Sunday debate

[Devilicus]

Timsk mate you don't make money trading so why are you arguing your point so hard? Surely you're views and approach must be wrong or you would be cashing in, no?
If your arguments in this thread are purely academic or if it's some sort of quasi-regurgitation of something you read somewhere you should say so because the observations of someone who doesn't know what they are doing (as your trading record suggests) aren't really worth much.

Do you know this for certain? Its not as though he gives a daily update on how his trading is progressing, is it?

I dont know why you want Roth to stay? He may or may not make money. It's the easiest thing in the world to fake a persona on the internet.
Lets give him the benefit of the doubt:
He still would never actually help anyone become profitable. He said himself that he'd worked too hard to let anyone know the way he trades etc, so he was never going to offer anyone anything of value, and seemed to be here just to be rude all day.

 

[scose-no-doubt]

scose

The debate as it's developed is about understanding the market and the forces in play that move it. It's not about who is making money and who isn't.

I understand how a car engine works, but that doesn't necessarily make me a good driver. Conversely, I know plenty of good drivers who haven't a clue what goes on under the bonnet.

jon

I personally think that in trading, understanding should be measured by your P&L and not by how many books you've memorised. Understanding the the market and the forces in play that move it that move it and being unprofitable when you trade your view are mutually exclusive events.

Roscoe.

 

[scose-no-doubt]

Do you know this for certain? Its not as though he gives a daily update on how his trading is progressing, is it?

I dont know why you want Roth to stay? He may or may not make money. It's the easiest thing in the world to fake a persona on the internet.
Lets give him the benefit of the doubt:
He still would never actually help anyone become profitable. He said himself that he'd worked too hard to let anyone know the way he trades etc, so he was never going to offer anyone anything of value, and seemed to be here just to be rude all day.

I know roth makes money, yes and I also know that timsk can't trade because he's said so.

i want roths to stay because he's funny and he uses an approach to the market that i've yet to see anyone else use on t2w. I've nothing against the pin-bar crowd (I actually wish I could profit from it myself but I cant for reasons I've been into on other threads) but don't you think it's better to9 have a bunch of diverse approaches rather than the normal TA is everything?

 

[timsk]

Hi s-n-d,

Timsk mate you don't make money trading so why are you arguing your point so hard? Surely you're views and approach must be wrong or you would be cashing in, no?.

No, it doesn't work that way. If only it was so simple. All anyone would have to do is to have the 'correct' views (whatever they are) and then they'd make money. Besides my oficial role, like the Content Team and the Mods, I'm a regular member and am free to put forward my own views just like anyone else. Whether or not I make any money trading with the views I have doesn't affect the quality - or lack thereof - of the views themselves. An idea or belief is totally independant of anyone's ability to make money with it. There are lots of people who will agree 100% with the views expressed by N Rothchild (about the markets), but that doesn't necessarily mean they are profitable.

If your arguments in this thread are purely academic or if it's some sort of quasi-regurgitation of something you read somewhere you should say so because the observations of someone who doesn't know what they are doing (as your trading record suggests) aren't really worth much.

Allow me to explain myself and the two hats that I wear. First off, I've not published my trading record, so I don't know what you're referring to there. In any event, please don't ask me to do so, because it's immaterial to either my official role or that of my role as a normal member - for reasons which I will explain.

As 'Content Manager' I'm tasked with coming up with initiates and ideas etc. to try and improve site content going forward, and to highlight quality content from the past. Simple as that. My trading record is completely imaterial and makes no difference whatsoever in my ability - or inability - to perform this role. I'd actually go so far as to say that it's a good job that I'm not some mega successful trader like N Rothchild making squillions every week, as members might then attach greater weight to what I say which would be quite wrong for the reasons outlined above. I expect and encourage members to view what I write (as an ordinary member on threads like this) with the same scepticism as they would any other member and to question it. As I've already made plain in my last post to Roth', if they see errors in the 'official' content - then please tell me and I will correct them immediately.

Cheers,
Tim.

 

[scose-no-doubt]

Hi s-n-d,

No, it doesn't work that way. If only it was so simple. All anyone would have to do is to have the 'correct' views (whatever they are) and then they'd make money. Besides my oficial role, like the Content Team and the Mods, I'm a regular member and am free to put forward my own views just like anyone else.yes you are and i apologise for being a bit of a twit earlier in this regard Whether or not I make any money trading with the views I have doesn't affect the quality - or lack thereof - of the views themselves. An idea or belief is totally independant of anyone's ability to make money with it. This is what is wrong with T2W IMOThere are lots of people who will agree 100% with the views expressed by N Rothchild (about the markets), but that doesn't necessarily mean they are profitable.




Allow me to explain myself and the two hats that I wear. First off, I've not published my trading record, so I don't know what you're referring to there. Just stop it Timsk. Lol.In any event, please don't ask me to do so, because it's immaterial to either my official role or that of my role as a normal member - for reasons which I will explain.

As 'Content Manager' I'm tasked with coming up with initiates and ideas etc. to try and improve site content going forward, and to highlight quality content from the past. Simple as that. My trading record is completely imaterial and makes no difference whatsoever in my ability - or inability - to perform this role. I'd actually go so far as to say that it's a good job that I'm not some mega successful trader like N Rothchild making squillions every week, as members might then attach greater weight to what I say which would be quite wrong for the reasons outlined above. I expect and encourage members to view what I write (as an ordinary member on threads like this) with the same scepticism as they would any other member and to question it. As I've already made plain in my last post to Roth', if they see errors in the 'official' content - then please tell me and I will correct them immediately.

