Multicharts Lifetime License - for Sale

Software vendors would like you to believe that, but when asked about the 'first-sale doctrine' back down because they know they are on a 'sticky wicket'!
 
Nazrudin said:
Software vendors would like you to believe that, but when asked about the 'first-sale doctrine' back down because they know they are on a 'sticky wicket'!
Click to expand...

You might be able to pull that stunt in the U.S. with a physical copy,
bit different when its digital distribution and you are reliant
on vendor for online key authorisation.

Point is, who cares, its not worth the aggro to save what amounts to chump change.
Probably the same people that think piracy is OK and all software vendors
should work for free :rolleyes:
If the company don't get revenue, they go bust = no more updates or support.

Then you have the issue of potential dual access to account details,
as original and new owner both have login details until changed.
Its retarded, you wouldn't try and sell a leased car, so how is selling
leased software is supposed to be OK?
Way too many potential problems just to save a couple of hundred at best...
 
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Liquid validity said:
You might be able to pull that stunt in the U.S. with a physical copy,

Its not a stunt - its to do with ethics and consumer rights. The principle of being able to resell a product that you own to somebody else is protected by the First Sale Doctrine. The law on digital software is still very new and it is likely that first sale rights will be upheld to let companies such as Amazon benefit from customers reselling their ebooks.

If you are reliant on vendor for online key authorisation, you can come to an agreement for the purchaser to use your online key authorisation. It requires a degree of trust, but you can write an email as a legally binding agreement between the vendor and purchaser.

It is up to each person who wishes to sell their softyware (perhaps they are no longer trading), especially if the sale is worth a few hundred dollars or more.

"..amounts to chump change. "

chump - a foolish or easily deceived person.

Maybe I am a chump? Maybe you are a very successful and wealthy person. But who are you to suggest that someone is foolish if they wish to sell their software?

Probably the same people that think piracy is OK - really, just because you want to sell an item you bought, you are likely to agree with piracy?

and all software vendors should work for free - no, they should make a good profit, but our consumer rights also need to be respected

:rolleyes: - tut tut!

If the company don't get revenue, they go bust = no more updates or support. - I doubt very much if they will go bust if customers sell on their genuine copies of a piece of software.

Then you have the issue of potential dual access to account details,
as original and new owner both have login details until changed. Simple - the new owner changes the login details, username, password, email, address

Its retarded, you wouldn't try and sell a leased car, so how is selling
leased software is supposed to be OK? Who's retarded? Me or you? If the software is leased then it should clearly say so. If it is a sale and yet it says 'lease' in the small print then a have no loyalty to this company.

At the end of the lease the car is usually yours for peanuts and you can then sell it. With a piece of trading software it should be the same

Way too many potential problems just to save a couple of hundred at best... - my buyer disagrees! He got a good price and I am happy. What's it got to do with you anyway?!!
Click to expand...
 
Its against the agreement you sign up to.
Its also a security risk for both parties.
All that for a few quid...
Not worth the hassle or risk, simple as that.
 
A lifetime license is $1497 - is that "a few quid", or "chump change" - you are sounding like a software vendor! You guys be really worried to be trawling 2 year old forums!
 
Nazrudin said:
A lifetime license is $1497 - is that "a few quid", or "chump change" - you are sounding like a software vendor! You guys be really worried to be trawling 2 year old forums!
Click to expand...



No I'm not a vendor, or a muppet either...
It was raised as a recent post.
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foyer/81142-multicharts-lifetime-license-sale.html#post2255844

Simple fact is if 1500 USD is a large amount to you,
tends to suggest under capitalisation.
Also if you couldn't recoup 1500 USD by using the software to trade,
probably shouldn't have bought it in the first place...

Either way, I don't particularly care what you think.
I'm warning others that buy licenses, they take the risk of
violating of the agreement, and potential termination.
You as a seller take no risk, the buyer does - that of license termination.
No to mention the insanity of using financial software
that someone else potentially has access to.

Its retarded, if you can't afford the tools, go back to square one.
End of.

If anyone wants a cheap and legit license for charting software,
Sierra is the cheapest I know of:
http://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=doc/Packages.php#Table

Better than Multi as well imo, although I prefer Ninja to either of them.
 
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Liquid validity said:
No I'm not a vendor, or a muppet either...
It was raised as a recent post.
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foyer/81142-multicharts-lifetime-license-sale.html#post2255844

Simple fact is if 1500 USD is a large amount to you,
tends to suggest under capitalisation.
Also if you couldn't recoup 1500 USD by using the software to trade,
probably shouldn't have bought it in the first place...

