Best Thread US day traders thread.

[compoundup]

Thanks again Dave,

I'll check it out. I'm bond to say that I'm very happy with IB - cheap and pretty reliable - and eSignal charts/L2 with IB's order ticket API. eSignal is not cheap but it works well and it is a case of "better the devil you know" for me at this stage.

I think Naz uses www.directaccesselite.com but then he's a very sophisticated trader and likes to be able to use a wider range of order types than you get from the likes of IB.

Edward

 

[dvdh]

Its an old wives tale.

Java executes similar to C and C++ apps these days.

JonnyT

Then explain me why the LEVEL II screen updates every half a second instead of realtime. I mean, the executions aren't the problem, it's the LEVEL II screen. I started out with IB. And there is a BIG difference when you compare the speed. Try it out yourself I'd say.

 

[dvdh]

Edward,

I'm using eSignal too. It's works very well indeed. You can connect MB Trading with eSignal as well, and you'll get a better deal from MB for eSignal. It's all on their website. you can use the keyboard for order entry as well.

Cheers,

- Dave

 

[JonnyT]

Ah, thats nothing to do with the Java App, more that IB don't transmit the data more periodically...

JonnyT

 

[samtron]

I want to paper day trade Nasdaq but I don't want to pay fees for real time data whilst I am doing this. Delayed data will do fine. I have an account at IB and I have found a piece of software that interfaces to IB to allow for simulated trading.

Where is the best place to go for free inter-day charts and is it possible to get free Level 2 data to practice with?

 

[Naz]

Hi Samtron,

You sound like you need to go to one of the US brokerage sites that lets you have a free level 2 demo and charts for a short time.

A list of US brokers with links to their sites can be found at

http://www.daytradingstocks.com/resources/daytradingbrokers.html

Alan

 

[Naz]

By the way. NAZ, what broker do you use?

I use www.directaccesselite.com along with charts from www.Tradestation.com

I would say that some of us have very friendly discussions about the pros and cons of different brokerages and charting packages.For coaching purposes i try and keep an open mind about them all because everyone is different and what suits me would not necessary suit someone else.

For instance recently i spent a day with a US trader i know from New York who was in London and i'm checking out a brokerage he mentioned that offers direct access trades from $0.5/100 shares,which is cheaper than IB.i'm also checking out a brokerage that allows people to trade level 2 direct access with a minimum $2,000 dollars and 10/1 margin.They may not be for me but they certainly might be for others.PM or e mail me if anyone wants in depth details on these.

Alan

 

[samtron]

Then explain me why the LEVEL II screen updates every half a second instead of realtime. I mean, the executions aren't the problem, it's the LEVEL II screen. I started out with IB. And there is a BIG difference when you compare the speed. Try it out yourself I'd say.

I have read in a post on this board that the Level 2 data from IB lacks information that is a standard feature with most other Level 2 data feeds.


So even without the speed issue IB and level 2 data would not be the preferred choice?

Could someone verify that my thinking on this is correct?

 

[Mr. Charts]

I use IB as a broker using smart order routing. Fills are normally within a maximum of one second, usually instantaneous.
I attach an image of where my orders were routed on yesterday's trades.
Alan (Naz) and I have frequent chats about the merits of IB smart routing versus self routing which he prefers.
I do not use IB data feeds for either prices or level 2, but prefer the speed and reliability of esignal so I agree with dave.vdh's stated facts:
quote ......... (IB) LEVEL II screen updates every half a second instead of realtime. I mean, the executions aren't the problem, it's the LEVEL II screen. I started out with IB. And there is a BIG difference when you compare the speed........unquote
Richard

 

[samtron]

UK not allowed

Dave.
I have just checked out the mbtrading site and unfortunately UK residents are not permitted to join! (too many bouncing cheques?) so its looks as if I'll be sticking to IB, but thanks for the information anyway.

 

[dvdh]

Dave.
I have just checked out the mbtrading site and unfortunately UK residents are not permitted to join! (too many bouncing cheques?) so its looks as if I'll be sticking to IB, but thanks for the information anyway.

Ur welcome,
it´s a pity indeed. I remember. Most of the US brokers don´t accept UK residents. Too bad. Cuz I think there are a lot of potential clients in the UK.

Alan,
would you mind explaining why U prefer self routing instead of smart routing?

