new_trader
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Ummm...fine. But how does one take advantage of compounding without any money to invest?
In answer to your question.
Here we appear to have a very young lad ,keen as mustard ,thinking about the future and at least some way along the road to being able to trade. Bit concerned about whether he's being too keen.
My suggestion to him was simple ...don't make the mistake most people make and leave your financial aspirations until too late ,don't be too timid about taking risks , take maximum advantage of the effect of compounding. Whack it hard ...means stop worrying about 'balance' ...if you're really motivated put as much effort as you are comfortable with into achieving your plans right now..any success you have will potentially be compounded in the future and unless a 69 bus knocks you down you will have ample time then to consider 'balance'.The amount of money is not relevant to his 'problem'....I assume you think compounding is only applicable to investing ? ...open an accounting text and look up "stock turn"...in this case the "stock" is capital and if he as enough to trade and can turn it quickly enough trading short TF's ..in future he may well be able to afford larger 'investments' producing more 'passively' accrued gains.
"it makes no sense" ....hopefully it is starting to.
Here we appear to have a very young lad ,keen as mustard ,thinking about the future and at least some way along the road to being able to trade. Bit concerned about whether he's being too keen.
My suggestion to him was simple ...don't make the mistake most people make and leave your financial aspirations until too late ,don't be too timid about taking risks , take maximum advantage of the effect of compounding. Whack it hard ...means stop worrying about 'balance' ...if you're really motivated put as much effort as you are comfortable with into achieving your plans right now..any success you have will potentially be compounded in the future and unless a 69 bus knocks you down you will have ample time then to consider 'balance'.The amount of money is not relevant to his 'problem'....I assume you think compounding is only applicable to investing ? ...open an accounting text and look up "stock turn"...in this case the "stock" is capital and if he as enough to trade and can turn it quickly enough trading short TF's ..in future he may well be able to afford larger 'investments' producing more 'passively' accrued gains.
"it makes no sense" ....hopefully it is starting to.
new_trader
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"I want you to explain how "..... "I want"....LOL ....
Kevin,
Put the pedal to the metal if you feel that is right for you. You'll compound more than money ..it's called experience and the younger you start the better...then you won't find yourself standing in front of a mirror chirping "I'm a pretty boy" when you should be trading.
Kevin,
Put the pedal to the metal if you feel that is right for you. You'll compound more than money ..it's called experience and the younger you start the better...then you won't find yourself standing in front of a mirror chirping "I'm a pretty boy" when you should be trading.
TheBramble
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If you have to ask the question then something is wrong. There is only need for balance when you are considering doing something you don’t want to be doing. Unless trading is a natural part of your life and your make-up, no amount of external shuffling of relational or emotional furniture is going to make any difference long term.
You don’t have to make any excuses to anyone for what you chose to do or chose not to do. If your life is trading then that’s your life. For now. Maybe for ever. All this talk of balance is as false in this context as in any other. It’s an assumption that you have some extraneous need to do ‘other’ things in order to achieve some objective and empirical sense of balance. But with what? And for whom? Who are you here for anyway?
If what you want to do doesn’t fit with what anyone else around you wants of you – tough. Or not. If you decide to relinquish even one second from your passions in order to carry out what you believe to be someone else’s needs then you are lost. There’s a great quote “There is only one success: to be able to spend your life in your own way, and not to give others absurd maddening claims upon it.” -Christopher Darlington Morley (1890-1957). And it’s never, ever worth it. What you give up is never appreciated by others to the extent it would have been appreciated by you had you continued with your own vision and doing your own stuff, your own way.
There’s a real negative connotation to the word ‘selfish’. Too much history and culture to get into just how that negativity has been developed and by whom and for what purpose, but trust me, it was not done to serve your best interests. But if you fall into the trap of feeling guilt for ‘just’ wanting to do whatever you want you need to do then simply whack yourself really hard until you stop doing that.
