Keeping track of deltas

[Profitaker]

There was no sarcasm, actual or implied. BigB actually made a worthwhile contribution, so did Mr.Pitscum with his last post. What's your contribution ?

Have you ever had a look at how the open interest is distributed in a particular option series ? The statistic is that 30% of options expire worthless, nothing to do with a strikes.

Why do you want me to stop posting ?

If that's the general concensus I'l p!ss off, no skin off my nose.

 

[Pitscum]

back seat bullsh++? please dont bullsh++.

you have so much to teach people looking to enter options trading. you are living proof of why money exists taking opposite posns to people like you.

fundamentally, the options you sold this expiry that increased from 9.5 to in excess of 24 have given someone who trades a great p/l out there. as already stated, your punting style is rabbit in headlights; if you thought 9 was a good sale, why werent you battering the 24's???

i think its pretty easy to guess why you didnt, simply because you didnt have the money to do it. instead you were looking for another broker who didnt 'punish' short premium players.

this is an important lesson for any newbie looking in who wants to understand how options work.

as with your trading style, you are not aware when you are wrong in what you write and thats great as your lack of knowledge also entices others to look for knowledge so they don't end up like you....a punter. not sure if you have realised but this board is for t-r-a-d-e-r-s???????? that also rules out furniture that considers cows who commute on trains...oh yes

ah also suggest as well as options lessons you consider english lessons too?? hmmmm

 

[Bigbusiness]

back seat bullsh++? please dont bullsh++.

you have so much to teach people looking to enter options trading. you are living proof of why money exists taking opposite posns to people like you.

fundamentally, the options you sold this expiry that increased from 9.5 to in excess of 24 have given someone who trades a great p/l out there. as already stated, your punting style is rabbit in headlights; if you thought 9 was a good sale, why werent you battering the 24's???

i think its pretty easy to guess why you didnt, simply because you didnt have the money to do it. instead you were looking for another broker who didnt 'punish' short premium players.

this is an important lesson for any newbie looking in who wants to understand how options work.

as with your trading style, you are not aware when you are wrong in what you write and thats great as your lack of knowledge also entices others to look for knowledge so they don't end up like you....a punter. not sure if you have realised but this board is for t-r-a-d-e-r-s???????? that also rules out furniture that considers cows who commute on trains...oh yes

ah also suggest as well as options lessons you consider english lessons too?? hmmmm

So what is the correlation between good english and being a profitable trader? There are rich traders who can hardly write a sentence. Perhaps you can provide a link with the statistics to back your arguement.

 

[garethb]

Gareth,

1.Thanks for your comments and i'm glad to hear you have learn't load's from my options posts. [your comments]

2. You dont know all the trades i do in options cause i dont have the time to list them all on this forum . To date all the trades that i listed on this forum have shown profits. But i dont tell people when to exit a winnig trade! Why? cause the exit timing could be premature and could generate more income for the trader. Likewise i dont normally tell people when i exit a winning trade.

3. As for ELN and BIIB they both were tiped by me and both went on to show good profits! as long as the trader exited the trade when it was in profit!
If however the trader is greedy and decides to hold positions for more profits thats his decision NOT mine and if he loses his profits for holding too long thats his problem NOT mine. Its NOT wise for me to show exotic trades as the majority of viewers would NOT understand them and run the risk of doing them wrong! its for this reason i kept my trades on Plain vannilla options. Perhaps when you have time you will point out the losing trades that i tipped to the viewers? I would also like to see it too.

4. I think i will take your advice and CRAWL away cause i have been contiplating it for the last few weeks anyway! :cheesy: So plz dont feel guilty In fact you done me a favour.

Plz dont feel I'm offended by your post! in fact it has speeded my decision to take a back seat and do fewer posts or Just become a lurker and see whats going on! :cheesy: and i TRUELLY hope that those TWO brilliant traders [ Pitscum and Profitaker ] remain on this forum cause they have so much to offer. :cheesy:

ELN and BIIB thread:
http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showthread.php?t=14949

So long folks and happy trading.

Bull

Bull

Thanks for posting the link that I couldn't be bothered to search for. People can now easily see how many posts we get from you when you think you have been clever.

