Different or Better?

[wasp]

It seems to me Trendie, and sorry if wrong, but you still seem to be looking for the holy grail...

Live, learn and adapt, there is no right or wrong, only what is... trade what makes you money but learn at the same time every day till it becomes obvious. As crass as it is, one day you ill have your 'neo at the end of the matrix' moment and you will stop looking for answers, timeframes, sure fire things and trade what you see happening and melt all the boundaries that the books write of... there is no 'way', only sheep, acting the same over...

Couple of Bruce Lee's quotes always stick with me....

“If you always put limit on everything you do, physical or anything else. It will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them.”

“I fear not the man who has practised 10,000 kicks once, but I fear the man who has practiced one kick 10,000 times.”

Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless - like water. Now you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup, you put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle, you put it in a teapot, it becomes the teapot. Now water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend.”

“All fixed set patterns are incapable of adaptability or pliability. The truth is outside of all fixed patterns.”

 

[rols]

It seems to me Trendie, and sorry if wrong, but you still seem to be looking for the holy grail...

Live, learn and adapt, there is no right or wrong, only what is... trade what makes you money but learn at the same time every day till it becomes obvious.
[/COLOR]

Wise words indeed. Take a look at Wasp's charts for clarity of thought.

When a trader is at that 'nearly' stage of mastery I suspect he still is wondering what others are doing because his ego is still concerned about being 'right' or 'wrong'. The market doesn't care about me or you it just 'is'. And that is how we must be. To much self conscious awareness blocks our ability to 'feel' the market on a sub conscious level, the level where emotion and ego are absent.

On the subject of pin bars, Timeframes, moving averages etc. I felt I had taken a big step forward when I switched to trading a line chart without indicators. Any info on the chart is what I draw in, nothing less nothing more. Bit like removing the water wings.

 

[Paul71]

Wise words indeed. Take a look at Wasp's charts for clarity of thought.

When a trader is at that 'nearly' stage of mastery I suspect he still is wondering what others are doing because his ego is still concerned about being 'right' or 'wrong'. The market doesn't care about me or you it just 'is'. And that is how we must be. To much self conscious awareness blocks our ability to 'feel' the market on a sub conscious level, the level where emotion and ego are absent.

On the subject of pin bars, Timeframes, moving averages etc. I felt I had taken a big step forward when I switched to trading a line chart without indicators. Any info on the chart is what I draw in, nothing less nothing more. Bit like removing the water wings.

Nice post.

My view, is that all traders need to find thier own 'autopilot'. This is the individuals comfort zone where evrything clicks and very little conscious thinking is needed, this itself is different for everyone.

 

[DaxDestroyer]

Trading successfully is as easy as it gets IF:
- you have an edge
- you trust yourself
- you are not afraid to lose as no edge has a 100% win rate
- you made a plan how to use your edge
- you perform your plan
- you know when to stop (the position and the plan)

IF this is not the case, trading successfully is close to impossible

The Holy Grail lies in YOURSELF That is the trick.

Most people do more research before they buy a cellphone than before putting on trades.
This is why they fail.

Just my 2 cents

 

[hwsteele]

The Holy Grail lies in YOURSELF That is the trick.


Just my 2 cents

That is the biggest truth in trading! In fact in anything that you do.
If you are willing to get an education, do the work, and most important GET BACK UP WHEN YOU FALL EVERY TIME, you WILL succeed in what ever you do.

You don't have to go to school for the education but you do need to have a "top shelf" understanding of what ever it is you want to do and how it works.
To get that in trading YOU have to put the WORK in.
As you are doing that you WILL FAIL over and over but as long as you have learned from each failure you are getting closer to that special moment. As long as you keep getting back up you WILL get to that moment.

The point when it clicks and suddenly you are no longer looking out to others for answers and you start looking in to YOUR SELF is wonderful.
That IS the MOMENT!
When that happens you won't keep looking back over "trades that went bad" as you will understand that those just don't exist.
When you get to that point you will understand that using pin bars, or trendlines, or support and resistance, or even time cycles is only better for you when YOU decide that they are better.
You have to answer that question for yourself.
Thing is, what ever you decide the answer is, you will always be right.

ALL IMHO

 

[trader_dante]

Trendie, if you are happy with your system then continue to trade it with real money but if you think you can do better, then what is the harm of demoing something else alongside?

Forget what these mugs say about them. "Pin bars are too simplistic". "Ignore them, they don't work" Blah, blah, blah.

Just take any market from carbon emissions to the S&P500. Stick it on the hourly TF. Start off by taking every single pin bar that you see regardless of where it appears. Put the stop beneath it.