If you don’t get YOU sorted ahead of everyone else, you’re not going to be of much help to those that are most going to need the real you when they do need you.
Basically, do what feels right, all of the time – that’s true, Natural Balance.
“Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law” – not going to name this source for fear of taking you down a road you may not have wished to have gone, but he was on the right track.
You don’t have to make any excuses to anyone for what you chose to do or chose not to do. If your life is trading then that’s your life. For now. Maybe for ever. All this talk of balance is as false in this context as in any other. It’s an assumption that you have some extraneous need to do ‘other’ things in order to achieve some objective and empirical sense of balance. But with what? And for whom? Who are you here for anyway?
If what you want to do doesn’t fit with what anyone else around you wants of you – tough. Or not. If you decide to relinquish even one second from your passions in order to carry out what you believe to be someone else’s needs then you are lost. There’s a great quote “There is only one success: to be able to spend your life in your own way, and not to give others absurd maddening claims upon it.” -Christopher Darlington Morley (1890-1957). And it’s never, ever worth it. What you give up is never appreciated by others to the extent it would have been appreciated by you had you continued with your own vision and doing your own stuff, your own way.
There’s a real negative connotation to the word ‘selfish’. Too much history and culture to get into just how that negativity has been developed and by whom and for what purpose, but trust me, it was not done to serve your best interests. But if you fall into the trap of feeling guilt for ‘just’ wanting to do whatever you want you need to do then simply whack yourself really hard until you stop doing that.
If you don’t get YOU sorted ahead of everyone else, you’re not going to be of much help to those that are most going to need the real you when they do need you.
Basically, do what feels right, all of the time – that’s true, Natural Balance.
“Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law” – not going to name this source for fear of taking you down a road you may not have wished to have gone, but he was on the right track.
"Couldn't give a stuff about fat wods er cash, fancy watches, Mercedes Benz etc............." ...no worries ,there are a few of us to compensate for you 
(although Mercs are not on my favorites list)
More seriously do not overlook the sheer pleasure of owning/using something that exhibits the finer artistic/creative qualities that people possess ...call me materialistic ,but if push came to shove . ..the watch ,or the wife, it would be close and as the years pass the watch is holding up exceedingly well.....
(although Mercs are not on my favorites list)
More seriously do not overlook the sheer pleasure of owning/using something that exhibits the finer artistic/creative qualities that people possess ...call me materialistic ,but if push came to shove . ..the watch ,or the wife, it would be close
and as the years pass the watch is holding up exceedingly well.....
fibonelli
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Kevin21,
You should compute the average daily range on a like for like basis because you're comparing apples and pears.
Which index has the most range on average, the Nikkei 225 or the FTSE100 equivalent of the Nikkei225 being 6575 times 18049 divided by 6575?
Fibonelli
It is commonly known, that many traders are loners. If you've read the Stock Market Wizards (interviews with most successful traders and investors), you probably noticed, that almost all of them had to make some sacrifices to succeed in life. The only way that you're going to achieve your financial goals is to get serious and remain serious.
That certainly doesn't mean you shouldn't socialize, but maybe a bit less, than your peers, who have different goals (less time consuming) than you.
That certainly doesn't mean you shouldn't socialize, but maybe a bit less, than your peers, who have different goals (less time consuming) than you.
JTrader
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I know a chap aged early 40's, through playing sport. A used car salesman with fancy Mercedes, big house etc. He's a top bloke, but is known to not be too faithful to his wife .
He made me laugh a year or so ago. I said "there's nowt wrong with older women!"
He said definatively - "there is!" ............Apparently he now prefers the younger ones.
.He made me laugh a year or so ago. I said "there's nowt wrong with older women!"
He said definatively - "there is!"
