Trading ES (emini S&P) - October 2003

stoploss please

Established member
780 10
Trading the ES 20/10 to 24/10

S&R & pivot calculations for 20/10/03

S&R are obtained from the previous two days price action. This is where I think they should be. It would be good to hear if anyone has different calculations. These levels have been taken from a 15 minute time frame.



Pivot points, all obtained from a pivot point calculator.

R3 1065.50
R2 1058.75
R1 1048.25
Pivot 1041.50
S1 1031
S2 1024.25
S3 1013.75

Fib levels from low of 30/09 to high of 15/10

25% 1037.34
38.2% 1028.62
50% 1028.84
61.8% 1013.05

Other areas of interest,

Higher gap level at 1024.25. This equates to S2 obtained from the calculator.

Lower gap level at 1021

Kind regards and happy trading


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stoploss please

Established member
780 10
Morning session

My first day trading the ES without indicators. A bit of a tough one for me thus far. Made a small loss on what I thought was a break up on decent volume only to see it reverse. I closed it on my stop which was a wise move in the end. We then had a good bounce off support and the next HL signaled a further advanced. Unfortunately, the next HH has stalled a bit. Watching the tight fulcrum for further direction.


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Senior member
2,103 56
Skim, if its not too much trouble do you think you could stick one of your charts on at the end of each day with the correct ES entries placed? Understand if not but your viewpoint on each day would be immensely useful.



stoploss please

Established member
780 10
This pattern has occured alot and it seems to break up in the afternoon. However, that double top at 1052 worries me if you know what I mean.


Well-known member
458 54

Just one thing, if I may be so bold?

I noted that Skim said she doesn't "use" the floor traders pivots but knows where they are (if I recall correctly). You worked out what the numbers were and then took a long right below the pivot. Not necessarily a bad thing, but (imho) a trade looking to be scratched at the first sign of a bounce (if you took it).

For me this would be especially true given that it occurred before all nyse stocks were open and just before 10:00 time.

stoploss please

Established member
780 10
Hi sandpiper

A bit of impatience on my part. From what I can gather, pivot points are not reliable and most traders use horizontal support. The arrow points to a bar that broke beneath where I placed support then closed above it. I went long on the break above that bar. I was in profit for a mere moment then it reversed which was very rude of it. This trade felt all wrong as soon as I hit the button.

Never mind

china white

Established member
979 12
hope u don't mind me moving to ES board


I am glad there is an ES board now - i felt a bit awkward posting ES graphs on Chartman's Dow trading board..... :cheesy: Anyway, I wanted to share with u what I make out of where we r.

u may recall last week I was looking for the "ideal" case of a fake B/D from the U/T, prices falling to 1038ish level, bulls getting a bit scared, thus clearing the way for another leg up. I reckon this is exactly what's happening. The H&S (see graph) id duely completed, its bottom tested, and Spooz turned north. We'll just have to c if there is gonna b a strong day tomorrow. I haven't yet got the McClellan change for today, but I bet it's gonna b a positive minor change - which would hint at a 75% chance of positive mcclose tomorrow or on Wednesday.


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china white

Established member
979 12
day trading ES on 20-10

quite a lovely day IMO - with easy 16-18 pts in the bag. At 10:10 clear B/D of the lower T/L from Friday's lows - and then from 10:30 onwards clear hints from TICK (see graph). I personally try not to use TICK to much in the 1st hour as u haven't got the anchor pts yet.

The only tricky bit was late ND on TICK. Very tempting to reverse to short. Which wud b wrong IMO, since we had only ONE positive time frame (15:30ish) by the close, and Spooz rarely reverses in the last half an hour.


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2,325 16
The following is the 10 min ES chart for today, annotated with things which I found interesting.

Note the times of the turns - all on the o'clock or half hour.

Mondays often have a slowish start, on lower volume than other days of the week. Out of the starting gate she went sideways, so if you enter when no definite trend is in place, then just grab 1.5 points or so when it's given. Then wait and get in again.

I've posted a similar chart before - today we just bounced between a double top and double bottom until we formed an inverted h&s. Once that bottom pattern was in place, she just went whoosh! All of the subsequent 10 min bars had a higher low.

The bull trap is easy to spot - price rises above previous resistance, all the little boys playing breakouts piled in with longs, and the big boys turned her and trapped them holding their longs. It's a standard game, and just another way for the big boys to get good prices for their shorts. If you've traded breakouts, you'll know what it's like to get spanked by big boys. :cheesy: That's why those of us on the dark side don't trade breakouts.


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china white

Established member
979 12
Skim - completely right - this is where I find TICK irreplacable. It is perhaps the only indicator that filters away those fake breaks imo.

stoploss please

Established member
780 10

I have some figures for S&R


Yet again this is where I see S&R on the 15min chart. Please post if you disagree.

I have dumped pivots as do not feel they offer anything.


Well-known member
276 5
china white,
(with apologies to stoploss for talking about indicators)
I have recently been reading up on trading with the TICK, but had not seen any mention if it's use in filtering fake-outs.
I'd be grateful if you could explain the patterns/values you look for to avoid getting caught by similar situations to that shown on Skim's chart yesterday


Active member
135 1
Pivots are like everything else sometimes hey work sometimes they don`t, I find they help me to put som structure to a chart.

Today the ES tried 3 times to penetrate the pivot early on, failed and rallied 4 points.

Then the NQ tried twice to penetrate R1 failed, and everyone then dropped back down.

As with all things if you don`t like it, or it don`t " suit you sir" :D don`t use it.


stoploss please

Established member
780 10
Hi Steve

The way I see it, I have enough to think about with horizontal S&R. I find pivots are just adding another layer of confusion for me. No doubt pivots are used by other traders with success but I decided that one or the other had to go.

If you would like, why not post your daily pivots to this forum and then summarize how they performed at the end of the days trading. In this way, we can create a panoramic picture of how traders, approach the ES with different styles.

Kind regards
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