Similarly, a trader, provided that he only loses his money and not his mind, should always be able to start again one day.
Or so I hope.

 

[virtuos0]

i was merely implying that you seem to be a bucket of fun. i poke jest at your post (which i happen to think is drivel) and it's straight on the defensive.

gaylord.

i think my school was more mature than my trading floor to be brutally honest.

If you are on the trading floor then this is not intended for you, and you may well interpret it as drivel. If the reader of this thread is already consistently profitable then congratulations, if not then you still have a lot of learning and unlearning to do, and something here might spark off a line of thought.

 

[virtuos0]

To put it another way, I do not believe that you can really learn anything that you didn't arrive at by your own thought process. This is why no one listens to the endless repitition of the basic advice on this site, because you can't force something down someones throat. They have to arrive at their own conclusion from 'first principles'.

It can be the case that the only method by which someone can look at something in a new way is by coming at it from the side, or in other words, laterally.

 

[montmorencyt2w]

To put it another way, I do not believe that you can really learn anything that you didn't arrive at by your own thought process. This is why no one listens to the endless repitition of the basic advice on this site, because you can't force something down someones throat. They have to arrive at their own conclusion from 'first principles'.

It can be the case that the only method by which someone can look at something in a new way is by coming at it from the side, or in other words, laterally.

Well I think it's always possible to learn something, no matter how much you already know, or think you know.

But I wonder if you are talking here about trading mechanics, technical trading if you will, or fundamentals, or combining both to best advantage?

I admit to being relatively inexperienced, but whenever I read experienced traders, here or elsewhere, no matter how "technical" they appear to be, they often seem to incorporate a good understanding of the fundamentals as well, consciously or unconsciously. Whether this is picked up along the way or consciously studied I don't know, but for beginners to try to compete with people like this is an enormous mountain to climb. Not necessarily an impossible one, but they are almost certainly going to have to do a lot more than just apply some mechanical system blindly, no matter how successful it appears to be on the surface.

 

[virtuos0]

Well I think it's always possible to learn something, no matter how much you already know, or think you know.

But I wonder if you are talking here about trading mechanics, technical trading if you will, or fundamentals, or combining both to best advantage?

I admit to being relatively inexperienced, but whenever I read experienced traders, here or elsewhere, no matter how "technical" they appear to be, they often seem to incorporate a good understanding of the fundamentals as well, consciously or unconsciously. Whether this is picked up along the way or consciously studied I don't know, but for beginners to try to compete with people like this is an enormous mountain to climb. Not necessarily an impossible one, but they are almost certainly going to have to do a lot more than just apply some mechanical system blindly, no matter how successful it appears to be on the surface.

It doesn't matter what your opinin on the fundamentals is, and it doesn't matter what it says in the FT, or on Bloomberg, but what does matter is the major players opinions, and how much variation there is in those opinions. There's an easy way to go about finding those opinions, and working out how much concensus there is..

 

[jessemore]

another donkey with 2 weeks of spread betting wins under his belt feeling its necessary to hover above everyone with his sermon.

 

[jessemore]

the reason he uses analogies is because if he just said have a plan and be patient he wouldnt be able to demonstrate fully what a nob he is

 

[tomorton]

Ah, but we're not hunters. We're symbiotic parasites.

 

[virtuos0]

another donkey with 2 weeks of spread betting wins under his belt feeling its necessary to hover above everyone with his sermon.

Actually I have zero weeks experience of SB'ing.

Nice first post by the way.

 

[virtuos0]

the reason he uses analogies is because if he just said have a plan and be patient he wouldnt be able to demonstrate fully what a nob he is

Absolutely, and those two things have been said THOUSANDS of times on this site over and over ad nauseam and yet no one listens, so why not say it in a different way in the hope that something might click.

Nice second post by the way.

 

[virtuos0]

Ah, but we're not hunters. We're symbiotic parasites.

This made me think! Most of us aren't even symbiotic parasites, we're just parasites. After all our being here has absolutely no benefits for the mighty beast.

