Vendor Live Trades

[Lúidín]

I have been accused in the past of saying that all vendors are the same, so this is a chance for any vendor to show that what he is offering works, and is not just another shot at trying to turn over a few quick bucks.

I will suggest a few simple rules for those who wish to participate.

1. Post the live trade - market, entry, stop (if using one) and profit target (if using one).

2. Post a chart that shows the entry - whatever timeframe you like, and you need not show any proprietary info such as indicators, etc, etc.

3. Post a chart, as above, to show the outcome of the trade, along with screenshot of broker entry, exit, commission and profit / loss.

This is very basic stuff, and I have posted a few myself in another thread I started recently, which you can check as a reference if you like, but no need as the simple rules are really simple, and any person should have no problem with same.

I am interested in spread trading, so if any vendor does spread trading then go ahead, as I am keen to see a live trade example, any market/s, any method.

To keep the thread right, please do not post a live trade unless you are a vendor, you can of course join the discussions about the live trades and what the vendor has to offer.

Thx.

 

[dbphoenix]

There is no such thing as a "live trade" posted to a message board. Such posts are by definition delayed, i.e., hindsight.

Anyone seeking to find out whether or not a given vendor is legitimate will ask that he provide access to his trading screen, live, not video, or that he provide his trading plan, preferably both. If he can't or won't provide either, then he can be ignored, key word being "ignored" as those who throw away their money on illegitimate vendors have only themselves to blame, unless of course they can prove that the vendor held them at gunpoint until they turned over the fees.

Db

 

[10%Club]

Anyone seeking to find out whether or not a given vendor is legitimate will ask that he provide access to his trading screen, live, not video, or that he provide his trading plan, preferably both. If he can't or won't provide either, then he can be ignored

Db

That's a very final opinion.

You are making the erroneous assumption that any vendor of a good trading system must be trading it himself. Often this is not the case for one of two reasons. Firstly, he may simply not be a good trader and not enjoy trading (most people will still lose with a profitable system because they can't stick to the rules). Secondly, it may be too time consuming and he either makes enough from selling systems or he trades a better (or automated version) system that he doesn't want to sell.

Having the idea that a vendor who doesn't trade his own system must be a scammer means you don't understand the nature of trading. Some people are good at analysis and creating systems but not at actual trading.

Give 10 people a 100% certain profitable trading system and 9 will still lose money...

 

[dbphoenix]

That's a very final opinion.

You are making the erroneous assumption that any vendor of a good trading system must be trading it himself. Often this is not the case for one of two reasons. Firstly, he may simply not be a good trader and not enjoy trading (most people will still lose with a profitable system because they can't stick to the rules). Secondly, it may be too time consuming and he either makes enough from selling systems or he trades a better (or automated version) system that he doesn't want to sell.

Having the idea that a vendor who doesn't trade his own system must be a scammer means you don't understand the nature of trading. Some people are good at analysis and creating systems but not at actual trading.

Give 10 people a 100% certain profitable trading system and 9 will still lose money...

If one never sees the plan, how is one to know? Whether the vendor can trade or not is largely irrelevant if he can provide a thoroughly-tested and consistently-profitable trading plan. If he can't, then what is the point of the pursuit?

Db

 

[10%Club]

You can't expect a vendor to reveal the trading plan before you purchase the plan!

Pretty much all vendors offer a 7 to 60 day refund guarantee and that's enough to try it for yourself.

That said, I agree most aren't very good but to say that you either have to see their actual trades or their plan is unreasonable.

 

[tar]

Having a "profitable trading plan" and not trading it by himself but instead looking to sell it to others doesn't make sense at all , thats what they call BS .

 

[tar]

If a vendor isn't trading his so called "trading plan" then how he knew its a profitable one ? Maybe by playing on a MT4 demo account or maybe by employing some "curve fitting" techniques ie. back testing BS .

 

[dbphoenix]

You can't expect a vendor to reveal the trading plan before you purchase the plan!

Pretty much all vendors offer a 7 to 60 day refund guarantee and that's enough to try it for yourself.

That said, I agree most aren't very good but to say that you either have to see their actual trades or their plan is unreasonable.

If one has a plan to offer and a money-back guarantee, fine. But if he doesn't trade and has no plan to provide (e.g., newsletters and alert services), what is the customer paying for other than companionship?

If you believe that it is unreasonable to see their actual trades or their plan, particularly if they're asking for money, then I wish you all the best in your trading endeavors.