Don't move your stop until it hits the first s/r pivot.

When it hits the first s/r pivot, move your stop to breakeven.

Then just trail your stop below the low of every single candle that closes above a pivot if you are long or above the high of every single candle that closes beneath a pivot if you are short.

Once the stop has been moved once, don't move the stop again until it closes through the next pivot etc.

There is absolutely no way, whatsoever, that you will not make money.

Plus you will outdo most of the people on here.

I guarantee this.

Why is everyone not making money if it's this simple? Because somehow they f*ck it up. They don't put their stop in the right place, they can't identify the s/r pivots, they move their stop too quick. They take their profits as they are afraid they will give them back. You know, the usual suspects.

But the proof is in the pudding. Try it and see.

 

[Paul71]

Trendie, if you are happy with your system then continue to trade it with real money but if you think you can do better, then what is the harm of demoing something else alongside?

Forget what these mugs say about them. "Pin bars are too simplistic". "Ignore them, they don't work" Blah, blah, blah.

Just take any market from carbon emissions to the S&P500. Stick it on the hourly TF. Start off by taking every single pin bar that you see regardless of where it appears. Put the stop beneath it.

Don't move your stop until it hits the first s/r pivot.

When it hits the first s/r pivot, move your stop to breakeven.

Then just trail your stop below the low of every single candle that closes above a pivot if you are long or above the high of every single candle that closes beneath a pivot if you are short.

Once the stop has been moved once, don't move the stop again until it closes through the next pivot etc.

There is absolutely no way, whatsoever, that you will not make money.

Plus you will outdo most of the people on here.

I guarantee this.

Why is everyone not making money if it's this simple? Because somehow they f*ck it up. They don't put their stop in the right place, they can't identify the s/r pivots, they move their stop too quick. They take their profits as they are afraid they will give them back. You know, the usual suspects.

But the proof is in the pudding. Try it and see.

Tom,

You are right on the money. I'll be totally honest and go one step further, 4hr charts, even dailies, the higher TF's hold more 'information'. People automatically assume day trading is about the low TFs. If a person is savvy enough, 4hr momentum trades over the year can double thier account easily, just playing one market.



Bet you never thought i'd agree with you in public did you.



Good trading, mate.

 

[trader_dante]

Tom,

You are right on the money. I'll be totally honest and go one step further, 4hr charts, even dailies, the higher TF's hold more 'information'. People automatically assume day trading is about the low TFs. If a person is savvy enough, 4hr momentum trades over the year can double thier account easily, just playing one market.



Bet you never thought i'd agree with you in public did you.



Good trading, mate.

I do a lot of other types of trades. Often I like to play inside bars for the volatility expansion that naturally follows. Sometimes I trade a double top formation when price comes into it, with a tight stop. Sometimes I trade a breakout again with a tight stop. Sometimes, I hit market when price breaks support or resistance and comes back for the retest. Once in a blue moon, I watch the order flow for a heads up on the next few ticks. But at the end of the day, pin bars make money and all my big winners come from, yes you guessed it, pin bars. But I trade them on the hourly and I trade them on the daily. That's the only two timeframes I look at. I'm often gobsmacked that there aren't more people out there making money. But then, when I taught it specifically on the hourly and daily and I see people orgasming because they have just spotted one on the 5m, I'm not suprised. People can't follow rules. And when you can't follow a clear set of rules to make you money...well...

 

[trendie]

It seems to me Trendie, and sorry if wrong, but you still seem to be looking for the holy grail...

Live, learn and adapt, there is no right or wrong, only what is... trade what makes you money but learn at the same time every day till it becomes obvious. As crass as it is, one day you ill have your 'neo at the end of the matrix' moment and you will stop looking for answers, timeframes, sure fire things and trade what you see happening and melt all the boundaries that the books write of... there is no 'way', only sheep, acting the same over...

Couple of Bruce Lee's quotes always stick with me....

“If you always put limit on everything you do, physical or anything else. It will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them.”

“I fear not the man who has practised 10,000 kicks once, but I fear the man who has practiced one kick 10,000 times.”

Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless - like water. Now you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup, you put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle, you put it in a teapot, it becomes the teapot. Now water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend.”

“All fixed set patterns are incapable of adaptability or pliability. The truth is outside of all fixed patterns.”

am I looking for the Holy Grail? perhaps.

I understand its a numbers game. And that I have an edge. And that success is to be viewed over many, many trades to glean a meaningful analysis.
I am actually happy with this. and with my trading. (mostly)

Its just that I feel that there is a level of understanding that I am perhaps missing.
Your new thread addresses some of my issues.
(I am in the "it makes money, get on with it", camp. But I know I am being lazy, by not trying to learn more by it.)