............Apparently he now prefers the younger ones.Order_Entry_Clerk
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Funny thread was just thinking last night, whats the last quote l would like to hear before dying, cannot decide between Sugar #11 or Bundesanleihen ( Euro BUND .FGBL)
Kevin21
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one thing really annoys about the life style of trading all the time is the fact that i'm just sat at a desk all day. I'm quite a fit person, well not as fit as i was 6 months ago, but at the moment i don't have any time to go running, cycling or to the gym. At one point i was considering joining the marines as an officer, and around that point i was running nine miles in an hour flat and had 11% body fat. I used to be able to do around 17 lateral pull ups a couple of months ago. The other day i could only do 8 I want to free up time to get my fitness back up...
I want to free up time to get my fitness back up...
tune
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You could do some gentle training while trading if you liked. Maybe make up some in the chair isometrics, lift little dumbbells, whatever you can dream up. Do'nt have to be sat down all the time, surely. And how about another monitor running at eye level? Homemade yoga/martial art/tai chi type things, work on flexibility, posture and balance, stretching/warm up ideas, horse stance, etc. etc. Should still be able to keep one eye on the screen. Make up what suits.
tune
tune
wasp
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Get a few bits of gym equipment in your office and be thankful you don't have to go to work for someone else 8 hours a day (and commute). I echo chump here, go hard now and you'll appreciate it in the long run... Work hard and play hard and make the weekends count. We all have to work, just work smarter, not harder... IMO.
JTrader
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A few years ago, I remember reading about someone in the local press who had built up a multi-million pound business by himself. He died suddenly aged around 24.
Stories like this definately remind me that life has to come before work, and that money is not really that important, and if the worst cames to the worst, you can live on the dole like Keith Miller etc.
Stories like this definately remind me that life has to come before work, and that money is not really that important, and if the worst cames to the worst, you can live on the dole like Keith Miller etc.
Kevin21
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this weekend i'm going to go get a rowing machine, running machine and a punch bag to set up in my office. Also thinking that i've got splitter for my computer knocking about somewhere too, so if i take my lcd tv out my room and put it on the wall infront of my mini gym then i can work out in the mornings and still keep an eye on things. Cracking idea me thinks....
wasp
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I've got a bike , dumbells and a bench in my office which also backs onto the garden so I can skip also whilst still seeing the screen. In the lounge I have a laptop plugged into my home theatre setup which I did for the music stored on it, but also have charts running through the tele. Then I also have the XDA which I have a point in my bedroom for and metatrader on that plus it can go wherever I go. I very rarely spend more than 10 minutes sat at my desk at once, no need. Overkill it may sound but this is my living and I like the lifestyle it provides so.... Better than 8 hours a day in an office with daft rules and 1 hour lunch breaks!
JTrader
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I've found that improving my fitness over the last 6 months by going to the gym 3 times a week has helped improve my general well being. It's good to see the biceps grow, and the six pack slowly return , and being in the outside world for a few extra hours a week is a good thing.
With the work/life balance, for me i think the bottom line is enjoyment level. If i enjoy what i am doing, the hours of work don't seem like a chore. If i dislike what i am doing, the hours of work can be a struggle.
I think, with trading, as with any job/task in life, it is a good idea/important to focus on the positives, while trying to block-out/minimise the negatives. Otherwise, you can end up driving yourself insane .
, and being in the outside world for a few extra hours a week is a good thing.With the work/life balance, for me i think the bottom line is enjoyment level. If i enjoy what i am doing, the hours of work don't seem like a chore. If i dislike what i am doing, the hours of work can be a struggle.
I think, with trading, as with any job/task in life, it is a good idea/important to focus on the positives, while trying to block-out/minimise the negatives. Otherwise, you can end up driving yourself insane
.
firewalker99
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Hi Kevin, I feel compulsed to give a deviating opinion compared to some of the things I've read as a comment to your post.
First of all, let me say trading takes sacrifices. On different levels. It just does.
But if you wish to succeed, you need to make sacrifices. I don't think it's any different in any other endeavour. Depending how well you want to succeed, the sacrifices will be smaller or bigger.