Either way, I don't particularly care what you think.
I'm warning others that buy licenses, they take the risk of
violating of the agreement, and potential termination.
You as a seller take no risk, the buyer does - that of license termination.
No to mention the insanity of using financial software
that someone else potentially has access to.

Its retarded, if you can't afford the tools, go back to square one.
End of.

If anyone wants a cheap and legit license for charting software,
Sierra is the cheapest I know of:
http://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=doc/Packages.php#Table

Better than Multi as well imo, although I prefer Ninja to either of them.
Click to expand...

Interesting, I didn't know that Sierra had adapted a FIX bridge for LMAX, looks like they don't use emulated stops either as some patchy FIX solutions do. Amazed LMAX didn't advertise this, no skin off their nose. I think Sierra is well up there as a discretionary trader.

I'd say Multi is purely an optimisation engine and probably the best at that when it comes to multi signal, single instrument strats, with pretty good automated tools (though the standard live to strat sync library is lacking big time). The discretionary is meh. They even tried to make the DOM too pretty over genuine functionality.

Ninja is good at everything, though sometimes pipped by other charting tools that specialise in something it is good at, but not great at.
 
Risk is discounted in the agreed selling price. The small print cannot remove consumer rights (however much the vendor would like it to) and these rights are still being debated and will continue to be tested in court. My experience is that vendors know that this is a grey area and when pushed will allow a transfer of user / owner.

I am amused at your presumption to tell people what they should or shouldn't do. Why do you need to show how successful you are and how $1,500 is nothing to a man of your great means. If you don't care what we think, why do you need to impress us with your success?
 
Nazrudin said:
Risk is discounted in the agreed selling price. The small print cannot remove consumer rights (however much the vendor would like it to) and these rights are still being debated and will continue to be tested in court. My experience is that vendors know that this is a grey area and when pushed will allow a transfer of user / owner.

I am amused at your presumption to tell people what they should or shouldn't do. Why do you need to show how successful you are and how $1,500 is nothing to a man of your great means. If you don't care what we think, why do you need to impress us with your success?
Click to expand...

Totally missed the point.
If 1500 USD is too much to layout or lose,
you seriously think that is a sound starting point for trading?
Its under capitalisation, simple as that.

The handover of login when both parties know the login isn't worth the
risk, the buyer has no comebacks if it goes wrong.

Sierra starts at 20 USD a month so its a vacuous argument at best.
There is no need to buy a second hand license.
Last post on this pointless topic.
 
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random12345 said:
Interesting, I didn't know that Sierra had adapted a FIX bridge for LMAX, looks like they don't use emulated stops either as some patchy FIX solutions do. Amazed LMAX didn't advertise this, no skin off their nose. I think Sierra is well up there as a discretionary trader.

I'd say Multi is purely an optimisation engine and probably the best at that when it comes to multi signal, single instrument strats, with pretty good automated tools (though the standard live to strat sync library is lacking big time). The discretionary is meh. They even tried to make the DOM too pretty over genuine functionality.

Ninja is good at everything, though sometimes pipped by other charting tools that specialise in something it is good at, but not great at.
Click to expand...

Yeah the Sierra / LMAX bridge has been around a while now.
Downside for programming is C++ in Sierra (unless you already know it).
Probably the best low priced front end going though, not to far behind
Ninjas ATM features, if at all.
 
I think you've completely missed my point. If you can afford a new license at 1500 USD then a second hand one at a fraction of that price is not much of a risk, especially as we are talking about access to a charting package, not a brokerage account. If you have already decided that this is the software package you need then a second hand one might well be a bargain depending upon your attitude to risk and the price you negotiated to reflect it.

'Undercapitalisation' is a also a subjective term and is a personal choice about risk. If you want to trade with £1,000 then you can still keep to 1 or 2% risk per trade by using micro lots or spreadbetting with IG Index starting at 10p a pip. Gann recommended placing 10% of your capital on each trade! It depends on how tight your stop is and how successful your trading method is.
 
Nazrudin said:
I think you've completely missed my point. If you can afford a new license at 1500 USD then a second hand one at a fraction of that price is not much of a risk, especially as we are talking about access to a charting package, not a brokerage account. If you have already decided that this is the software package you need then a second hand one might well be a bargain depending upon your attitude to risk and the price you negotiated to reflect it.

'Undercapitalisation' is a also a subjective term and is a personal choice about risk. If you want to trade with £1,000 then you can still keep to 1 or 2% risk per trade by using micro lots or spreadbetting with IG Index starting at 10p a pip. Gann recommended placing 10% of your capital on each trade! It depends on how tight your stop is and how successful your trading method is.
Click to expand...

No its not a subjective term, a bankroll of 1000 GBP is a waste of time.
Spending 600-1500 USD on software with a 1000 GBP bankroll is retarded,
same as 10% risk per trade (I don't care who said it).