I can make money. But, despite this, I wonder if I am just lucky. There is another level of information or insight that I am missing.

Is it because I want to make more money? perhaps.
Is it because I want to truly undertand the mechanism that causes markets to move?
I think this is also true for me.

Maybe, if I really look deeply into it, its because I still pull my punches after a sequence of losses, and start to reduce my profit targets. when I should stick to the original targets.
Despite being a trend-follower, some part of me still hates the idea of missing the top and the bottom.
Maybe a part of me still wants to be right, rather than simply profitable.
Its to do with having mastery of my subject.

By the way, thanks for all the supportive replies. esp Squirrel25, and Paul71s succinct replies.

 

[trader_dante]

One other thing I would add is that the biggest irony of it all, in my opinion, is that people look for them on the lower timeframes because they don't like the bigger stop associated with the bigger timeframes.

Then they proceed to p*ss away the same amount of money, only it takes them a little longer.

 

[Paul71]

I do a lot of other types of trades. Often I like to play inside bars for the volatility expansion that naturally follows. Sometimes I trade a double top formation when price comes into it, with a tight stop. Sometimes I trade a breakout again with a tight stop. Sometimes, I hit market when price breaks support or resistance and comes back for the retest. Once in a blue moon, I watch the order flow for a heads up on the next few ticks. But at the end of the day, pin bars make money and all my big winners come from, yes you guessed it, pin bars. But I trade them on the hourly and I trade them on the daily. That's the only two timeframes I look at. I'm often gobsmacked that there aren't more people out there making money. But then, when I taught it specifically on the hourly and daily and I see people orgasming because they have just spotted one on the 5m, I'm not suprised. People can't follow rules. And when you can't follow a clear set of rules to make you money...well...

Sound mate. You know, i only took the mick out of pinbars because....well i think you know why, so many people posting about them. The reality is they offer an insight into what's going on within the market, and in the right hands a very powerful trading technique.

 

[Paul71]

am I looking for the Holy Grail? perhaps.

I understand its a numbers game. And that I have an edge. And that success is to be viewed over many, many trades to glean a meaningful analysis.
I am actually happy with this. and with my trading. (mostly)

Its just that I feel that there is a level of understanding that I am perhaps missing.
Your new thread addresses some of my issues.
(I am in the "it makes money, get on with it", camp. But I know I am being lazy, by not trying to learn more by it.)

I can make money. But, despite this, I wonder if I am just lucky. There is another level of information or insight that I am missing.

Is it because I want to make more money? perhaps.
Is it because I want to truly undertand the mechanism that causes markets to move?
I think this is also true for me.

Maybe, if I really look deeply into it, its because I still pull my punches after a sequence of losses, and start to reduce my profit targets. when I should stick to the original targets.
Despite being a trend-follower, some part of me still hates the idea of missing the top and the bottom.
Maybe a part of me still wants to be right, rather than simply profitable.
Its to do with having mastery of my subject.

By the way, thanks for all the supportive replies. esp Squirrel25, and Paul71s succinct replies.

No probs.

You're probably 'thinking' to much Trendie, if i were you, i'd stop taking what you have got for granted, and start using it to it's full potential. Have you ever seen the film, Rain Man? Someone like him could be posting bloody trades on here, we're all watching and thinking, "i really need to come up to scratch". What i'm trying to say is that there are different levels of proficiency,......i'm just glad i'm at the sh!te end of the spectrum that actually makes money.

 

[trendie]

No probs.

You're probably 'thinking' to much Trendie, if i were you, i'd stop taking what you have got for granted, and start using it to it's full potential. Have you ever seen the film, Rain Man? Someone like him could be posting bloody trades on here, we're all watching and thinking, "i really need to come up to scratch". What i'm trying to say is that there are different levels of proficiency,......i'm just glad i'm at the sh!te end of the spectrum that actually makes money.

thinking too much!!
goodness, that takes me back to my earliest days of trading!

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/sale/13585-brain-sale.html

 

[wasp]

..... I have an edge. I am actually happy with this. and with my trading. (mostly)

---------

Is it because I want to truly understand the mechanism that causes markets to move?
I think this is also true for me.

Be honest with yourself and choose, if you just want a living, shut and get on with it, if you want to truly understand and be a 'darksider', do it on the side whilst earning a living, only you know what you really want from the markets....

 

[Paul71]

thinking too much!!
goodness, that takes me back to my earliest days of trading!

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/sale/13585-brain-sale.html

The days before Soco attacked someone with 500 purple words of wisdom.