are traders programmed to FAIL ?

This is incorrect. Most people would not run from tigers, bears, or lions. By the time these animals are seen, the people are already dinner.

Rowlocks to that BJ............(n)

Further -one might add...:(y):clap:
(copied from Futex site - via "Daddyjohn" biog. on T2W)

Inbox Education | Futex

"The Psychology behind the Old Adage

As traders we have all heard the old saying "cut your losses and run your profits" countless times. It is one of those pieces of advice that is both simple and logical, and yet frustratingly hard to implement for the majority of those actually trading.

Today, we want to look at this problem from a psychological perspective. We know by its very nature that the market moves up and down - or to be more mathematical, reverts to the mean - much of the time. As a result of this, when new traders find themselves on the wrong side of the market and losing, they hope at some point that it will come back. The flipside of this, of course, is that if they are on the right side and winning, they worry that it may turn and that they may give some, or worse, all of their profits back. The reason it is so hard to overcome this mindset is because it has been programmed into us. As one trading psychologist wrote, this problem is due to the fact that we are "taught" from an early age that:

a) If we lose something it will eventually come back (e.g. If you lose your car keys, do not worry, they will eventually turn up)
b) If you see something, take it or you might lose the chance (e.g. If you see money lying in the street, pick it up quickly because it may not be there for long)

And so these attitudes translate into our trading. However, to be a good trader requires going against what we have had ingrained in us. It often requires going against what both our heads and our hearts tell us. The real reason trading is so hard is that we need to reverse how we think: when trades are going against us we should be fearful not hopeful; when trades are moving in our favour we should be hopeful rather than fearful.

So how do we manage to do this?

One of the ways to remain disciplined in taking your losses is simply to pick a point before you place a trade that, if the market hits it, proves you are wrong in your analysis. Once this is chosen, you should never, ever, move your stop further away. Many novice traders choose a stop and then as the market moves towards it they manage to convince themselves that the market will turn after their stop is hit and therefore justify moving it further away. It is important to remember that the market has a way of frustrating every trader, but the greatest traders are flexible. If you are wrong in the short term, close your position and wait on the sidelines where you can see clearly until the market moves in the direction you thought it would. Timing is everything when you are trying to make a living do this. If your timing is wrong, then you need to take action and prevent losses. Sometimes the market may give you another chance but you can bet the time you need it to most, is the time you will not be given it!

So, that's how you should cut losses. How about letting profits run?

If you are in a situation where the position you have taken is significantly in profit, take a minute to sit quietly and think rationally. You need to focus on the fundamental thing that your position is now telling you i.e. you have called the market correctly. A key thing to remember in winning trades is that being up should not be a justification for getting out. This means that you should not look at your P&L and then begin to look for reasons to exit your trade. It all comes back to having a trading plan. A trader that wants to succeed needs to constantly remind themselves why they took the trade in the first place, where they originally thought the market was going to go and as a result, whether the reasons for still being in it are valid.

Successful traders are able to accept they are wrong and make the situation right by getting out but at the same time they are able to see when they are right and can fully maximise their opportunities by holding on with the strength of their convictions. "

:smart::love:
 
I am not convinced you have a real deal. In fact I am not convinced there are any real deals around here. I infer this from the complete lack of any generosity at all from people. Forums of all kinds usually offer value within a matter of minutes. I have to say I gained pratically nothing after 3 months of being here. Although there is some entertainment here playing with the BS'er. Unlike other type of forums, there are a lot of them here.

It was obvious from the day you joined that all you wanted to do was sponge off people. People gave you what you needed to know rather than what you demanded to know and because of this lack of 'generosity' you dismissed them as being unable to trade. That is like inferring someone is broke if they don't give you money simply because you demanded it.

You got exactly what you deserved, nothing! This is poetic justice :LOL:

Now begone...beggar!:LOL:
 
It was obvious from the day you joined that all you wanted to do was sponge off people.

Don't flatter yourself. You have nothing worth sponge off of.

Normally when I join a forum, I do it to learn something new. If that's sponging, so be it. But I can honest say I sponged zero off you. Based on your psychological profile, I am not interested in what you have got, assuming you have anything at all.

You got exactly what you deserved, nothing! This is poetic justice

Actually, I got plenty as a consequence of knowing there's not much here. It helped me to look inwards and realise there's plenty more there. Both my prunning and fruit picking strategies were developed after I began to look inwards.
 
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Don't flatter yourself. You have nothing worth sponge off of.

Normally when I join a forum, I do it to learn something new. If thta's sponging, so be it. But I can honest say I sponged zero off you. Based on your psychological profile, I am not interested in what you have got, assuming you have anything at all.

Correct.
 
Perhaps you should look at yourself. You expect some generosity, yet I've only seen negative posts from you. That doesn't engender generosity from others. There's enough on the forum to help you trade if you look. And there are enough posters who can give you good advice.

+1. Totally Agree. I have come to view Beginner Joes posts as the "Negative Nelly" of every single situation.

