Has anyone been succesful with trading???

[Merdox]

I have been trying to trade for the last two years. when It comes to paper trading and demo trading I can make it work. However whenever I switch to live trading it only works for a short time and then I just loose money. Its almost like "they" know what I am doing.

This has been going on the past two years and I am about ready to close my account. I have talked to my wife about this and she thinks I should close my account as well. However I am not a quitter and the thought of quitting bothers me alot. Not to mention I would love to make this work

The point is I am open to any suggestions. Should I close my account and if not what can I do to keep a profit?

Thanks
Joseph

 

[Mornington Crescent]

if you think you should close your account
and your wife thinks you should close your account
then that makes three of us.

you need to step back and find out what you are doing wrong.

no-one slse can sort out your problems for you.

 

[houdani]

I have been trying to trade for the last two years. when It comes to paper trading and demo trading I can make it work. However whenever I switch to live trading it only works for a short time and then I just loose money. Its almost like "they" know what I am doing.

This has been going on the past two years and I am about ready to close my account. I have talked to my wife about this and she thinks I should close my account as well. However I am not a quitter and the thought of quitting bothers me alot. Not to mention I would love to make this work

The point is I am open to any suggestions. Should I close my account and if not what can I do to keep a profit?

Thanks
Joseph

why dont you keep your account open,but step back for a while,continue studying the markets and learn some more.this will subconsciously sit better than outright quitting.you can then come back to real trading when you feel you have a more reliable analytical method.rome wasnt built in a day etc etc. there is no time limit set for this, and it sounds like you may be putting yourself under too much pressure to succeed. i would think most succesful traders have been through exactly the same experience as you.its a long learning curve that never actually ends.good luck though.

 

[markbt]

If you can make your system work in demo accounts then try to stick to it in live accounts. Your greatest problem is your own emotions causing you to fail. If you can overcome these when trading then you will be successful. Easier said than done.

 

[roguetrader]

I think you already know the answer to that question

 

[badtrader]

I say go for it. if you can afford to lose 5k.What ever you are doing on you demo account do the same live. If you think of the money in this game, you wont make it, dont think of the money. only what the market or your method is telling you..I remember my family saying you wont make it. you throwing you money away, this was back in 1988, I ignored them

Go for it. You only live once

 

[commanderco]

I have been trying to trade for the last two years. when It comes to paper trading and demo trading I can make it work. However whenever I switch to live trading it only works for a short time and then I just loose money. Its almost like "they" know what I am doing.

This has been going on the past two years and I am about ready to close my account. I have talked to my wife about this and she thinks I should close my account as well. However I am not a quitter and the thought of quitting bothers me alot. Not to mention I would love to make this work

The point is I am open to any suggestions. Should I close my account and if not what can I do to keep a profit?

Thanks
Joseph

1 ...Stop Trading & leave your account open.
2 ...Post your trades and/or method here and I am sure that the members will help you get back on track.
3 ...If you are using stops and you have a feeling that you are being watched, that is because you are.

 

[dvdh]

I say go for it. if you can afford to lose 5k.What ever you are doing on you demo account do the same live. If you think of the money in this game, you wont make it, dont think of the money. only what the market or your method is telling you..I remember my family saying you wont make it. you throwing you money away, this was back in 1988, I ignored them

Go for it. You only live once

You are soooo right Badtrader!!!!!

 

[osho67]

"...If you are using stops and you have a feeling that you are being watched, that is because you are"

Is this a joke statement or a serious comment? Can traders stop orders be seen by all including Market makers?
I thought this was not possible, please explain ?

 

[Merdox]

Thanks everyone for the replys. For now I think I will sit back from trading and try and see what more I can learn.

In responce to Osho67
When I was using FXCM's news they would often make a report when a Big Dog trader placed a trade. In that report they would list the limit he placed as well as the stop. Granted the Big Dog trader was probably a bank or maybe another Corporation. However I belave when a person does place a trade It is viewed by someone if they wish to view it.

Joseph

 

[timsk]

Hi Joseph,
If I were in your shoes, I'd only want to listen to people who've been through what you've been through in the last two years and managed to emerge the other side as consistently profitable traders. I can't speak for any of the posters above, but I'm not in this category, so you want to take anything I say with a large pinch of salt! However, I offer my comments as someone who understands your frustration perfectly. Suffice to say - been there, done that, bought the T-shirt, etc. In trying to solve this very same problem for myself, I concluded that there were two possible key reasons for my failure.
1. I wasn't being totally honest with myself and realistic with my paper trading. Things like not taking account of poor fills, SB bias and, more seriously, 'fudging' entry and exits in my favour. This is all relatively trivial stuff and solvable. The tricky stuff is point No. 2 . . .
2. ME!!! (Or, in your case, YOU!!!)
It's this dreaded psychological stuff that people keep wittering on about! Your personality and character are what they are. Potentially, they will contribute to your 'edge' and, at the same time, be the cause of your downfall. To help ensure the former, you need to be aware of your strengths and weaknesses. As far as possible, these have to be accounted for and your trading plan will specify how you maximise the former and minimise the latter. Of course, if you don't have a detailed, written trading plan, you're probably stuffed - whatever you do. This was the conclusion that I came to earlier in the year and prompted me to write the Trading Plan Template. If you don't yet have a comprehensive plan and aren't too sure how to set about creating one, this link may be of some use.
http://www.trade2win.com/knowledge/first-steps/articles/general_articles/trading-plan-template/
Enjoy!,
Tim.