-Dave

 

[seguna]

I use IB as a broker using smart order routing. Fills are normally within a maximum of one second, usually instantaneous.
I attach an image of where my orders were routed on yesterday's trades.
Alan (Naz) and I have frequent chats about the merits of IB smart routing versus self routing which he prefers.
I do not use IB data feeds for either prices or level 2, but prefer the speed and reliability of esignal so I agree with dave.vdh's stated facts:
quote ......... (IB) LEVEL II screen updates every half a second instead of realtime. I mean, the executions aren't the problem, it's the LEVEL II screen. I started out with IB. And there is a BIG difference when you compare the speed........unquote
Richard

Great
We're starting to unpack some of the finer detail of Level II. This thread is throwing up all sorts of valuable information.
Long may it continue...

 

[samtron]

Belly up

With the recent REFCO saga in the headlines and bearing in mind nasdaq day-traders would need a minimum of 25k USD in their accounts what is your take on the potential risk of your broker going bust.

Is it worth diversifying the risk by say for example splitting a 50k pot with 2 separate brokers or do you think this would be just too much hassle?

 

[JonnyT]

Refco provide the highest volume to CME. i.e. Nasdaq and S&P futures. You don't need $25K to day trade futures.

JonnyT

 

[Naz]

First of all you dont need to have $25k to day trade the US.

There are different options.You can start from as little as $2000.One of the reasons i have taken the steps to bring out a new course on T2W is to give a full and frank picture of how nearly anyone can trade the US market,all the different styles, lots of set ups and the pros and cons of the different brokerages.Its at http://www.trade2win.com/store/customer/product.php?productid=16236

Alan

 

[Naz]

Alan,
would you mind explaining why U prefer self routing instead of smart routing?

-Dave

Hi Dave

In answer to your question and this is just from my own trading point of view and does not necessary suit everyone.In fact on T2W i will probably be in a minority on this point.In regard to smart order routing i'm only talking about a route specifically designated by a broker and not one set up by the trader himself within his software.

I think many that use smart order routing spend to much time looking at a chart and take their decisions based on what they see there.Where as someone who self routes has to watch the level 2 screen a lot more because thats where they will have to make the decision about executing their trade.

This means by self routing your order you not only are able to time your entries and exits with more precision but you can spot potential pitfalls that would stop you taking a trade that the chart could never point out.

Some smart order routings can give an indecision that holds a trader back on the fast moves because of the sub conscious worry about where they get filled.If they limit their trade to tight then they miss the move, to far away and they might get a bad fill.Self route and you have total control over things and a sub conscious confidence i believe helps you trade better.

So when it comes to the fast earnings announcement plays then for the self router its just another quick move and they'll relish the speed.

Like the GOOG earnings move from last week.

However smart route or self route are only very small technical things that traders will just chat about amicably in the whole scheme of Nasdaq trading, they are very small differences.Whose to say i'm right anyway.Sometimes when things are trundling along and i'm feeling lazy i could quite enjoy using a smart order.

The best smart orders though are the ones that a trader is allowed to build himself within his/her own trading platform.Making a number of routing options and hot keying them is a very good idea.I had over 20 at one time,to suit every eventuality,but then thats another story.

Alan

 

[dvdh]

Okay, that's clear. I have another question. Do you also trade NYSE stocks? I heard from a friend of mine that it's hard to get filled on the NYSE. But if a stock moves or breaks out, than the moves are huge. Could you tell me a little bit more about that?
But what I understood is that it can take up to 30 seconds and even up to a minute just to buy the offer because of the specialist? Is that true?

-Dave

 

[Naz]

Hi Dave,

The specialist can be difficult yes.I prefer to route my orders manually and pay a few cents more to get an instant fill with an ECN.

 

[Naz]

I'm very lucky to be able to use a live scanner with market commentry that does all the hard work in finding the best stocks and right moments to trade.

I attach a screen shot from yesterday which shows the alert for GOOG which then promptly traded straight up $5 (thats 500 points for any spread better) and the market commentry for RIMM which made $1.20.

When its released i'll let this thread know all about it.

 

[dvdh]

That looks really good. I think we'll all be waiting for it. It looks better than the trade-ideas.com scanner, cuz it looks like your scanner only picks $$$ movers. Is that right?