Why would anyone want to have a quant career instead of a trading one ?

[TreeTox]

My thoughts too...

The only thing I cant get - is that - why would one spend 6-7 yrs of his life to uni and phd and then U-turn into something he never been trained?

Rhetoric question

A reasonable question - I have always considered myself to be an academic, and most academics do what they do not for the money but for the love of their subject... it has to be love, as the money is absolutely cr*p whether you are a postdoc, researcher, lecturer or professor in academia. For example, in the UK, a reader/professor would be on a salary of £45-55k basic - imagine that - all that, all those years of learning up on a topic to have a barely acceptable salary (in my opinion). There are compensations in that there's "less" stress, you have more control over your time/resources and that you are at the cutting edge of a specific subject in the world of which you are an expert.

May I also add that during the time that I've done my degrees and research, though they have not been "directly" connected with finance, there has always been that underlying thrust towards finance (time-series, prediction, etc.). Plus I do do trading on the side, so am familiar with the important techniques and so on.

Ultimately, people study e.g. biology or art because they like those subjects and probably have an aptitude for them. People do trading because the bottom line is they want to make money.

 

[gooseman]

there is also the chance that you could do your cods and end up with no money at all....then 50k a year will sound appealling./...

 

[fat chance]

People do trading because the bottom line is they want to make money.

I wonder who would be expected to earn the most money over their lifetime: somebody whose first job is as a quant in an investment bank, or somebody whose first job is as a trainee trader in a prop firm. I'd bet on the quant.

 

[TreeTox]

I wonder who would be expected to earn the most money over their lifetime: somebody whose first job is as a quant in an investment bank, or somebody whose first job is as a trainee trader in a prop firm. I'd bet on the quant.

I'd bet on me.

 

[gooseman]

serious question: have you considered the possibility of not making any money prop trading? Or even posting a loss? Not having a go but (as I'm sure you know) losing money is a very real possibility.

 

[maxima]

and most academics do what they do not for the money but for the love of their subject... it has to be love

Well I agree with your point about academics and purpose of life etc.

But my point was a bit different. Irrelevant to the subject.

Whatever you have trained/studied for a good few years and then abandoning this making U-turn into something very different - look like a failure to me.

One failure likely to lead to another. Life is not endless. If one makes too many mistakes one may find himself under the bridge eventually. And then - read previous post marry goes round :innocent:

I think I need a holiday. Why do I always spot dark shadows in any picture?

Good luck to you - you gonna be the best trader ever. Send me a card after you make your first billion.

 

[maxima]

People do trading because the bottom line is they want to make money.

Actually curious remark but - people do trade because they believe they can make money. <not exactly the same you've said> everyone (except the pope and some buddhists) want money, but not everyone trades.

 

[TreeTox]

serious question: have you considered the possibility of not making any money prop trading? Or even posting a loss? Not having a go but (as I'm sure you know) losing money is a very real possibility.

In a year's or so time, I can answer your question. Sure, I am aware that the majority of prop traders make just "ok" amounts of money, others make the magical 5-6 figure numbers, a good percentage fail. This is the same in all spheres of endeavor/life.

It is all about probabilities - you just have to have the skill/aptitude to bias the wins v losses in your favour - and I will find this out. In the private trading I do with a small amount of capital, my returns are in my favour. Let's see if I can extend this.

 

[TreeTox]

Whatever you have trained/studied for a good few years and then abandoning this making U-turn into something very different - look like a failure to me.

One failure likely to lead to another. Life is not endless. If one makes too many mistakes one may find himself under the bridge eventually. And then - read previous post marry goes round :innocent:

I agree to a point - I do sometimes feel like a sell-out for abandoning an academic career. However, failure my university career was not - I have spent a decade in academia, published, written book chapters and papers, attended conferences, met smart people, written projects, done well, enjoyed my time. But people change, I need change especially in the current climate within academic research where "blue-sky" research is not rewarded but only student numbers/bums-on-seats and making profits matter.

However, I see no "u-turns" but a natural progression into something that interests me but is potentially a bit more lucrative.

Good luck to you - you gonna be the best trader ever. Send me a card after you make your first billion.

Thank you. Your words give me much needed confidence.

 

[arabianights]

From the way you post I give you a high chance of success, fwiw...

 

[maxima]

Thank you. Your words give me much needed confidence.

Thank you is too much a little cheque in future would be OK :clap:

 

[grantx]

TreeTox,

Given your background, I would guess you may find trading pretty boring - buy/sell, buy/sell. Perhaps designing systems/algos/black boxes and then trading them would be your forte.

Regardless of what you choose, you have the "quant" on which to fall back. Maybe when you've made your fortune you can return to academia and research/study for the love of it.

Grant.

 

[TreeTox]

TreeTox,

Given your background, I would guess you may find trading pretty boring - buy/sell, buy/sell. Perhaps designing systems/algos/black boxes and then trading them would be your forte.

Regardless of what you choose, you have the "quant" on which to fall back. Maybe when you've made your fortune you can return to academia and research/study for the love of it.

Grant.

Grant - you've read my mind. Indeed, when I went to the interview for this position I've just been offered, they asked me about all this stuff that I had done - why wasn't I just applying it ? The way I see it, since trading is both an art and a science, I need to get to properly understand the basics and fundamentals, all the techniques in depth at many levels within a trading environment with traders - the good human traders can and still do normally outperform automated trading systems. Once I understand how it all comes together, then I can start using my PhD work and other machine learning techniques in my own designs for automated trading. The sky's the limit.

Still, I will only be in a position to write realistically in perhaps a year's time when I've been in the business for a little while.

 

[SuperDriveGuy]

Grant - you've read my mind. Indeed, when I went to the interview for this position I've just been offered, they asked me about all this stuff that I had done - why wasn't I just applying it ? The way I see it, since trading is both an art and a science, I need to get to properly understand the basics and fundamentals, all the techniques in depth at many levels within a trading environment with traders - the good human traders can and still do normally outperform automated trading systems. Once I understand how it all comes together, then I can start using my PhD work and other machine learning techniques in my own designs for automated trading. The sky's the limit.

Still, I will only be in a position to write realistically in perhaps a year's time when I've been in the business for a little while.

Hi TT,
Progress?

 

[torel]

also curious...