A Dashing Blade
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I'd say none at all. Cetainly eSignal, in terms of charting functionality, kicks the sh*t out of bbg or reuters.
Combo, its not about being a "news trader", more about setting yourself up to prepare for as many circumstances as possible. Let me give you an example.
Trader Fred an experienced trader buys oil at $90 based on his studies, he puts in a stop at say $89 and a sell order at $92 to take profits. This seems all sensible and is, but then during the day the US announce they are sending huge military task force to sit on the edge of Iranian waters.
Should Fred be pleased that he has now sold Oil at $92, or kicking himself because he lost a real opportunity here because Oil actually spiked to over $100. At absolutely no further risk Fred gave up the opportunity to take an massive profit on his trade.
I can give you weekly examples of these kind of moves, so being WIRED IN is vitally important to all Serious Traders
Police,
He made his profit objective. If he can maintain his objectives, he’s successful. Isn’t this the skill rather than depending on unforeseen events (ala Taleb) or taking a flyer? One option would be close the majority of the position at target and let the rest ride with a trailing stop.
I always assume greater profit potential equals greater risk. What would you consider a good approach here?
Bramble,
Haven’t you got anything better to do?
Grant.
He made his profit objective. If he can maintain his objectives, he’s successful. Isn’t this the skill rather than depending on unforeseen events (ala Taleb) or taking a flyer? One option would be close the majority of the position at target and let the rest ride with a trailing stop.
I always assume greater profit potential equals greater risk. What would you consider a good approach here?
Bramble,
Haven’t you got anything better to do?
Grant.
trader_dante
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How does being wired in make any difference in this example? If fundamental information affects the market it will show up in the price first and therefore a trader that watches price action and reacts accordingly doesn't need to know what the news is to make money. You can give me a chart and I can make high probability trades in it without even knowing what market it is let alone what news is affecting it! Trader Freds problem (if he has one at all and your example doesn't make it clear he does) is in his trading not in his lack of communication...
its obvious to any serious trader that the sell at $92 was just an easy buy for every other wired in trader out there! The point is clearly that any trader worth his salt would have pulled the order - if Fred is not wired in he does not have the opportunity to pull his order.
Oh yeah, I forgot fred should be able to work all this out from the Charts and price action alone !!!:
Big Bucks can only be made by The Porfessional Attitude: there is no percentage reward in your approach Dante - and as for your previous note that the trader should be more in tune with his own mind than anything else - THATS FOR THE HIPPY TRADER
Oh yeah, I forgot fred should be able to work all this out from the Charts and price action alone !!!:
Big Bucks can only be made by The Porfessional Attitude: there is no percentage reward in your approach Dante - and as for your previous note that the trader should be more in tune with his own mind than anything else - THATS FOR THE HIPPY TRADER
Grant if you are a serous trader you will understand the scenario, its straightforward stuff. Sorry but read the whole thread and decide how you need to get yourself in tune with the markets in order to max out
trader_dante
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There is actually over a 2,000% reward in my approach - which is what my account is up so far since trading it.
You're entitled to your opinion and I respect that but I think you're very wrong.
Maybe I'm not making the BIG BUCKS you're talking about but my account is getting bigger and bigger every single week and I have no idea what the news is nor do I care for the most part.
When I took a trade like the FTSE long a few months back at a market bottom without knowing I was less than an hour away from a surprise rate cut, why didn't I pull my order when it started to go my way? Because the price was moving UP. I can assure you that entering on price action got me a lead on almost EVERY OTHER SINGLE TRADER THAT WAS "WIRED IN". How do I know that? Because I entered literally AT the market bottom.
The price will always tell you where the market is going - the news won't.
And as for your comment about the mind and hippy traders...I'm not talking about "far out" concepts I'm talking about maintaining discipline and preventing emotions taking over. Thats MIND CONTROL. And if you think its not relevant then you are 100% wrong. And thats not subjective. Thats a FACT.
Tom
It seems like the general opinion is that 90% lose money on trading, but who are the remaining 10% ? The banks, the hedgefunds, the so called professional traders ?
If Reuters are right about their predictions about the future, the professional traders will be history by 2015 ( at least 90% of them) and the banks and hedge funds will be left to milk the markets using super computers and algorithms. In case you didntn see the video from Reuters
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showthread.php?t=27279
I think its a quite scary scenario they line up in this video.
If Reuters are right about their predictions about the future, the professional traders will be history by 2015 ( at least 90% of them) and the banks and hedge funds will be left to milk the markets using super computers and algorithms. In case you didntn see the video from Reuters
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showthread.php?t=27279
I think its a quite scary scenario they line up in this video.
Trader333
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Future predictions in all formats are almost always wrong. If trading gets more and more computerised then in the end all you will have is one pc trading against another and any edge will therefore be lost. This is already being seen in certain circumstances and I would expect it to continue. Most of the models used by institutions work on extremely small edges with very large transaction power. If you read some of the posts from the likes of Grey1 then it is clear that individual traders are best off not trying to compete with the large institutions. Instead we should be trading in ways that they are just not able to make a decent enough profit from to consider and in my view there are plenty of ways to do that.