 

[zuke]

I have been trying to trade for the last two years. when It comes to paper trading and demo trading I can make it work. However whenever I switch to live trading it only works for a short time and then I just loose money. Its almost like "they" know what I am doing.

This has been going on the past two years and I am about ready to close my account. I have talked to my wife about this and she thinks I should close my account as well. However I am not a quitter and the thought of quitting bothers me alot. Not to mention I would love to make this work

The point is I am open to any suggestions. Should I close my account and if not what can I do to keep a profit?

Thanks
Joseph

I will give you my 2p's worth as someone who has been through the same thing. Firstly, I think you need to evaluate how you are paper trading. In live trading, unless you have stops and limits in place, you wont be so laissez faire about your trading in the same way as one is when paper trading. For this reason, you need to ensure that your paper trading environment is EXACTLY the same as that for your live trading. You must use EXACTLY the same system for both types of trading.

Now, in my opinion, once you have placed a trade (live or paper) - put in your stop and your target and WALK AWAY from the trade. Sitting there to watch it tick by tick will only heighten your anxiety if the market start to move against you. Worse still, you will be tempted to do that most terrible of things..moving your stop further to ensure you dont get stopped out or (here come some Zuke Newbie logic) adding to your losing position on the basis that "Im reducing the entry price of the trade and when it reverses, I'll be quids in"..both of these are suicidal.

It's such a cliche, but trading requires one thing..DISCIPLINE. Have your trading plan..follow your rules and you'll be fine.

Best of luck!

 

[tommog]

Hi,

I would say stick with it!
If somebody says they made money from day one they are either lying or are some kind of "supertrader". If you have been in the game for two years chances are you know everything you need to know. Trading doesnt require huge amounts of intelligence, freakish analytical skills etc etc I am confident I could teach the majority of people how to trade provided they have the enthusiasm to learn. Having said that if you have been trading two years you probably know a huge amount of knowledge anyway. Trading is about discipline and applying the knowledge you have.

The best way to ensure you follow discipline I believe is to use limits. Brokers may see your orders but the market really isnt as corrupt as people like to think, so a bad broker may add a few pips here and there to your costs, its a shame but by no means makes trading impossible. In forex you should be looking for "at least" 10 pips profit off of a move. If you want to "scalp" (which is often referred to trading for 3-5 pips profit, which isnt actually scalping in the strictest sense) you should move to futures, scalping with a 3 pip spread in a price takers environment is a mugs game in my view, i've never met a pro forex trader that has traded differently to this. SO when you place a trade i suggest look for about a 20-30 point move (initially, as you get better you can work on scaling in/out).
So if you are looking for 20-30 pips move you ideally want about a 15 pip stop loss (any less than that and your risk of market noise stopping you out is far higher)

The fact you make money on paper suggests to me your approach is ok but its discipline and emotion that lets you down in the real market so i suggest once you find a trade set your limits and walk away from the screen, let every trade run to stop or profit until you learn control. Something to keep in mind is if you have a 1:2 or 1:3 risk reward ratio or a system you know generate x% profitable trades, every single time you close a profit (or loss) too early you distort that ratio until eventually you will become so inconsistent you will more than likely lose money.

Another tip is look at longer time frames (I wouldnt look below an hourly chart on forex) and try and limit yourself to one trade a day so you learn to really pick them carefully. I think if you follow these rules until you build your confidence up again you will be glad you didnt close your account.

Good luck,

Tom

(p.s i am assuming if you have trading experience you know about money management so didnt bother to say never risk more than 2% of your account on a trade because im sure you know that, although I personally only risk 1%)

 

[tommog]

Zuke,

sorry just read your post and see I covered a lot of points you made, oh well cant hurt saying them twice

Tom

 

[commanderco]

"...If you are using stops and you have a feeling that you are being watched, that is because you are"

Is this a joke statement or a serious comment? Can traders stop orders be seen by all including Market makers?
I thought this was not possible, please explain ?

Without dwelling on this broad subject too much, most small Traders use breakouts to enter.
The breakouts are obvious once you can see them, which will then place the stops 1 or 2 tics outside the previous pivot point.
If you see that these have been cleaned out, and the price then failed there is a good chance that you now have a successful entry.

