CFD/Spread Betting A Poor Mans Futures Trader

jkane

Active member
128 1
Any serious trader is trading the underlines at real stock and futures exchanges

CFD's and Spread Betting are good learning tools for the small trader

anything serious and your a real sucker(y)
 

gle101

Veteren member
3,717 84
Well I kind of agree with jkane, if one have got the experience and the funds for it the real market is always the best. CFDs is here to stay and is growing, I guess many uses them for hedging as well. I do not have the funds to trade the FTSE Z future, or willing to put up that much money per point for that matter. So what do I do, I trade CFDs or spread betting of course. You will not get as good a price, but it could still be a good deal in order to trade the markets.
 

timsk

Legendary member
7,601 2,376
jkane,
I am pro Son
Whether or not you're a 'pro' and, more to the point, what you're a pro in or at remains to be seen. One thing's for sure; Trader333 is not your son.

I have accounts all over the globe, multiple addresses
That as may be, but as Trader333 has pointed out, if you're a U.S. resident, then you don't (legally) have an account with a U.K. spread betting firm. Unless you've traded with a SB firm, then you're not really in a position to make the judgement you've made.

The bottom line is that, for you, trading the underlying instrument via a direct market access broker is the way to go. And that's fine.
Tim.
 
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gle101

Veteren member
3,717 84
jkane,

Whether or not you're a 'pro' and, more to the point, what you're a pro in or at remains to be seen. One thing's for sure; Trader333 is not your son.


That as may be, but as Trader333 has pointed out, if you're a U.S. resident, then you don't (legally) have an account with a U.K. spread betting firm. Unless you've traded with a SB firm, then you're not really in a position to make the judgement you've made.

The bottom line is that, for you, trading the underlying instrument via a direct market access broker is the way to go. And that's fine.
Tim.
I guess he would be able to trade a CFDs account in a corporate environment which is located somewhere in Europe.
 

SpreadBeta

Junior member
41 13
Any serious trader is trading the underlines at real stock and futures exchanges

CFD's and Spread Betting are good learning tools for the small trader

anything serious and your a real sucker(y)

In the UK if you are trading the underlines at real stock and futures exchanges is simply a way for you to ensure you pay 18-28% capital gains tax on any serious winnings. If HMRC decide you are doing it for a living then they may try to come after you for 40%+ rates of income tax .

Spread betting is slightly more expensive (as the SB Firms have to add their costs into the spread you are charged, including the 3% tax that they are charged on clients losses = their profits) however as there is no tax to pay on winnings in the UK (and no tax return to complete) they you have to be a "real sucker" not to use spread betting as you vehicle of choice !!
 

gle101

Veteren member
3,717 84
In the UK if you are trading the underlines at real stock and futures exchanges is simply a way for you to ensure you pay 18-28% capital gains tax on any serious winnings. If HMRC decide you are doing it for a living then they may try to come after you for 40%+ rates of income tax .

Spread betting is slightly more expensive (as the SB Firms have to add their costs into the spread you are charged, including the 3% tax that they are charged on clients losses = their profits) however as there is no tax to pay on winnings in the UK (and no tax return to complete) they you have to be a "real sucker" not to use spread betting as you vehicle of choice !!
Yes you are right, at least we have a choice (UK residents), which they don't have as a private person in the US.
 

CityMasterTrader

Member
77 2
In the UK if you are trading the underlines at real stock and futures exchanges is simply a way for you to ensure you pay 18-28% capital gains tax on any serious winnings. If HMRC decide you are doing it for a living then they may try to come after you for 40%+ rates of income tax .

Spread betting is slightly more expensive (as the SB Firms have to add their costs into the spread you are charged, including the 3% tax that they are charged on clients losses = their profits) however as there is no tax to pay on winnings in the UK (and no tax return to complete) they you have to be a "real sucker" not to use spread betting as you vehicle of choice !!

It’s true that SB is attractive from a tax point of view given that it is technically gambling, but it may not necessarily be for everyone. In some cases you may not be able to trade something via SB but you will be able to via CFDs as a leveraged alternative to the underlying. Also while SB does not involve a trading commission per se (built into spread) you do have to take into account the wider spread. It is the same with CFDs; the costs may be higher (commission, financing), but you are more likely to get a price closer to that of the market. It could be that the trade profit via CFDs even after paying some tax, still works out more than if you’d gone via SB. Also don’t forget that from the point of view of tax, this all presumes you win most of your trades. If you are honest and agree you’ll lose a fair few, what’s the point in being tax efficient but more expensive but if there is no tax payable. You’ll still have some losses to use against your gains. It’s not always as obvious as you think. Research both and use a proper comparison of all the elements involved.
 
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jkane

Active member
128 1
very hard to scalp using spread betting or cfd's..spreads to wide
 

gle101

Veteren member
3,717 84
Scalping is for degenerate gamblers. Scalping is trading for poor people who can't afford to hold a trade open for more than a day.
Quite many are scalping the futures on a professional level, but I understand the irony in your post. Scalping CFDs is quite clear harder to do, compared to scalping the futures. I think trading CFDs on a more longer time frame is to be preferred if trading CFDs.
 

jkane

Active member
128 1
only pros make money scalping and actually best way to be successful

Holding trades and you will get caught and eventually lose everything
 
 
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