So all your posted trades are profitable? In this case I could be bothered to find the post since I know you will not.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showthread.php?t=12875&page=16&pp=10

You bought July 55 Calls at 75 on 2nd March. Did you exit at a profit? If so when? If so why did we not get to hear of your success endlessly at the time like we did a month later?

In fact I know you lost money on this one as 75 was the highest the Ask reached that day LOL. The Bid never got there not that day, week, month or ever in fact it was down at 25 3 days later. The Option Writers really shafted you there! But never mind, thats not my point. All traders have losing trades. But a poster who just wishes to bang on about winners and ignore losers and is not prepared to discuss trading warts and all is no use to anyone on this forum.




Best Regards

Gareth

 

[bulldozer]

Bull

Thanks for posting the link that I couldn't be bothered to search for. People can now easily see how many posts we get from you when you think you have been clever.

So all your posted trades are profitable? In this case I could be bothered to find the post since I know you will not.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showthread.php?t=12875&page=16&pp=10

You bought July 55 Calls at 75 on 2nd March. Did you exit at a profit? If so when? If so why did we not get to hear of your success endlessly at the time like we did a month later?

In fact I know you lost money on this one as 75 was the highest the Ask reached that day LOL. The Bid never got there not that day, week, month or ever in fact it was down at 25 3 days later. The Option Writers really shafted you there! But never mind, thats not my point. All traders have losing trades. But a poster who just wishes to bang on about winners and ignore losers and is not prepared to discuss trading warts and all is no use to anyone on this forum.




Best Regards

Gareth

Gareth,

Yes! that was a losing trade as A BUYER !! If i had WRITTEN it would have shown a profit like you quite rightly said! This just goes to prove THE POINT that WRITERS HAVE THE EDGE!! because OPTIONS are a WAISTING ASSET!

I said there is NOT ONE WRITTEN TRADE THAT HAS SHOWN A LOSS!

IF you read my posts more clearly you will see that i said I ALWAYS SHIFT A LOOSING TRADE TO ANOTHER PLAYER OR CLOSE TRADE COMPLETELLY!

NOW ,would you like to show the winning trades and see if the loosing trades are bigger than the winners?

Also i said in my posts that I'M A WRITER OF OPTIONS MAINLY!! and i do some times BUY options as a PUNT or speculation trades!!

Rgds
Bull

 

[bulldozer]

Gareth,

You claim that your a trader then you would know that BIOGEN and ELAN dropped more than 50 % in value! because of just ONE failled drug. So it made sense to me as a trader to BUY THE CALLS [using some of the profits from writing index options] incase the stock bounced UP! :cheesy: Infact they did bounce up and i did make frofits from the LOWER CALL STRIKES!!!
So my friend read the whole chapters of a book before making comments? it may help you get a better understanding!

Bull

 

[garethb]

Bulldozer

Good so you admit you are a punter. You PUNT on options.

As anyone who can read can see you said - all trades you list were profitable not all trades you write.

Yes the stocks gapped down hugely so a move up was one of the possibilities. As a stock trader my view was that relative stagnation was likely since there was a big impact on these companies revenues from the withdrawal of the drug not to mention liability risk. A knowledgeable options trader would have seen that IV in BIIB was at record levels so buying DOTM was an odd choice. Still, losing 65% of premium in 3 days on an Call with nearly 5 months to expiry requires a special kind of expertise but not perhaps expertise an Options forum desperately needs

You say that overall you MADE MONEY BUYING OPTIONS on BIIB and ELN at various strikes. Now you are really confusing me I thought your whole argument on this thread was Buyers Lose and Writers Win.

You have promised several times to stop posting and we are all waiting. I understand that you will need to reply to this post, that is fair. I have made my point now and promise not to respond to you if your reply is polite and relevant so you can depart finally as you wish to do.

Best Regards to you Bulldozer and I hope you continue to have a successful trading career.

 

[bulldozer]

Bulldozer

Good so you admit you are a punter. You PUNT on options.

As anyone who can read can see you said - all trades you list were profitable not all trades you write.