GammaJammer commented "For gods sake you're 21 man - get some perspective." which I think is a very strong comment and actually I disagree.
I think what you are doing is commendable and it's better to do it at 21 then to do it at 35 when you're married or have kids and a mortgage to pay off. You can take the gamble, your life is only starting and if you mess up, well there are always the "classic" ways to make money and your life won't be over.
So why not put 16 hours a day in trading? Why not stare at the charts until your eyes bleed? Why not give up everything else until you know how to trade profitably and then do this intensively for a short period of time after which you back off and return to a "normal" lifestyle that leaves possibilities for a social life and much other activities.
Who am I to say your life will be less balanced over the long term if you sacrifice everything and focus on trading alone for a short period of time? Suppose you have acquired enough wealth at the age of 25 to live comfortably and continue trading 2 hours a day by putting on a single trade per day, would that be so bad?
Is it better than those chasing down a high speed career, climbing up the ladder until they reach a burn out at 40 and engage in midlife crisis?
Most importantly however is that you enjoy what you are doing. I think if you just trade for the money it will burn you out quite rapidly. If you however enjoy trading as much as I do for instance, there's no reason not to be focused and completely inspired by the game. When I come home from drinks with mates on a Friday night, I often feel the urge to have a look at the charts to see what happened that evening. I don't consider myself compulsive or obsessive, I just like what I'm doing and I am prepared to give it 200%.
Have to agree with GJ on one point though, that trading when you have a partner isn't easy. You need to have that person understand that it takes time, money and patience. A lot of patience and in the process you can lose money. If you are however already past that and have come to the point where you know how to trade profitable consistently, than I don't see a reason why those two wouldn't go together. As always, it requires you make some agreements.
But most importantly, you need to make an agreement and a promise to yourself that you keep in touch with the world out there and that trading is only a means and it shouldn't be a goal in itself.
First of all, let me say trading takes sacrifices. On different levels. It just does.
But if you wish to succeed, you need to make sacrifices. I don't think it's any different in any other endeavour. Depending how well you want to succeed, the sacrifices will be smaller or bigger.
GammaJammer commented "For gods sake you're 21 man - get some perspective." which I think is a very strong comment and actually I disagree.
I think what you are doing is commendable and it's better to do it at 21 then to do it at 35 when you're married or have kids and a mortgage to pay off. You can take the gamble, your life is only starting and if you mess up, well there are always the "classic" ways to make money and your life won't be over.
So why not put 16 hours a day in trading? Why not stare at the charts until your eyes bleed? Why not give up everything else until you know how to trade profitably and then do this intensively for a short period of time after which you back off and return to a "normal" lifestyle that leaves possibilities for a social life and much other activities.
Who am I to say your life will be less balanced over the long term if you sacrifice everything and focus on trading alone for a short period of time? Suppose you have acquired enough wealth at the age of 25 to live comfortably and continue trading 2 hours a day by putting on a single trade per day, would that be so bad?
Is it better than those chasing down a high speed career, climbing up the ladder until they reach a burn out at 40 and engage in midlife crisis?
Most importantly however is that you enjoy what you are doing. I think if you just trade for the money it will burn you out quite rapidly. If you however enjoy trading as much as I do for instance, there's no reason not to be focused and completely inspired by the game. When I come home from drinks with mates on a Friday night, I often feel the urge to have a look at the charts to see what happened that evening. I don't consider myself compulsive or obsessive, I just like what I'm doing and I am prepared to give it 200%.
Have to agree with GJ on one point though, that trading when you have a partner isn't easy. You need to have that person understand that it takes time, money and patience. A lot of patience and in the process you can lose money. If you are however already past that and have come to the point where you know how to trade profitable consistently, than I don't see a reason why those two wouldn't go together. As always, it requires you make some agreements.
But most importantly, you need to make an agreement and a promise to yourself that you keep in touch with the world out there and that trading is only a means and it shouldn't be a goal in itself.