Cheers,
Tim.

Cheers

Roscoe.

 

[barjon]

I personally think that in trading, understanding should be measured by your P&L and not by how many books you've memorised. Understanding the the market and the forces in play that move it that move it and being unprofitable when you trade your view are mutually exclusive events.

Roscoe.

scose

Oh, yes. The better understanding you have of the market, the better equipped your are as a trader and the better chance you have of being a profitable one. Understanding does not equal profit, though.

jon

 

[scose-no-doubt]

scose

Oh, yes. The better understanding you have of the market, the better equipped your are as a trader and the better chance you have of being a profitable one. Understanding does not equal profit, though.

jon

No trading your view = profit or loss, which is why I view the P&L as the be all and end all of trader know how.

I think we're on different pages here. When I say understanding I mean proper practical implementable understanding as opposed to theoretical/academics.

 

[barjon]

scose

I don't think we're on a different page - different paragraph, maybe

Better understanding enables you to develop a better strategy and its the application of that strategy that determines your profitabilty.

To take a ludicrous example. Let's say you understand (wrongly) that the market is driven by the phases of the moon so you develop a strategy based on entering long at each quarter phase. Would you give it much chance of success (clever money management notwithstanding )?

jon

 

[scose-no-doubt]

True

 

[counter_violent]

I blame Jon for bringing the subject up in the first place.

 

[arabianights]

scose

I don't think we're on a different page - different paragraph, maybe

Better understanding enables you to develop a better strategy and its the application of that strategy that determines your profitabilty.

To take a ludicrous example. Let's say you understand (wrongly) that the market is driven by the phases of the moon so you develop a strategy based on entering long at each quarter phase. Would you give it much chance of success (clever money management notwithstanding )?

jon

I would give it >95% chance of success over a 30 year horizon.

NEXT!

(Note: This reply has lots of implications if one thinks about it)

 

[Waterfield]

First off, I've not published my trading record, so I don't know what you're referring to there. In any event, please don't ask me to do so, because it's immaterial to either my official role or that of my role as a normal member - for reasons which I will explain.

Pretty sure people made assumptions from this post:

I left full time employment at the end of Oct’ 2007 to become a full time day trader of U.S. equities. I went ‘live’ with real money in April this year and, since then, I have done over 1,000 trades. I’ve had profitable days, profitable weeks and, even, two months where I made a gross profit and one (but only one) in which I made a small net profit. However, there’s no escaping the fact that the equity curve is in the twenty past four zone. Hard as it is, I have to face facts and accept the unpalatable truth that I’m flogging a dead horse. I can do okay in a competition trading virtual paper money and I can ‘talk the talk’, but the plain fact of the matter is that I can’t ‘walk the walk’ with real money.

Rather than suffer the ignominy of losing all my capital through a death by a thousand cuts, I’ve decided that enough is enough and to cease day trading as career from today. There’s sufficient capital left in my account to put towards re-training or starting a ‘conventional’ business. (Any ideas on that front gratefully received). My wonderful and long suffering wife has been the only bread winner since I left full time employment and it’s only fair to her – and important to our marriage as well as to my own self esteem – that I do something that generates some income. And soon!

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/gen...-timsk-throws-towel-but-clings-facecloth.html

 

[redart]

that was from 2008. He's made other posts since then.

 

[redart]

Guess he's not still married then.

haha, I dont know.

I believe he is trading. He's not the sort to gloat if he was doing really well. Who knows. I hope he is.

I think the post you quoted could have come from any of the so called gurus here, really. But then, most would never admit it.

 

[timsk]

Thank you redart - you're quite correct!

I've not traded US equities since 2008. Lots of water under the bridge since then and let me quickly check - yep, still a band on the wedding finger!
Tim.

 

[barjon]

Pretty sure people made assumptions from this post:



http://www.trade2win.com/boards/gen...-timsk-throws-towel-but-clings-facecloth.html

Waterfield

Yeah, there's plenty of water gone under the bridge since then. Tim's a modest fellow and I hope he won't mind me letting on that he turns a decent penny or two nowadays.

jon

 

[Shakone]

Out of the game for 2 years. Geez, I feel out of touch if I haven't traded or looked at a chart for two weeks!

Good for you though Timsk, there are many important thigns in life, and it is a brave decision, to give up.

 

[MrGecko]

Thank you redart - you're quite correct!

I've not traded US equities since 2008. Lots of water under the bridge since then and let me quickly check - yep, still a band on the wedding finger!
Tim.

Tim you're full of sh!t.

It's a Civil Partnership.

 

[timsk]

Out of the game for 2 years. Geez, I feel out of touch if I haven't traded or looked at a chart for two weeks!

Good for you though Timsk, there are many important thigns in life, and it is a brave decision, to give up.

Hi Shakone,
Thanks for the kind words although a misunderstanding has crept in somewhere. I've certainly NOT given up, I've merely switched from U.S. equities to index futures - hence the wisdom and great insight I've displayed on the subject in this thread! (Roth' - that was a joke in case you're still reading this!)
:cheesy:

 

[William Waller]

Goodness me! That Rothschild really was extremely rude.