Yes the stocks gapped down hugely so a move up was one of the possibilities. As a stock trader my view was that relative stagnation was likely since there was a big impact on these companies revenues from the withdrawal of the drug not to mention liability risk. A knowledgeable options trader would have seen that IV in BIIB was at record levels so buying DOTM was an odd choice. Still, losing 65% of premium in 3 days on an Call with nearly 5 months to expiry requires a special kind of expertise but not perhaps expertise an Options forum desperately needs

You say that overall you MADE MONEY BUYING OPTIONS on BIIB and ELN at various strikes. Now you are really confusing me I thought your whole argument on this thread was Buyers Lose and Writers Win.

You have promised several times to stop posting and we are all waiting. I understand that you will need to reply to this post, that is fair. I have made my point now and promise not to respond to you if your reply is polite and relevant so you can depart finally as you wish to do.

Best Regards to you Bulldozer and I hope you continue to have a successful trading career.

Gareth,

You dont understand to good what I'm saying or perhaps i'm not to good at explaining.
I'll try again so you can get it through that brain of yours!

1. I mainly WRITE index options and RECIEVE PREMIUMS from the buyers! [you can call it TRADING or PUNT or whatever you like]

2. I sometimes BUY OPTIONS in the hope the stock goes in my favour. When buying OPTIONS you CANT LOOSE more than the amount paid for those options. i dont call that a PUNT cause my loss potential is LIMITED to the premiums paid! The gains could be HUGE. You may call that a PUNT if you want? thats fine with me.

3. The WRITTEN NOV's 5075 PUTS are now showing 4 points and heading for ZERO VALUE to the buyer. [i'm the reciever/writer]

4. The DEC's 5025 PUTS are now showing 11 points and heading for ZERO VALUE to the buyer. [ I'm the reciever/writer]
You can call these trades [3 and 4] PUNTS or whatever you like? I like to call it something else! Can i hedge these trades? thats my concern not yours.

Happy trading

Bull

 

[bulldozer]

Your quote>"You say that overall you MADE MONEY BUYING OPTIONS on BIIB and ELN at various strikes. Now you are really confusing me I thought your whole argument on this thread was Buyers Lose and Writers Win."

ARE YOU STILL CONFUSED? :cheesy:

i'LL TRY TO EXPLAIN IN SIMPLE TERM SO YOUR BRAIN CAN GRASP WHAT OTHERS CAN UNDERSTAND :cheesy: If a stock goes down heavily 50 % or more in 48 hours [like in the case of BIOGEN and ELAN] i would like to buy CALLS incase there is a bounce! These oppotunities DONT happen every week/month . its called panic selling and the stock goes down and the bargain hunters move in! I'm also a bargain hunter TOO!! NOT JUST A SELLER OF INDEX OPTIONS. Do i sell/write stock options? the answer is NO I DONT! I WILL NEVER SELL GOOG OPTIONS [ do you hear me Mr frugi] or any other stock options! why? cause its not my style to write american style options. I write ONLY european style options! why? thats my concern not yours!.
Still confused Gareth? dont worry too much it will be a lot clearer when you have read more books or read more of Pitscum/Profitaker posts

BYE BYE and happy trading

Bull

 

[Profitaker]

Gareth

Thanks for your support.

One thing I have learnt in this forum is that there is no point in arguing with cloth ears above, partly because he will argue just for the sake of it (he needs to get a life) and partly because he has no clue.

Just look at the dross he's written above - he has no idea that when a stock goes down "50 % or more in 48 hours" IV goes ballistic, so what does he do (?) he buys volatility LOL.

Honestly, he has no clue, and I mean NO clue. So he isn't worth the effort IMHO.

 

[SOCRATES]

Yes, you lot can rant and rave as much as you like, but Bully must be laughing all the way to the bank with the Nov and Dec puts he has written.

And what tickles me pink is that he does not reveal his methods to any of you.

This is because a niche is a niche.

Good Luck to you Bully, Very Well Done Indeed !

 

[Bigbusiness]

Yes, you lot can rant and rave as much as you like, but Bully must be laughing all the way to the bank with the Nov and Dec puts he has written.

And what tickles me pink is that he does not reveal his methods to any of you.

This is because a niche is a niche.

Good Luck to you Bully, Very Well Done Indeed !

For once, I agree with you

 

[bulldozer]

Bull,

All that writing and still no book?

