Sunday Debate: age vs experience

[barjon]

Well last week's Sunday Debate was a dead duck, so let's see if a more lighthearted one can get you going.

If it takes so many years of learning and experience to become a proficient trader why are the City trading floors full of twenty-somethings rather than senior citizens?

jon

 

[wackypete2]

Us "senior citizens" trade remotely. The 20-somethings are mostly in trading arcades to get rich quick, but usually learn a hard lesson. No disrespect meant to those who prop trade successfully.

Peter

 

[DionysusToast]

It does not take years of learning & experience to become a proficient trader.

From what I know of trading firms in the US, they will go out & look for smart graduates, take on a lot of them and whittle the group down until those with the most promise are left. These people are put with others that can walk the walk. I don't think that every intern at a trading firm becomes profitable.

On the other hand, your average punter that goes out & buys trading books written by people that can't trade and reads trading sites full of guru's that can't trade WILL spend a lot of time before they realise the poor quality of what they are reading. Some never realise this and just go to more & more sites/books until they burn out.

For those that cut through the BS, I guess some people can find their own way and others (like me) will need someone to show them how it's done in the real world. I have had 2 people help me out, both were people I spoke to in depth and were people who were making money trading. Both have are people I keep in touch with and are people I can fire questions at and get answers without being sent an invoice. It cost me a little over $3k for the training. If I'd done this from the start, I'd have been profitable in 6 months quite easily.

On the other hand, I did also spend something like $3k on a course from a complete con man I came across on this site and quickly realised he couldn't trade himself. Hence due dilligince is a must.

Finding your own way is not easy but it would probably be easier if you hadn't had your head filled with nonsense in the first place.

I often wonder how someone would get on if they simply sat themselves down in front of the S&P with absolutely no preconceptions or knowledge of TA or the markets. I would guess if they just watched it & observed, they'd probably come up with some idea of how that market behaved faster than someone with a bunch of TA in their heads.

 

[Splitlink]

You know what they say? There's no fool like an old fool.

 

[gedward3]

You know what they say? There's no fool like an old fool.

I'd say the older guys would have more risk control and discipline than the
younger guys but the younger guys would take more risk and either
blow up and do something else or make a few million because of
their risk taking.

GED

 

[Martinghoul]

Well last week's Sunday Debate was a dead duck, so let's see if a more lighthearted one can get you going.

If it takes so many years of learning and experience to become a proficient trader why are the City trading floors full of twenty-somethings rather than senior citizens?

jon

Firstly, a large number of those 20-somethings in the City are, in fact, learning. Secondly, I know it's hard to believe, but some of these people actually know that their primary function (if they work for a bank) is not to trade prop, but to provide liquidity and take the flows. That's a difficult job to do really well (which is why experienced flow traders are worth their weight in gold), but it's quite easy to do it well enough. That's why these young 'uns do OK for themselves. Prop is an entirely different kettle of fish.

 

[Splitlink]

I'd say the older guys would have more risk control and discipline than the
younger guys but the younger guys would take more risk and either
blow up and do something else or make a few million because of
their risk taking.

GED

I think that that is true, but some of us old ones have enough for ourselves and want to do something for our kids. Ours have had a good growing-up period and are established, but I'd like to leave them more, they deserve it. That makes me take on risk when, otherwise, I would not need to. Therefore, I took on risk with pension money when I still had other income. That risk has converted into a separate capital base which has, in its turn, become a steady earner.

If anyone needs advice from me, I should say,

1. Don't be ashamed of trading 50p per point, that's how I started.

2. Spreadbetting firms are getting more ethical than they used to be, because they have to be. Competition has made them and I think that they will get better.

3. Start trading with income coming in, never with capital in the bank and nothing coming in.

I see people, every month, opening businesses with compensation money from unemployment. If that is not taking on big risk, I don't know what is!

 

[gedward3]

I think that that is true, but some of us old ones have enough for ourselves and want to do something for our kids. Ours have had a good growing-up period and are established, but I'd like to leave them more, they deserve it. That makes me take on risk when, otherwise, I would not need to. Therefore, I took on risk with pension money when I still had other income. That risk has converted into a separate capital base which has, in its turn, become a steady earner.

3. Start trading with income coming in, never with capital in the bank and nothing coming in.

My problem is the opposite as i have enough savings to jump ship and try to trade full
time but also work and can pull a good wage so do a little SB and DMA but having just relocated to HK and at pains to try and go full time.

The advantage is that finishing work i then have time to trade the US market opening.

Well done on giving your kids a little more but im sure if you got them the right education and schooling they will finf their own way in life.

Forget the term but i thinj you need to go SKI-ing.

Spending Kids Inheritance as im sure you've give them a good start....

 

[Splitlink]

I think that that is true, but some of us old ones have enough for ourselves and want to do something for our kids. Ours have had a good growing-up period and are established, but I'd like to leave them more, they deserve it. That makes me take on risk when, otherwise, I would not need to. Therefore, I took on risk with pension money when I still had other income. That risk has converted into a separate capital base which has, in its turn, become a steady earner.

3. Start trading with income coming in, never with capital in the bank and nothing coming in.

My problem is the opposite as i have enough savings to jump ship and try to trade full
time but also work and can pull a good wage so do a little SB and DMA but having just relocated to HK and at pains to try and go full time.

The advantage is that finishing work i then have time to trade the US market opening.

Well done on giving your kids a little more but im sure if you got them the right education and schooling they will finf their own way in life.

Forget the term but i thinj you need to go SKI-ing.

Spending Kids Inheritance as im sure you've give them a good start....

There comes a time when you don't want to go skiing. One of my pastimes is trading. Any money that is made will get spent, one way or another, that's for sure.

 

[wackypete2]

There comes a time when you don't want to go skiing. One of my pastimes is trading. Any money that is made will get spent, one way or another, that's for sure.

That's my wife's job :cheesy:

Peter