Db

 

[10%Club]

Having a "profitable trading plan" and not trading it by himself but instead looking to sell it to others doesn't make sense at all , thats what they call BS .

As I said, anyone who thinks this does not understand trading at all.

You may have a perfect Holy Grail trading system and still lose money because the most important thing is not the system but the mental and emotional state of the trader.

In fact, it's very clear that this is the misconception that results in the vast majority of people not being successful traders.

 

[Lúidín]

If one has a plan to offer and a money-back guarantee, fine. But if he doesn't trade and has no plan to provide (e.g., newsletters and alert services), what is the customer paying for other than companionship?

If you believe that it is unreasonable to see their actual trades or their plan, particularly if they're asking for money, then I wish you all the best in your trading endeavors.

Db

I posted this live trade in another thread..as i was posting it got filled..so i added the filled comment just before posting..or edited very shortly after posting..the rest of the trade can be seen in the posts that followed this one

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/sto...s-stocks-etfs-shares-options.html#post2674634


this is what i call posting a live trade.nif a vendor can not do this..then..in my eyes..he is either not serious about selling his stuff..he is afraid to look silly..or maybe he can't even trade!

i do not see one thing wrong with such a request..if i was selling i would be glad to post my live trades..winners and losers..as i have nothing to hide from anyone..and if i was asking someone for money..i would expect them to ask me to show them some live trades..especially some losers

 

[dbphoenix]

I posted this live trade in another thread..as i was posting it got filled..so i added the filled comment just before posting..or edited very shortly after posting..the rest of the trade can be seen in the posts that followed this one

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/sto...s-stocks-etfs-shares-options.html#post2674634


this is what i call posting a live trade.nif a vendor can not do this..then..in my eyes..he is either not serious about selling his stuff..he is afraid to look silly..or maybe he can't even trade!

i do not see one thing wrong with such a request..if i was selling i would be glad to post my live trades..winners and losers..as i have nothing to hide from anyone..and if i was asking someone for money..i would expect them to ask me to show them some live trades..especially some losers

Sorry, no. I'm sure you're honest as the day is long and equally sincere, but given the editing window, this doesn't mean much.

Again, if the vendor provides his plan or enables the customer to see his trading screen, fine. Otherwise, it's all just picks and shovels.

Db

 

[Lúidín]

As I said, anyone who thinks this does not understand trading at all.

You may have a perfect Holy Grail trading system and still lose money because the most important thing is not the system but the mental and emotional state of the trader.

In fact, it's very clear that this is the misconception that results in the vast majority of people not being successful traders.

I agree with you 1000%..the trading part is simple..and the more simple you keep it the better..but..it is your mind that will screw you up..so..a trading approach that puts very little stress on the mind..will always be better than one that puts a lot of stress

we must not forget the title of this thread

 

[Lúidín]

Sorry, no. I'm sure you're honest as the day is long and equally sincere, but given the editing window, this doesn't mean much.

Again, if the vendor provides his plan or enables the customer to see his trading screen, fine. Otherwise, it's all just picks and shovels.

Db

That is why i said the vendor must post pre and post trade chart..including broker details..this is to flush out sim traders..which is not live trading..

it really is simple..i will do some more in other thread after xmas..busy few days ahead..might not have time..but i have no problem..i will even explain how one can take a quick screenshot and post if required..and..i have no problem posting losers..have done so already in a diff thtead..

i really can't see what the issus is..if one has done a good bit of trading..then one knows that you have to have losers as well as winners..once you keep them smaller than your winners you will be fine..so nothing wrong with posting losers..in fact..i would prefer to see the vendors losing trades more than his winners..but i will ask to see both of course

 

[Lúidín]

Just to show i mean what i say..i done a few trades on DNR..a low priced stock..which i never trade..but i wanted to try this with options

my reason was..buy calls when crude drops..as DNR is crude related..but..it appears ir has got some recent downgrades. .so..in order to try and recover some of my losses..i bought nearer the money calls on recent crude drop..

i might make money..i might lose..but i know my risk..and i am willing to take it..so..i am really not bothered if i lose..but would much prefer to see DNR rallying before expiry..and i can close my long calls for a profits

this was bad trading.. as i strayed from my norm..but it is something i wanted to try..so best to get it out of my system with small risk using options

as mentioned..i have no problem showing my losers..no prob at all

i know i said vendors only to post live trades..but i feel i had to post this to try and get some vendors to post..so..go ahead..post when you are ready..and you can do very small size as you are posting on an internet forum..so keep your risk small