This might be up your street

GOOG Mar 2006 350 puts are currently on sale for $18.30.

In the interests of fun and possibly charity, might you be able to offer me a BETTER price, kind sir, say perhaps a round $18 for ease of calculation? :?: :?: ... if so I would like to buy one from you. :-0 Premium at a discount, if you like.

I can send monies by Paypal for your convenience and my satisfaction (say a 1/100th of full size, or I might be accused of taking this seriously )

They've got Property of Bull written all over them, I'd say: they're well out of the money AND drenched with lashings of lovely time value to decay - at whose expense? MY expense, of course. :cheesy: :cheesy: $18 of fat juicy premium, straight into your pocket. Consider it a donation to a charity of your choice.

Please good Bull, don't pass up this SUPERB opportunity for you to offload a delightful wasting asset onto another SILLY blind mouse. Remember I gamble in vega, eat gamma with pineapple and watch plays in the theta ... a sitting duck, or is that wodent?

PS :cheesy: This isn't in any way a challenge I merely saw a chance to use the excellent Bulldozer price improver market-making service and seized it with my sharp teeth. :

PPS Though it probably sounds churlish, I must reserve the right to sell it back to you at any time before expiry (at market bid price minus the original discount), if by any scintilla of an iota of a minuscule chance it becomes worth more than I paid you for it :cheesy: :cheesy: In turn I will donate the original premium + 20% of any profit to charity.

What say you?

Frugi,
I was hoping you make contact? but you decided wisely not to!

Goog went up by $13 since you posted the above. Had i taken your offer i would have milked $400 of you! on just ONE contract. The March 350 is now showing $14. and the stock closed at $390.43 :cheesy: Writer WINS again. Plz give the offering to "The children in need" like you promised, and remember the LORD loves a chearfull giver! plz DONT send the 400 bucks to me! make your donation to > http://www.bbc.co.uk/pudsey/faqs/

Last Trade: 390.43 at the close
Trade Time: 4:00PM ET
Change: +4.48 (+1.16%)
Prev Close: 385.95
Open: 389.90


I now go on to answer your post more fully.
1. I dont WRITE american style options.[ Not my style]
2. I like to choose the strike of options and NOT chosen for me by the BUYERS.
3. I like to take FULL control of the Options i WRITE! meaning i decide when to get out of trade and NOT decided for me by the BUYER.
4. Buying options is for Novices! so plz go on buying we the writers dont like to complain and just LOVE those that keep handing money over to us.
5. i ONLY write dotm.and like i said i ONLY WRITE EUROPEAN style!
6. Finally GOOG will trade under 230 bucks within 2 years But first it will go above 410 bucks Who says so? The MALTESE BULL SAID SO!! thats who!

Its been good knowing you! and i hope you'll be a great help to the others on Options. Plz dont reply as I'm cutting down my posts on this forum!

A quick reminder for Mr Pitscum and Profitaker! The Novs 5075 are now at just 2 pts and the Dec's are at 7pts. :cheesy:

ITS BYE BYE and best wishes from the
Maltese Bull and HAPPY XMAS!! To all :cheesy: Now i can go in peace! [know what i mean Mr Gareth? :cheesy: ]

It is said the facts ALWAYS spk louder than words :cheesy: I hope your NOT going to errase this post now are you? :cheesy:

 

[Profitaker]

Goog went up by $13 since you posted the above. Had i taken your offer i would have milked $400 of you! on just ONE contract. The March 350 is now showing $14. and the stock closed at $390.43 :cheesy: Writer WINS again.

What about the Call writers ? Did those writers win again ?

 

[bulldozer]

What about the Call writers ? Did those writers win again ?

Mr Copout,

I cant spk for other call writers. They may not be as smart as me and know how to hedge SHORT CALLS :cheesy:

Plz dont post to me as i feel i'm obliged to make reply to your silly point/comments and also that you MAY NOT be to confortable with a good /smart reply??! :cheesy:

Maltese Bull

Wise monkeys always stay clear of the Maltese BULL but some just keep coming back for more HORNS treatment :cheesy:

 

[Profitaker]

They may not be as smart as me and know how to hedge SHORT CALLS :cheesy:

Are you for real ???