If you find no value here then WHY ARE YOU HERE? Go entertain yourself elsewhere. Perhaps a strip joint?...At least the women there will ACT like they give a sh** what you have to say.
 
+1. Totally Agree. I have come to view Beginner Joes posts as the "Negative Nelly" of every single situation.

If you find no value here then WHY ARE YOU HERE? Go entertain yourself elsewhere. Perhaps a strip joint?...At least the women there will ACT like they give a sh** what you have to say.

:LOL::LOL::LOL:

Peter
 
This is bollox. Everything we do is based on established knowledge gained through education and experience.

Incorrect. Please reproduce, observe and report back


Saying traders are programmed to fail is no different than saying to students they will never become professionals.

Not really - humans are wired a certain way. Some of this wiring is counter-productive when applied to the trading endeavour.

What a load of toss. Given the right education and allow time for experience, there is nothing stopping people from success in this business. It's a function of education and experience as is all skills in life. The problem for people not privy to knowledge is the ocean of scammers and useless information and guidance available to support progress. It has nothing to do with being programmed to fail, period.

On second thoughts - don't reproduce.
 
Incorrect. Please reproduce, observe and report back




Not really - humans are wired a certain way. Some of this wiring is counter-productive when applied to the trading endeavour.



On second thoughts - don't reproduce.

You finished throwing your toys out your cot?
 
You finished throwing your toys out your cot?

Are you finished seeing what you want to see?

Confirmation bias – the tendency to search for or interpret information in a way that confirms one's preconceptions
 
Allow me to elaborate

"This is bollox. Everything we do is based on established knowledge gained through education and experience."

Any parent, especially a male parent of a female child will be able to point out the error in this way of thinking. It is common for an academic non-parent to think that a child is an empty canvas onto which a parent can paint a personality. In fact, there is much we are born with and the ability to shape an individual is quite limited. When you have a child of the opposite sex, you realise how many attributes of that opposite sex are built in and nothing to do at all with nurture.

And so it is, that we are born with cognitive bias that do not help at all with trading where you zre wrong when you are wrong no matter how right you tell yourself you are.
 
You sugar coat trading with psychological horse cr@p which you seem to convey relevance to everyone. The humorous aspect to your standpoint is the familiarity with fortune telling. It's a simpletons mentality that comforts oneself when things go wrong. If I must be honest I really don't care to debate this with you. It's like arguing with a priest about good and evil. So whatever floats your boat man you're absolutely right!
 
I think you are both right. we are all programmed from birth to a certain extent we then build up layers of education and experience which shape us.

Allow me to elaborate

"This is bollox. Everything we do is based on established knowledge gained through education and experience."

Any parent, especially a male parent of a female child will be able to point out the error in this way of thinking. It is common for an academic non-parent to think that a child is an empty canvas onto which a parent can paint a personality. In fact, there is much we are born with and the ability to shape an individual is quite limited. When you have a child of the opposite sex, you realise how many attributes of that opposite sex are built in and nothing to do at all with nurture.

And so it is, that we are born with cognitive bias that do not help at all with trading where you zre wrong when you are wrong no matter how right you tell yourself you are.
 
If you find no value here then WHY ARE YOU HERE?

Well, I am attempting to extract value by coersion since passive value seeking is not working. If there is still nothing then I can be absolutely sure there really is nothing. Everything points to extremely slim pickings so far.
 
The evolutionary programming of human beings is absolutely inimical to success at trading.

People are programmed to fail at trading, without question.
 
I am not convinced you have a real deal. In fact I am not convinced there are any real deals around here. I infer this from the complete lack of any generosity at all from people. Forums of all kinds usually offer value within a matter of minutes. I have to say I gained pratically nothing after 3 months of being here. Although there is some entertainment here playing with the BS'er. Unlike other type of forums, there are a lot of them here.

Ok cool. You are getting close to your answer. No one is the real deal, which is more than likely true.
 
Why do people gamble at a casino knowing the odds are against them and why do some people become addicted why others don't?

Gambling isn't a level comparison because the rules and odds are unparalleled. The reason card counting is illegal is the same reason trading cannot be compared. The similarities in a persons' the brain behaviour however is apparent when the trader doesn't understand odds. In this case, it is no different than casino gambling where the odds are stacked against you and your perception of risk is anaesthetised.

The problem is the majority of you don't understand odds and subsequently employ weak strategies. A typical trader in this category experiences winning streaks followed by disasters. This is no different from casino gamblers stuck in the expectations of rewards with emotional highs and lows.

So to answer your statement in disagreement. People gamble and people trade for the same reasons. People fail at trading because they don't understand odds which is rectified by education and experience. People fail at gambling because they have no advantage over odds within the rules of the game. Addition has nothing to do with the underlying reasons people fail. The addiction comes from expectations of rewards.
 
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Card Counting is not illegal

Understanding odds is not the primary reason behind people "failing" (i.e. give up) at trading

The people that gamble (compulsively) don't do it for the same reasons as the people that trade (profitably). They are polar opposites.

(not against you forker, you're an OK bloke)
 
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