 

[dbphoenix]

That is why i said the vendor must post pre and post trade chart..including broker details..this is to flush out sim traders..which is not live trading..

it really is simple..i will do some more in other thread after xmas..busy few days ahead..might not have time..but i have no problem..i will even explain how one can take a quick screenshot and post if required..and..i have no problem posting losers..have done so already in a diff thtead..

i really can't see what the issus is..if one has done a good bit of trading..then one knows that you have to have losers as well as winners..once you keep them smaller than your winners you will be fine..so nothing wrong with posting losers..in fact..i would prefer to see the vendors losing trades more than his winners..but i will ask to see both of course

The issue is that you're asking for live trades, and there is no such thing on a message board. If you're interested in adding value, then ask the vendors to post the trades they're going to take, in advance, and why they're going to take them. At the very least, those who are interested might actually learn something about the trading process and not just the state of the vendor's ego. Those who care can copy out the charts and posts or take screenshots of the whole thing in case the vendor changes it. But I suspect you'll find that far fewer people care about the why than you might think. Those who obsess over this sort of thing tend to be those who've thrown away their money on some vendor or other and have yet to get over it, blaming the vendor rather than themselves (see the Boiler Room Scams thread).

Db

 

[Lúidín]

The issue is that you're asking for live trades, and there is no such thing on a message board. If you're interested in adding value, then ask the vendors to post the trades they're going to take, in advance, and why they're going to take them. At the very least, those who are interested might actually learn something about the trading process and not just the state of the vendor's ego. Those who care can copy out the charts and posts or take screenshots of the whole thing in case the vendor changes it. But I suspect you'll find that far fewer people care about the why than you might think. Those who obsess over this sort of thing tend to be those who've thrown away their money on some vendor or other and have yet to get over it, blaming the vendor rather than themselves (see the Boiler Room Scams thread).

Db

Well..to be honest..i don't see anything wrong with that..if that is how the vendor trades.

The reason I said live..with charts..is that maybe some vendors don't know in advance..as i myself do some trading this way..i watch my screen..as with recent link i posted..and if i see what i think is an opportunity..i will then act..but will have to be fast..as what i consider to be a low risk entry can disappear very quickly

so..we will let the vendor decide what way he wants to post the trades..i will ask mod to change first post later..if i am not able to edit it

 

[dbphoenix]

Well..to be honest..i don't see anything wrong with that..if that is how the vendor trades.

The reason I said live..with charts..is that maybe some vendors don't know in advance..as i myself do some trading this way..i watch my screen..as with recent link i posted..and if i see what i think is an opportunity..i will then act..but will have to be fast..as what i consider to be a low risk entry can disappear very quickly

so..we will let the vendor decide what way he wants to post the trades..i will ask mod to change first post later..if i am not able to edit it

If the vendor doesn't know what he's going to do in advance, then we've come full circle back to being able to see his trading screen. Absent that, it is, again, just picks and shovels.

This is not to say that those who post "live" trades are lying about it. But who cares? They're not vendors.

Db

 

[Lúidín]

Well..any vendor who wants..now has a chance to show what he is selling..and if he has nothing to worry about..then he should post some trades for discussion..after all..it might interest somone and get him/ her to contact vendor for more details..so..i suppose i am doing vendors a favour here

 

[Lúidín]

this is an update to my live trade post in this thread..or whatever you want to call it..

closed 10 DNR jan15 2.00 calls for 0.45

any vendor can post their trades whatever way they want..we just want to see some live trades..or open positions that you will post update to when you close the trade..win or lose

in a nutshell..this is a good sales opp for you..and i don't see any reason why you don't take it..i would if i was selling something

closed 10 DNR jan 15 2.50 calls for 0.20

 

[Lord Flasheart]

I'm afraid you wont get any takers who will post their trades as soon as they take them or in advance. I've called out many mentors and would bees many times and asked for this but none will ever take up the challenge. It is my belief that even the biggest names can not actually trade or are at least not profitable. They may be the odd one in the world whos emotions would change were they to trade live and may actually be good traders.
My biggest hates about this issue are
1) Those mentors who post on this site boasting about how many pips/pts they made on their last trade or set up etc. They are doing doing that purely as a reason to attract the unsuspecting.

2) Those who say you can be a good coach and not necessarily a good trader.Extremely unlikely in this game.

There are many more, but I'm off to enjoy my kids.