As I say, this is a broad explanation only. Please dont ask me to expand on it, because although I would do it gladly, I dont have the time.

Incidentally, for those who are interested, I slapped up a trading system in 5 lines on another thread ... If I recall, the thread had something to do with trading the mini russell.

The system is simple and profitable, however whether you are profitable is quite another matter.

Trading is all about mind control and starts and stays with honesty. That is why people cannot transit from paper to real money seamlessly.

This thread is very real to me and it took me some time to get from where this thread is to a point of streaming points. In fact reading this thread makes me very tired.

My advice to people at this level is simply " If you want to become aTrader then become one by doing the work. But look to yourself first. Dont focus on laptops and wiggly lines.
It is doeable.

 

[zuke]

Zuke,

sorry just read your post and see I covered a lot of points you made, oh well cant hurt saying them twice

Tom

No problem..just emphasises the validity of what we are saying. When I started trading, I would sit an watch the trade pip by pip anf then average down or move my stop if the trade was going against me. I soon learnt (after a big losing streak) that it this was suicidal.

 

[Adamned]

In my opinion you should not quit if you have a decent trading plan that can win if you stick to it with steel discipline. There is three simple steps you can take. Again drwing from the great book reminices of a stock operator. Paper trading is a pure waste of time however child size postions are a great alternative. The solution to this is open a spread betting account and trade the crosses you do at the absolute minimum. It will give you a much more realistic feel of trading. Have you read anything from the philospher of military art Clauswitz. If you haven't try to read some of it and understand the prinicples deeply. The general point anyhow in his writings is that an act of agression is total. You should treat your trades the same way. You shouldn't actually put all your funds on this one trade but try to beleive or play a game with yourself. That if you lose this trade it will be your complete destruction. This kind of thinking will lead you to accept only the greatest of great trades. Again drawing from reminices of a stock operator, I exited the sucker-gambling class when I realized that the game is not about picking the next few points, its about being on the side of underlying conditions. For starters if your trading currecy absolutely no charts less than 240 minutes candles. Use conditions. For example in the past year what were the conditons. Condtions were that the dollar should rise due to tightening intrest rates in the US and the ECB basically keeping on hold. Your plan should have been to short the Euro on every good chart setup if you had done that you would have had a great year. On that point I wouldn't use those condtions any more its probaly to old. These are just my opinions and I don't profess that they are correct but I do beleive they do deserve some thought at least.

 

[Kaffee]

Pick a moving average... long above it, short below and stops vice versa. Back test it, commit some funds and see how it goes. But whatever you do, make it "your" system. DO NOT sit at the screen all day.

This will address the thread running through all these posts... it's the "computer" tapping the keys that's the problem.

I'm in your boat too... and slowly but surely I'm coming round to the notion that you can only win by keeping the losses small and staying on a winning trade.

 

[a_gnome]

I have been trying to trade for the last two years. when It comes to paper trading and demo trading I can make it work. However whenever I switch to live trading it only works for a short time and then I just loose money. Its almost like "they" know what I am doing.

This has been going on the past two years and I am about ready to close my account. I have talked to my wife about this and she thinks I should close my account as well. However I am not a quitter and the thought of quitting bothers me alot. Not to mention I would love to make this work

The point is I am open to any suggestions. Should I close my account and if not what can I do to keep a profit?

Thanks
Joseph

Can I ask whether you have a definite trading plan/methodology that you were using with your demo account or was it more seat-of-the-pants type of trading? If you have a definite plan then "all" you need to do is to stick to it and translate what you were doing from the demo account to the real-money account. If you don't, then that's the reason why you are failing with your real-money trading and you need to formulate a proper trading method.

 

[Merdox]

Thanks for all the good replys. From the previous posts I think I might have found some books to read and start digging into.

In responce to some of the questions that were asked. Yes, I have always used a trading plan and the more I traded the more I was able to fine tune it (this worked great for my demo trading). For me personaly I can't tell what I did differant between my demo and my real account. The only thing I can think of is on my real account I would sit and watch my trades, where I wouldn't do that on my demos.

And for anyone who has done that it can be a hair pulling experience. So what would happen alot is after a halfhour to an hour of watching the pips go from -5 to plus 5 I would just take it off the board making a couple of pips or loosing a couple of pips. Only to watch it shortly later go in my favor 20 pips.

The best trading I had with real money was trading divergence off the 15min chart using MACD. If any one knows about Peter Bain he hammers it home when it comes to divergence. It does work and it is pretty simple. However after a while it came to the point where I couldn't find any divergence, it was like it dissapeared. Which forced me to look at other methods.

Looking at my past trading experiences, I think I need to stop watching my trades. That might be a start, and I think I will go back to the demo trading for a while to help build up my confidence.

I know I can do this, I feel I have the knowledge. Now I just need to mesh it all together and make it happen.

Joseph