Plz dont post to me as i feel i'm obliged to make reply that your NOT to confortable with??

I thought I woludn't have to. Didn't you say you were going ?

Let me summarise how GOOG played out in the options trading world that you aspire to...

Put writers made a profit
Put buyers made a loss
Call writers made a loss
Call buyers made a profit

Who had the edge and why ?

 

[Profitaker]

Let me summarise how GOOG played out in the options trading world that you aspire to...

Put writers made a profit
Put buyers made a loss
Call writers made a loss
Call buyers made a profit

Who had the edge and why ?

Let me help you here, Put writers and Call buyers both made a profit. In hindsight was it better to have written Puts or bought Calls ?

And why ?

 

[bulldozer]

Let me help you here, Put writers and Call buyers both made a profit. In hindsight was it better to have written Puts or bought Calls ?

And why ?

Go away fruit cake!!
:cheesy:

If the stock did NOT go up The PUT seller WINS and the CALL buyer loses!! :cheesy:
If stock moves DOWN or moves SIDEWAYS the call buyer LOSSES! and Put seller WINS!! " 2 to 1 against the CALL buyer and 2 to 1 IN FAVOUR of the PUT SELLER!!

The MARCH 350 PUT WRITER is a winner if stock goes UP or if stock moves side ways!! 2 to 1 IN FAVOUR of the PUT writer you moron!! Plz dont post to me! cause your making yourself look more and more silly by the hour!!

And the 350 March put is heading for a massive fall cause the price is heading for ZERO and in xmas Mr Frugi will be lossing over $1000 bucks to the Put seller!! and by March it will be at ZERO!!

Time will tell :cheesy: :cheesy:

The Maltese Bull

 

[Profitaker]

Let me summarise how GOOG played out in the options trading world that you aspire to...

I was discussing the actual event of the GOOG underlying rising and it's effect on option traders, rather than the what if scenario of standing still, which you seek to twist it in to.

Clearly that's beyond you, again.

So.... till the next time.

 

[bulldozer]

I was discussing the actual event of the GOOG underlying rising and it's effect on option traders, rather than the what if scenario of standing still, which you seek to twist it in to.

Clearly that's beyond you, again.

So.... till the next time.

Mr Profitloooser, Mr Copout,

1. There is NO "IF AND BUTS" Mr Frugi was NOT discussing CALLS he was discussing PUTS!
so why are you discussing CALLS?

2. You are the one who is using "IF AND BUTS" when you say if it was calls it would be in profits. :cheesy: YES GOOG WENT UP!!! Mr frugi option position was ON PUTS AND HE ALSO EXPECTED GOOG TO GO DOWN!! :cheesy:

3. Your trying to prove the imposible>> THAT THE BUYERS HAVE THE EDGE and its not working!! cause the facts are there in your FACE!! Mr frugi BOUGHT NOT SOLD/WROTE and he paid $1,800 to the WRITER!! and he is loosing at present 400 bucks! :cheesy: thats facts!! NO IF's and BUTS!!

4. THIS is the most important bit of all!! The bet and POST by Mr Frugi was BETWEEN HIM AND ME and YOU WAS NOT INCLUDED in the discussions!! Perhaps its because we both thought your NOT important? But you had to get your nose in the situation and now its been kicked by the MALTESE BULL!! :cheesy:

5. Mr Frugi plz THINK next time before you put a chalenge to the Maltese Bull. God says in the good book Malachi chapter 3 vrs 8 [last book in old testament] that you must honour your offerings to the charity! cause if you dont? he will put a curse on you!! and plz also remember GOD does NO LIE!! [ Titus chapter ONE] He says what he means!! and HE MEANS what he say's!! That 400 bucks is no longer yours it belongs to GOD/charity and you do well to honour your oath and your offering!! No one can rob GOD unpunished!

Now watch your holding [put position] dwindle leading to xmas and to ZERO value in MARCH!!

I would like to say good luck! but loosers luck does NOT change!! it always stays the same!!

Maltese Bull

Somethings in life never changes! the winners are always winners and the loosers stay loosers. :cheesy: Is that not correct Mr Profitaker/Mr profit looser/Mr Copout.? :cheesy: