What Markets Are You Interested In?

[TexasRangersFan]

Speculative Risk: Three possible outcomes exist in speculative risk: something good (gain), something bad (loss) or nothing (staying even). Gambling and investing in the stock market are two examples of speculative risks. Each offers a chance to make money, lose money or walk away even. Again, do not equate gambling and investing on any other level than as both being a speculative risk..

Gambling is designed to enrich one party (the house); the odds are always in its favor. Investing is designed to enrich all involved, the house that set up the “game” AND those that chose to place money in the game


all participants with “skin in the game” win or lose together. Speculative risk is not insurable in the traditional insurance market; there are other means to hedge speculative risk such as diversification and derivatives.

Nice analogy.

 

[ffsear]

Hi ffsear,
And if it really is that much easier than other markets, then my advice is to ramp up your stakes and make hay while the sun shines - because I suspect it won't shine for very long!
;-)
Tim.

Firstly, I'm not saying its easier then other markets. I just saying you have more information to work with. Volume and Market depth. As apposed to a just a price and a fancy chart which you can drawn lines on. Then siting around and wait for a magic "pin Bar" or what ever price action pattern you've decided has magical powers.

Go to any day trading prob house in London. They don't trade like that.

Regarding upping your stakes, its not as easy as that. There is only a limited amount of money matched on each betfair market. £100 is easy to get matched. £2000, not so much. Betfair is a real market, a real exchange. I'm not betting against the house! You can't simply up your stakes if the liquidity inst there.

 

[ffsear]

I think you are very harsh. How can it possibly go wrong, risking £25 to win £12.50 and getting a 50% return every week on your money all aided by a program that costs £6 a month aimed to bring more people to a pool that is not bottomless?

I am pretty sure that compounded he will soon stop posting and be living in Monaco.

Where you getting these figures from? Are you assuming I have a 100% strike rate?

As i stated i made £600 last week. Risking £25 per race, over 126 racers = total risked = £3150.

£600 profit would be a return of £19%

As for you comments about compounding. If you truly knew how the betfair exchange works, you'd know that its not possible.

 

[NickBk]

Where you getting these figures from? Are you assuming I have a 100% strike rate?

As i stated i made £600 last week. Risking £25 per race, over 126 racers = total risked = £3150.

£600 profit would be a return of £19%

As for you comments about compounding. If you truly knew how the betfair exchange works, you'd know that its not possible.

You stated that on Thursday you had made £600 so I made the radical assumption that you it was £150 a day and that there were three more betting days this week.

7*150 =1050 is 52.5%

I know how Betfair and betting works probably many many times more than you do. This is the reason I said ''all aided by a program that costs £6 a month aimed to bring more people to a pool that is not bottomless''

Look I have no wish to argue with you but you are deluded to think it is radically different to day trading Dax at £2 a point, which you admit is not your thing.

I was trading the DAX. But i've found it impossible this year. Migrant Crisis, EBC ******s, Brexit, Oil tanking. Its just too unstable. Now we've got more QE and another interest rate cut??? Its getting rediculous. Let's take one from here, Oil tanking, if you know that then you are allowed to short it too.

Look I probably should have passed by when I first saw this but as someone who has extensive experience of all forms of gambling and know a lot about Betfair from day one, I just thought it was funny to go from Dax and claim the solution is now laying horses.

Good luck to you and I hope you continue to clean up and come back in a year with great results.

 

[hhiusa]

As I said before bedding is tantamount to playing a fixed game that enriches one party. My intention for this thread was to discuss investing and markets which are meant to enrich both parties.

People keep mentioning indices and only indices here. Are any of you treating index futures or just Index CFDs?

@NickBk
I noticed in the pool that you said you trade the Hong Kong markets? You also said you do not like equities. What are you trading there?

 

[NickBk]

As I said before bedding is tantamount to playing a fixed game that enriches one party. My intention for this thread was to discuss investing and markets which are meant to enrich both parties.

People keep mentioning indices and only indices here. Are any of you treating index futures or just Index CFDs?

@NickBk
I noticed in the pool that you said you trade the Hong Kong markets? You also said you do not like equities. What are you trading there?

HangSeng Index

 

[tar]

Ffsear's point is he wants to trade on an exchange rather than spread betting , so for now he chose horses until he comes back later and trade futures in an exchange .

 

[tar]

The whole poll is wrong , when you ask what markets are you interested in , you dont divide answers by regions but rather by asset classes ( indices , fx , bonds , commodities ... ) .

 

[piphoe]

I'm always learning about new markets and opportunities and more I learn the more I realize how much I don't know. A very humbling experience this profession we've chosen for ourselves.

 

[ffsear]

Ffsear's point is he wants to trade on an exchange rather than spread betting , so for now he chose horses until he comes back later and trade futures in an exchange .

Thankyou! At least someone has a brain

 

[hhiusa]

Spread betting is only one small aspect of the financial world. Most financial instruments are traded on exchanges. Let's see here the NYSE, NASDAQ, LSE. You do not have to spread bet.

 

[ffsear]

Spread betting is only one small aspect of the financial world. Most financial instruments are traded on exchanges. Let's see here the NYSE, NASDAQ, LSE. You do not have to spread bet.

I don't think there is a problem using spread betting as a way to take a position in a market. I just think it suicide to use only the spreadbetting platform to make your entry and exit decisions. A trader needs more data. A program like Market Delta ( http://www.marketdelta.com/products/trader).

Drawing lines on a spread betting charts is just guess work trading in my opinion.

Say you have a nice S/R level. You have no idea how much money/contracts have been traded at that level. You have no idea how strong that level is. Other programs will provide you with volume at price, Depth of market, Institutional blocks. and much more. SB platforms provide none of this! I wonder why??

Instead you get crap like this...;

YEA!! trade with us! Its soo easy you only need a mobile phone. Plus you'll be rich and pulling super models like this.... Yea yea bollox!!


Sorry if this goes again the T2W agenda (lets face it, every single advert on this site of is for a spread betting company. As i writei'm looking at adverts for CMC, City Index and Spread CO!)

 

[ffsear]

I just thought it was funny to go from Dax and claim the solution is now laying horses.

.

I'm lot laying horses. Nor have i said that. I'm trading pre race horse odds moments. This involves both backing and laying the same horse and trying to capitalize on the pre race price moment for a profit before the race even starts, regardless where it comes in the race.

Laying horse is simply backing a horse to lose. Thats an open bet and a million miles away from what i'm doing.

 

[NickBk]

I'm lot laying horses. Nor have i said that. I'm trading pre race horse odds moments. This involves both backing and laying the same horse and trying to capitalize on the pre race price moment for a profit before the race even starts, regardless where it comes in the race.

Laying horse is simply backing a horse to lose. Thats an open bet and a million miles away from what i'm doing.

I don't trade the Dax I just open and close positions based on the Dax, futures too.

What you are doing is now trading in less efficient markets with little depth.
As I said already I shouldn't have posted but because you didn't make it in one area you are now going for £12.50 a race on the gee gees.

It seems that your are just putting of the inevitable and that you and speculation are not a happy couple.
If it was now just a matter of market depth and real exchanges I am sure a smart guy like who that found a horses software package for £6 a month, that will transform your financial life, surely could find a way to get that great market data you seek and use those nuggets to clean up with spread bettors or exchanges.

It seems to me that you just like the slow bleed of failure and you found a new way to do it. How much do Betfair take off each winning bet, oh sorry trade? I know the answer but the point is they are the house and a casino takes less on most games.

Good luck in your new endeavour I am sure you have it cracked this time.

 

[ffsear]

I don't trade the Dax I just open and close positions based on the Dax, futures too.

What you are doing is now trading in less efficient markets with little depth.
As I said already I shouldn't have posted but because you didn't make it in one area you are now going for £12.50 a race on the gee gees.