What I find even more bizarre is why you persist with an argument when
you sold your MC license 4 years ago:
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foyer/81142-multicharts-lifetime-license-sale.html#post995014
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foyer/81142-multicharts-lifetime-license-sale.html#post2025616

Yet you turn up here banging the drum when someone else is selling a license:
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foyer/81142-multicharts-lifetime-license-sale.html#post2255844

Maybe that isn't so odd looking at your post history and activities though...
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foyer/81140-tradeguider-rt-software-cds-sale.html#post995004
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foyer/83274-tradeguider-rt-software-cds-sale.html#post1017812
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foyer/100062-omnitrader-pro-10-visual-trader-4-0-a.html#post1200384
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foy...-time-license-dashboard-sale.html#post1281086
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foyer/41742-tradeguider-sale-4.html#post2197288
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foy...get-use-swap-forex-data-feed.html#post1764326

Thats quite a lot of software you've advertised for sale, and thats just here.
Someone less generous might start to think you are selling keygen
cracks or something, not that I'm suggesting you are, because that would
be dumb wouldn't it :)

So why exactly do you care when you have already sold your MC license?
Why so defensive about selling licenses?
Why have you sold so much software?
None of my business though really, I'm sure you could explain it all
to the police if the need arose :)
 
Liquid validity said:
No its not a subjective term, a bankroll of 1000 GBP is a waste of time.
Click to expand...
Liquid validity said:
Many people have started with a sum like this and have become very successful traders. It's not the starting amount that's important, its the pips per trade and money management.

Spending 600-1500 USD on software with a 1000 GBP bankroll is retarded,

Yes, I agree, nobody suggested that would be a good thing to do, I don't know why you made that one up? There's plenty of good free charting software if you only have £1,000

same as 10% risk per trade (I don't care who said it).

I wouldn't do it, but it is 'horses for courses' and my point is that some people have done it successfully.

What I find even more bizarre is why you persist with an argument when
you sold your MC license 4 years ago:

Strange logic - what has selling it 4 years ago got to do with an opinion about resale of software??

Yet you turn up here banging the drum when someone else is selling a license:


I simply contradicted your opinion. It feels as if we are both banging a drum?

Maybe that isn't so odd looking at your post history and activities though...

Oh, because I sold my software I am not entitled to an opinion about selling software??

Thats quite a lot of software you've advertised for sale, and thats just here.
Someone less generous might start to think you are selling keygen
cracks or something, not that I'm suggesting you are, because that would
be dumb wouldn't it :)

Really, because I sell several pieces of software it must be stolen? I think you had better ring 999 and explain your powers of deduction.

So why exactly do you care when you have already sold your MC license?
Why so defensive about selling licenses?

I guess its because you seem unable to accept another point of view.

Why have you sold so much software?

I no longer needed it!

None of my business though really, I'm sure you could explain it all
to the police if the need arose :)

That's a big accusation! I seem to have touched a nerve, eh?

I was overcapitalised when I started trading. You might also be shocked to learn how much I spent on books and courses. It was all part of my long journey to get to where I am now!

I am still of the opinion that first doctrine rights will apply to software, even if it is downloaded and the small print calls it a license. This area of consumer law is still being tested. In the near future I believe that it will apply to most digital products. That's just my opinion and I may be wrong! I'm sorry if that upsets you. Maybe we can just agree to differ??
Click to expand...
 
Doesn't matter what you say, in most cases, selling software
is against the EULA, end of.
http://www.pcworld.com/article/249396/top_eula_gotchas_website_fine_print_hall_of_shame.html

Nazrudin said:
I was overcapitalised when I started trading. You might also be shocked to learn how much I spent on books and courses. It was all part of my long journey to get to where I am now!
Click to expand...

So you were overcapitalised when you started, yet still listed software
for sale here for £250 only 4 months ago - do me a favour...
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/foyer/41742-tradeguider-sale-4.html#post2197288

Nazrudin said:
I am still of the opinion that first doctrine rights will apply to software, even if it is downloaded and the small print calls it a license. This area of consumer law is still being tested. In the near future I believe that it will apply to most digital products. That's just my opinion and I may be wrong! I'm sorry if that upsets you. Maybe we can just agree to differ??
Click to expand...
More likely software will be accessed remotely over the net, due to
the issues that people like you create.
Thats the whole point, even you admit this area of law is still being tested.
So why risk ending up as a test case.

That really is my last on this, anyone reading this can make up their own minds.
If they are still stupid enough to break the T&C's of the EULA just to save
a couple of quid, and risk their security at login hand over, more fool them.
 
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