Why does the eventual accumulation of pertinent knowledge translate so slowly into one's trading results? If we are capable of weeding out the good stuff from the bad, why doesn't the good stuff just take over and guide us directly towards success?
What is pertinent knowledge ?
I suppose it depends upon what you mean by 'Pertinent knowledge'. There are different forms of knowledge. One is knowledge of facts, such as you might obtain within a book or course on trading or via these pages. This is, for most people,, relatively quick to obtain.
The other is based on application of the first knowledge through experience. This takes longer to achieve because it involves doing and lots of doing. It may well involve making mistakes,. adjusting and re-doing.
Furthermore this second kind of knowledge involves dealing with who you are and may involve the removal of self-sabotaging mechanisms at play. This, for most people, takes longer.
Charlton
Superflysuperfly said:
I suppose it depends upon what you mean by 'Pertinent knowledge'. There are different forms of knowledge. One is knowledge of facts, such as you might obtain within a book or course on trading or via these pages. This is, for most people,, relatively quick to obtain.
The other is based on application of the first knowledge through experience. This takes longer to achieve because it involves doing and lots of doing. It may well involve making mistakes,. adjusting and re-doing.
Furthermore this second kind of knowledge involves dealing with who you are and may involve the removal of self-sabotaging mechanisms at play. This, for most people, takes longer.
Charlton
Thanks for your answer.Charlton said:
By pertinent knowledge I mean everything that will enable you to play your targetmarket and strategy better.
However in my opinion the pivotal word in the text of the elitetraderposter illiquid is not pertinent, but so slowly.
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dbphoenix
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superfly said:
"So slowly" because you're dealing not with "knowledge" but with information. It is the process of converting that information into knowledge that can take so much time, though there are now shortcuts available -- technological and psychological -- that can reduce the amount of time generally required.
As to illiquid's post, you didn't quote it, so I don't know what you're referring to.
Db
I like the way illiquid phrases common issues.
The full text im refering to:
Like I've said before, I've seen as much so-called wisdom over the years that I've eventually learned to hold as inviolate truth, as that which should be thrown out with yesterday's garbage. Yet why does the eventual accumulation of pertinent knowledge translate so slowly into one's trading results? If we are capable of weeding out the good stuff from the bad, why doesn't the good stuff just take over and guide us directly towards success?
Aside from the fact that I might just be a dumbass, one thing I've figured out is that the distance between the brain and the finger might not be so close as you'd think -- if you're not careful. I know I'm not the only trader who has a tendency to repeat the usual mistakes, or variations of same, despite having berated myself 10 times in the previous week to make an effort not to do it again. My contention is that old habits die hard. Real hard. And only if you go out of your way to kill them outright.
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superfly said:
In my view this is, in its simplest terms, because suppression of the ego, in whichever way it manifests itself in one's trading, is very hard to achieve. Indeed some people's ego leads them to believe there is nothing wrong with their ego... :cheesy: (but then it's Sat night and I'm teasing!!!)
What needs to happen is a kind of reprogramming of the mind(set)/ subconscious. There is stacks of stuff about on this subject should one choose to delve and then act.
dbphoenix
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superfly said:
Thank you. But, again, "wisdom" is no different from "knowledge" in this regard, i.e., it's still just information, though perhaps wearing a better-quality suit. For the individual, the wisdom must be internalized and implemented in order to become anything more than good intentions (e.g., do unto others . . . ). Difficulties in doing so may stem from emotional problems, the "ego" to which so many people refer, conceptual and/or perceptual difficulties, simple intelligence, or a variety of other factors.
Db
starspacer
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Because it takes a huge amount of hard work and the help of other pioneers to achieve a ‘tipping point’ in trading whereupon mastery is attained. It is an iterative process and there are few shortcuts. Even Einstein had to undertake this ‘learning curve’.superfly said:
Einstein's mother was concerned about his slow development as a child. His elementary school teachers thought that he was a foolish dreamer. His Uncle mentored him from the age of 12 and he increased his knowledge in calculus & physics. A trader would learn technical and fundamental analysis during the early stages and use a mentor to help with the psychological and financial development necessary to achieve mastery.
Eventually dropping out of high school, Einstein had to take special exams which he failed. After graduation, he couldn't get a job anywhere. In 1901, at the age of 22 he got a job at a Swiss patent office, and earned just enough money so that his parents didn't have to support him.
In 1905, Einstein examined the phenomenon discovered by Max Planck, according to which electromagnetic energy seemed to be emitted from radiating objects in quantities that were ultimately discrete. The energy of these quantities--the so-called light-quanta--was directly proportional to the frequency of the radiation. But it wasn’t until 1911 that Einstein was able to make preliminary predictions about how a ray of light from a distant star, passing near the Sun, would appear to be attracted, or bent slightly, in the direction of the Sun's mass. In 1915 he published General Relativity which was the ‘Holy Grail’ linking mass and energy.
So it had taken Einstein 24 years of dedicated work to achieve mastery. And that mastery was expressed in the simplicity of e=mc2. Trading is like this.
damianoakley
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superfly said:
Everyone trades the markets according to their beliefs.
Acquiring knowledge builds interest, but does not necessarily change those original beliefs.
You can tell a trader over and over again that they need to change certain trading habits to become successful, but unless that trader can incorporate what you are telling them into their belief system, they will not change the habits. People's minds become programmed in certain ways and it can be a difficult task re-programming.
Once people develop ideas and beliefs about something, it is very difficult to change them.
Thanks
Damian
donaldduke
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Trading has a very long positive reinforcement cycle. Often you need to do the 'good stuff' for months on end to make money.superfly said:
Most people expect to do the right thing and come out permanently ahead after 5 or 10 trades, in this business you might still be down or flat after 50 or a 100 trades even though you might have been up after the first 10 trades.
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starspacer
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[size=+0]Nearly, but not quite Socrates.SOCRATES said:Yes quite so....
E = MC2
Effiort = More Cash to you Too.
As I explained recently in post http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showpost.php?p=292368&postcount=65
“the Master attains applause by either of two opposite paths.”
In this case the opposite of E = MC2 applies equally well.
[/size]
SOCRATES
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....For mainstream consumption that is....is what I meant.....starspacer said:[size=+0]Nearly, but not quite Socrates.
As I explained recently in post http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showpost.php?p=292368&postcount=65
“the Master attains applause by either of two opposite paths.”
In this case the opposite of E = MC2 applies equally well.
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...I wholly agree with you.