To bring it back into market talk, if retail trading ceased tomorrow what impact would it have on the interbank/institutional market? I understand that retail accounts for around 2% of the market. We're unlikely to even give any information to the interbank market in terms of orderflow information, as I can only assume that when positions are layed off into the market by our brokers it is categoried as 'uninformed' and hence essentially ignored.

Food for thought.

 

[Paul71]

Imagine you are a hunter, naturally you will want to be tracking the large prey, because that's what feeds the family for the longest with the least effort. You live on the edge of three different forests, and each day your first job is, of course, to determine which forest will be the most fruitful. You can decide this based on past experience of where you have made the most kills, or you can stand at a good vantage point and observe the edges of the forest to see if any large animals are currently grazing at the boundary. The best hunters however tend to combine both, weighing up the pros and con's of either strategy in the present moment.

Once you are aware of which forest presents the best opportunities the hunter enters the forest and begins the second stage of his endeavour, tracking the beast. For this he needs to know intimately the tell tale signs that the big beasts leave. To someone who doesn't know what to look for, a broken twig here, a footprint there, it would just look like any other forest, but the hunter can see the invisible map.

During the tracking the hunter is not simply following the beast, he is also attempting to learn it's behaviour. For example the easiest hunting technique is normally simply to wait at a place the beast often returns to, such as a water hole, and spring an ambush. Most hunters do not have the patience for this and feel the need to know exactly where the beast is at all times.

However the truly successful hunter does not just understand the beast intimately, he also understands the forest and his surroundings and is alert to all possibilities. For example, whilst waiting for an ambush is there a snake creeping up behind ready to strike? What does the weather look like, is it about to pour down with rain hence meaning the beast will no longer need the water hole? Is there another hunter nearby with the same ideas as you?

You can survive for a bit as a hunter without all these skills, you will come across some easy kills, and you can live on fruit for a while. But unless you have the complete picture you won't live into old age, and your wife will run away with a better hunter.

Trader Dante started a thread, it was about praying and faith. Maybe Faith and Christianity can make a persons character become more wholesome and hold more Virtue. Maybe to be a good trader a person has to have a cleansed Mind, Body and Soul. If your 'Hunter' was a real person, on thier own in the wilderness, surviving only off the land, i would imagine them to be a 'Good' person. Totally in tune with thier surroundings and the self.



Good trading.

 

[monetssamba]

actually since youre so concerned about number of posts you can add these to. i have four accounts one for each computer. how do you know no one listens, how do you know nothing has clicked, it is these assumptions that rankle while you drone on. the reason tomortons post made you think is because theres more depth in that one line response than in everything youve said so far but you still cant allow it and find yourself correcting it. when positions are being 'layed off' by our brokers who exactly are they broadcasting it as uninformed to? "attention market paticipants weve just had an order filled by a customer please ignore, please ignore". food for thought like that rotten prawn sandwich you wish you hadnt had straight out your a rse

 

[virtuos0]

Trader Dante started a thread, it was about praying and faith. Maybe Faith and Christianity can make a persons character become more wholesome and hold more Virtue. Maybe to be a good trader a person has to have a cleansed Mind, Body and Soul. If your 'Hunter' was a real person, on thier own in the wilderness, surviving only off the land, i would imagine them to be a 'Good' person. Totally in tune with thier surroundings and the self.



Good trading.

Imagine now our experienced hunter has been staking out the water hole and making regular kills for months, or even years. In the fullness of time two things are going to happen, firstly the hunted beasts are going to stop coming there to drink, as even the dumbest of animals have the capacity for learning. Secondly other hunters are going to try to copy this tactic, there will not be enough meat to go around, and the danger of a confrontation multiplies.

So conditions in the forest have changed and our wise hunter needs to formulate a new tactic. To do this he uses his knowledge of his SURROUNDINGS.

The most successful hunters have subtle edges in the forest that they had to work incredibly hard to find and master.. perhaps they can identify noises from a distance, or have an acute sense of smell, or know what plants can be used as poison.. if an edge can be easily copied or is widely known, the likelihood of durable success diminishes, as our hunter found to his cost at the waterhole.