Paul
Shame, you obviuosly have talent, but are somewhat blinkered to the real world. Given your succesful style, its a shame you are not able to see and absorb what is put before you which could transcend you from being good trader to being a great trader !
Possibly the single worst thing I have ever read on T2W. Get a grip. How on earth is this supposed to work Yoda ? Trading with the Force and only the Force - great tactic !!
trader_dante
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LOL The single worst thing? What an honour.
What's wrong with all of you?
I just meant to say that once you have a strategy (and in my case that strategy is not reliant on a state of the art communications system) the only thing that holds you back is emotions.
To be "wired in" to your mind (and bear in mind I am using polices term) just involves being on the alert for emotions that will prove negative to your trading such as seeing a large move and chasing it being a result of greed or over leveraging and not wanting to see your stop hit, so constantly moving it away from the price being a result of fear.
nine
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OK. I guess I would consider that:
Broadband Cable + Dial backup
IB, execution+data
Sierra Chart, display & execution
backup mobile phone for cancellations if all else breaks
a couple of internet "announcements pages (to avoid news)"
wires me in, at least so far as my strategies are concerned.
Rhody Trader
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I totally agree. When it's institutions trading primarily trading with/against each other the volatility dries up, until something snaps and blows up all their nicely crafted models. There will always be opportunites for individuals to make money in the market. One just either needs to avoid playing in the arena of the big boys or find a way to take advantage of what they are doing.
Rhody Trader
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You keep throwing out terms of like "professional attitude" and "wired in" but despite having read this whole thread I'm still not entirely sure what you're talking about.
I'm going to toss out a guess on the "wired in" thing, though. Do you mean being aware of the news, events, related market price action, etc. so that you are able to frame any given price action and/or news event in your particular market as it comes across? The implication is that in your example a wired in trader would have had a good feel for the psychology of the market and would have been able to understand that the news item in question, at that specific point in time, would be a sufficiently impactful item to drive the market beyond the $92 target.
Do I hit the mark, or close to it?
Hoggums
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I think this idea of "max'ing out" is nonsense and an unachievable dream. Yes we'd all love to be able to pick the tops and bottoms but as any experienced trader knows - there is no certainty in the markets, it's a balancing act.
It's all about perceived risk versus perceived reward, there will come a point in a trade where you are in profit and looking at the charts you are not sure whether the trade will give up some of those profits or whether you'll go further into profit. It's at these points where you have to decide whether to get out - either scale out or close the trade completely.
I think you'll find that most successful traders don't try and max out their trades, as they are aware of the risks of doing so, instead they manage their risk so that when a trade goes beyond their pre-determined limits they'll close or hedge it regardless of whether they think it's max'ed out or not.
Also to make "Big Bucks" you have to risk Big Losses - there is no escape from this.
It's all about perceived risk versus perceived reward, there will come a point in a trade where you are in profit and looking at the charts you are not sure whether the trade will give up some of those profits or whether you'll go further into profit. It's at these points where you have to decide whether to get out - either scale out or close the trade completely.
I think you'll find that most successful traders don't try and max out their trades, as they are aware of the risks of doing so, instead they manage their risk so that when a trade goes beyond their pre-determined limits they'll close or hedge it regardless of whether they think it's max'ed out or not.
Also to make "Big Bucks" you have to risk Big Losses - there is no escape from this.
I agree, one of my friends is a daytrader through many years - he looks out of the window and see its suddenly snowing ( in Denmark ), and bught immediatly stocks in a Norwegian skee resort. (Last year with no snow.). That you cant program a computer to do .
.Rhody Trader
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I agree, one of my friends is a daytrader through many years - he looks out of the window and see its suddenly snowing ( in Denmark ), and bught immediatly stocks in a Norwegian skee resort. (Last year with no snow.). That you cant program a computer to do
Actually, you can. That's the latest thing among the algo trading set, apparently. They put news feeds through their systems looking for certain things to trigger trades. If they programmed the system to read weather headlines and react to them they could do that trade automatically. I'm not saying they do, but they could.
I think Maxing Out is about making the most of the opportunities presented. Clearly if its about being "perfect" then for sure its impossible from a trading point of view. But I do not think that is what was meant here.
Clearly, if you give yourself the best possible advantages (in anything in life) then you have increased your chances of success. That gentlemen is the underlying value that has been discussed here.
Would you take regressive steps if you found some new insight? I am sure you would not.
If you discovered charts help your style, would you then go without them?
If you had a great trade based on news (such as shorting the ftse during crisis events) would you then start to ignore news wires?
If a broking desk rang up to let u know they had seen huge orders to but Euros from the Saudis, would you just ignore that information and start pissing in wind by selling Euros or wait til your broker told you they have finished buying? Would you then decide that this kind of market specific information is irrelevant?
Gentleman, there is a lot going on in the markets and no one has perfect knowledge or perfect systems. But one should make best efforts to be as well prepared as one can
Some participants on this thread may not have many or only a few of these advantages - so, by definition they are disadvantaged
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