It seems that your are just putting of the inevitable and that you and speculation are not a happy couple.
If it was now just a matter of market depth and real exchanges I am sure a smart guy like who that found a horses software package for £6 a month, that will transform your financial life, surely could find a way to get that great market data you seek and use those nuggets to clean up with spread bettors or exchanges.

It seems to me that you just like the slow bleed of failure and you found a new way to do it. How much do Betfair take off each winning bet, oh sorry trade? I know the answer but the point is they are the house and a casino takes less on most games.

Good luck in your new endeavour I am sure you have it cracked this time.

Yea ok mate! You just sound depressed to me!

people can't do somthing themselves, they wanna tell you that you can't do it.


Give me one piece of evidence as to why i should take any of your advice!

 

[hhiusa]

I don't trade the Dax I just open and close positions based on the Dax, futures too.

What you are doing is now trading in less efficient markets with little depth.
As I said already I shouldn't have posted but because you didn't make it in one area you are now going for £12.50 a race on the gee gees.

It seems that your are just putting of the inevitable and that you and speculation are not a happy couple.
If it was now just a matter of market depth and real exchanges I am sure a smart guy like who that found a horses software package for £6 a month, that will transform your financial life, surely could find a way to get that great market data you seek and use those nuggets to clean up with spread bettors or exchanges.

It seems to me that you just like the slow bleed of failure and you found a new way to do it. How much do Betfair take off each winning bet, oh sorry trade? I know the answer but the point is they are the house and a casino takes less on most games.

Good luck in your new endeavour I am sure you have it cracked this time.

It definitely has less depth not more depth than financial exchanges. It is in effect a less efficient form of spread betting. It takes an already "bollox" idea and makes it worse.

I will stick with my traditional full service firm.

 

[Erasmus]

What you are doing is now trading in less efficient markets...

Isn't that exactly what you want, if you know what you're doing?

 

[NickBk]

Isn't that exactly what you want, if you know what you're doing?

If know what you are doing is trying to make £12.50 a race and using a £6 program from the internet then maybe.

It is not efficient in a way that can be used to the posters advantage.

 

[ffsear]

If know what you are doing is trying to make £12.50 a race and using a £6 program from the internet then maybe.

It is not efficient in a way that can be used to the posters advantage.

Sorry, what is your issue with this £6 program?

 

[NickBk]

Yea ok mate! You just sound depressed to me!

people can't do somthing themselves, they wanna tell you that you can't do it.


Give me one piece of evidence as to why i should take any of your advice!

Do you think calling me depressed is a decent retort? I should have many times stopped answering to you but hey I am a sucker and I will try one last time.

I do hope you do not have people in this life relying on you to provide for them, now that would be depressing.

Your plan seems so brilliant why restrict yourself to £12.50?

I agree with you about spread betting and using phones tablets etc and I also think the way the high streets in the UK have allowed themselves to be infested with betting shops is a disgrace and fleecing the unwary on their FOBT's.

Spread betting is a step up for a middle aged guy with a spare bedroom to convince him he can trade like the big guys on his laptop or whatever. The problem is two fold, a lack of general preparation and education and then the leverage offered is dynamite in most hands.

You commented like laying/trading on betfair is so far removed and upmarket from s/b, that is what got me chuckling and writing. It is not in any way better.

As for you, I do not know you at all of course and I can only judge by some of your posts and make assumptions. It seems if you struggled on small stakes at spread betting that unless you change something you will have no more success at betfair or in fact if you had the money to trade on the big exchanges. It is all the same exercise and you can find as much information as you need in the internet today to trade your s/b acc like an exchange account. The fact you did not is an indicator that you will just bleed away again and probably look for another way to slowly do your dough.

Look carry on and I will now refrain from commenting further and I look forward to an update in 3 months about how much you made. Though if there are any bookmakers out there who will lay me odds I might be inclined to bet against you.

Good luck.